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  1. Post on Is this game P2W? in General

    By HardBass, posted
    If this game is P2W, then it should go F2P as well, P2W and B2P is bad for business, Just my opinion. I might give it a try if it was f2p, I tired to play Russian servers but they had method to prevent me from playing even when I used vpn.
    This game looks absolutely beautiful, expect I heard that there is some popping issues, but it doesn't matter that much to me.
  2. By now I am sure you guys have been flooded with similar posts. But hopefully that shows you that we are trying to communicate with you.
    It's so sad that a company's greed for more money makes them ignore their customers. I hope this game will survive and that not too many people will quit, because I do really love this game. However, if you say that our feedback is important to you then when we say something and you go against us that's just wrong. 
    I think you should have held a poll and advertised it in-game and so that people would participate in the forums and you would have then had a decisive answer from your customers. I have spent so much money on this game and on the cash shop to basically have it thrown in my face like an insult.
    Not very happy with you Kakao, not happy at all. At least now I know that I won't receive a reply or anything to this. I am not even expecting a forum post, because why should a company have to explain why they are changing their business model to its customers?? Right? I mean it's not like they are buying the product and spending more money. It's ok there are new players that will buy into it.
  3. Post on I called it.. in General

    By Inurbane, posted
     
     

  4. Post on Credit Card Warriors in General

    By MobyX, posted
    WTB value pack, Edan server please
    Min. price, don't be stingy
  5. Post on Dead Desert Online? in General

    By ChickAndWin, posted
    @PM_Jouska GG on your communication bruh! You pretend to care about your community feedback... yet.... you do introduce the cash shop changes despite the MONUMENTAL BIG CHUNK of reactions from your players on this topic WITHOUT ANY WORDS. In other words, you just proved it: you.don't.care. Whatever we say/think, you at Kakao, previously Daum EU, soon Nothing at all, just do whatever you want.
    I am not spending any more time on this forum since it is just useless. Enjoy your game looking more and more dead.
     
    Welcome to Dead Desert Online
  6. Post on No P2W - Petition in General

    By Veil Khaos, posted
    https://www.change.org/p/daum-games-stop-daum-games-from-changing-blackdesertonline-to-pay-to-win-model-with-cash-shop-items-being-listed-on-the-market?recruiter=582463844&utm_source=petitions_share&utm_medium=copylink
  7. the 7 day Kamasilve's Blessing says it gives Energy Recovery +2, I am still only getting +1 energy every 3 minutes. I have looked at it tick for 9 minutes and only gained 3 energy. Please fix this.
  8. DO NOT follow through with implementing being able to sell cash shop items for in game silver.

    I have played MMOs and games for a long time and I have seen firsthand the drastic downfall of them due to devs or publishers not listening to the customer outcries. I have seen many protests before and after changes in game itself and witness first hand the HUGE drops in game population with an inability for those games to recover EVER again.There are developers and publishers that will never be able to recover from the mark that stains their name in going against the community wishes.

    The last time I saw such a massive protest within the game itself was about a decade ago in Runescape. The world was full to the brim of people on multiple accounts crying out to stop the changes that would be implemented. The changes happened and the population was annihilated. The game has never been able to recover since. A few years later the change was reverted but it was too late.
    I am seeing the same within BDO. This is by far the most anger and protest I have ever seen. 
    If you follow through with this you will see a huge player exodus. You will see the Daum/Kakao name tarnished and scorned by Westerners; not only for the pure greed but for the lies and deceit too. People don't forget.
    And while there may be severely differing views of the incoming change, there is one view that makes more sense than the other. LEAVE THINGS AS THEY ARE.

    EDIT: I have no issues with it myself. I am merely stating an observation based upon past experiences.
  9. Post on Fault in the Premise in General

    By 2Cents, posted
    There have been a lot of good videos and writings about the recent changes with BDO.  It's sometimes easier in a video because they can more easily express the situation and provide details that would take pages of text to explain.
    One thing did become crystal clear after going through them.  While some things are opinion based such as "what constitutes pay to win" other things are simple fact or fiction.  This is where Daum made a critical error.
    The premise from the post:
    This changes where necessary to allow players access to content they otherwise may not be able to obtain.
    A simple examination of this and many points that where made lead to only 1 conclusion.  The statement is false, fraudulent, misleading, misinformed.
    This can be proven very simply, as it was in many of the video rants.
    Evidence: The developers control and dictate the content of the game.  They chose to create items outside of the game content and then claim they need to sell them so you can have access. They could have easily made them obtainable inside the game.
    Evidence: Many games allow you to obtain Cash Shop currencies while playing the game.  Some of the other suggestions have been quests, rare drops, events etc.
    Verdict: The obvious conclusion knowing these facts is they "chose" to do this for financial reasons.  The problem is their description seems a little less than fully truthful about the situation.
    Ramifications: When the heart of the game is a grind fest that is intended to reward players for investing their time, a cash shop pay2win model can essentially destroy the entire basis of the game.  While it may work for a few, the better method as proven by games like POE is to create a great product and let the customers support it by buying cosmetic and non essential items.
    The cash shop progression:  Rappelz is great example to follow of how not to do things.  In it's infancy it didn't sell OP items or run non stop promotions.  What happened over time was a shift from content to marketing.  Updates became "sales" instead of content and new items where not created to be in game, but cash shop only.
    BDO could do this with crystals very easily.  Valencia 8.0!  New cash shop crystals that are 10x stronger than what you find in game.  If you don't think that's a possible direction for the game, you may be naive to the gaming market.  It's been done 100x's already.  The problem is they need to continually sell something better, something stronger.  When 30% exp gets old it becomes 50, then 80,100,150,200.  The entire focus and point of the game can change.
    I hope this isn't where BDO is headed, but it looks like it might be a possibility.  It's a great game I hope it doesn't.
  10. I'm sure no one will take this seriously as I don't post on the forums that much. I don't really remember the last time I signed in to the forums, much less posted... 
    However, it annoys me to observe seemingly mindless blithering over an issue but no substantive solutions presented. This thread, I guess, is my effort at brainstorming a possible solution.
    As of now, there are only a few things that are lucidly absent of speculation: Daum/Kakao/PA have said they will introduce the selling of pearl shop items into the market place and that they have done so to foster accessibility for players who cannot spend money in the pearl shop for one reason or another. 
    Given these statements, my idea would eliminate any P2W accusations:
    Simply convert the money players spend on pearl shop items on the market place to loyalties (or some new monetary system that is not interchangeable with pearls in any way). 
    This effectively eliminates the concern of players assuming some insurmountable advantage given to those who decide to spend money in the pearl shop since loyalties offer minute advantages similar to the prexisiting pearl shop items (before this furor about P2W).
    This also achieves daum's two aims perfectly. Plus, they still earn money since people cannot reconvert loyalties into pearls. 
    Please feel free to point out any glaring issues I may have missed when evaluating the plausibility of this!
    Thanks for reading.
  11. So there are two third-rail issues in the game right now- P2W and PvP. What if we simply combine them?
    Everyone who sells a Cash shop costume is flagged for PvP for a month per item sold. 
    Win/Win.
     
  12. Hello I come to you asking for help as my younger brother went out and bought the game, he owns a mac. 
    Now I know the game is not made for MAC however I have heard there are mac users out there,
    Would someone with this knowledge share it?
     
    thanks 
  13. Post on Counter to P2W in General

    By GreenBeanDemon, posted
    I choose a 1,500 pearl item for now as this is more in line with other monthly fees for online games and it allows room for some incentives like cosmetic items or access to dyes etc for players. 
     
    I will pledge to buy one 1,500 pearl item, ideally an altered value pack ( no 30% marketplace for example) per month for Two Years if they do not add more paid influence* on our game world as of 8/9/2016. I pledge to cease buying this item if more paid influence items are added. 
    Daum
    How many pledges would your powers that be require, to be interested in not proceeding with the announced changes and future changes that add more paid influence* into our world? Surely there is a number and surely we can work out something IF we can produce numbers that are desirable?
    _______________________________________________________

    *Paid Influence
    Here this term is being defined as paying for any alteration to game play other than a cosmetic** one or downgrading an item to become only cosmetic. This includes additional character stats, movement speed enhancements, death penalty mitigation, experience increases for examples. 
    **Cosmetic
    superficial measures to make something appear better,more attractive, or more impressive.  Examples are changing the color or reflective properties of something in the game world. 
    ________________________________________________________
    /\ Basically we as players agree to buy something in a certain amount every month to make it more interesting to keep these changes out than in. We get a product we want and they get nice happy share holders. Has to be a solution here somewhere, maybe we can find it going down this road.  
  14. So this is my one singular attempt at educating people here. I will not be making replies to trolls and will not be promoting ignorance in any way.
    @PM_Jouska
    @CM_Aethon
    First we begin with a minor history lesson. I work in construction and I am pretty tired right now so some things may not be said with the perfect clarity that I wish of it but I am sure that you will be able to at the very least understand the point. I will use no fancy formatting or highlights, this is a simple address to anyone with a mind of their own. Again trolls and little children can remove themselves from this thread as I have not the time for any of it. My oldest will be going to MIT so I have done my job in parenting, I do not wish to do your parents job as well.
    Source: I have been playing online games now for over two decades, thats from the early 90s. I began early on with games such as UO and Quake1 and have played just about everything produced in NA/JP/CN/KR since then, much of it a huge waste of time but thats what games are for us. Jobs for the creators, entertainment for us and this needs to be clearly understood. I have been playing NA BDO for just over one month (started way late), I have an account net worth of >1.2billion silver and 400gscore. I am on Orwen/NA, have been having a blast with BDO and will continue to do so for so long as its servers stay alive.
    Pay to Win, or P2W. This term is being used in every circle of gaming these days and I literally just saw a post of someone stating that it is not a defined term and out of countless posts on that thread nobody stated the truth behind this. P2W is a very clear cut defined term that began many years ago. The very words 'pay to win' are as clear as it can be. The fact that people still say there is no line there is what has driven me to this point. Generally speaking I hold my peace and let what will be, be. As it is, and I have said, I am making one attempt here and one only. I only hope that some will read this and come away with knowledge and help to make a louder voice from truth than the knee jerk reaction of the current loudest general audience in gaming; the self entitled kid.
    Pay to win, as I said is a term that began many years ago. You may open your google/bing/choice browser and search for yourselves and what you will find then is that this term was applied to games during the early years of 'cash shops' that promoted the sale of god tier weapons and armor for real world money. These items were so vastly superior, in most cases even compared to the 'end game' gear attainable in game that if you wished to PvP, or even PvE to a large extent, you had no choice but to buy these items. Its as simple as that.
    Cash shops in general, as well as free to play games were a byproduct of this as it was seen that some things were 'ok' to sell for real money and some were not. This was influenced by peoples perception and the way they reacted to it. Game developers saw a trend beginning and many would-be entertainment makers jumped on board as the money made from these 'micro transactions' or 'cash shops' was more than they would make from the game sales themselves. Keep in mind most games used to be bought in the form of CDs or even waay back the good ol cartridge. This is how we got 'free to play' games in general and the resulting garbage from game developers ever since. People liked the idea of getting games for free, and paying only for what they wanted.
    I know that every real gamer out there can relate to this; spending countless hours on youtube and browser searches for the next 'great' game. Looking endlessly forward to something worth playing. Our expectations have risen to a crescendo over the years as have the 'self entitled' audience. People now -expect- to receive these games for free, and to play them for free indefinitely. This is the very vicious cycle we have created as a gaming community that allows garbage to flood the internet, games and clones of games and clones of those clones that are all indefinitely trash. Little effort into making the game, little into promoting it and even less into maintaining it. It is this mentality that sponsored and allowed to flourish the lack of vision and effort in game developers. This problem has been further enhanced with the ever growing crowd of underaged or simply immature gamers. IE; Self entitlement audience.
    Games used to be for kids. That is not so much the case anymore. The gaming community is comprised now of more 'older generation' gamers than ever before, and that is a direct result of when gaming actually began. It is unfortunate that the loudest and most heard of the gaming community is the immature, irresponsible kids and trolls yet I feel that it is far past time for those of us that are able to comprehend the consequences of our actions to be heard. It is a necessity, a responsibility that we must step up to or I fear that gaming in general, as a whole will turn from bad to non existent in value and worth.
    Here are the facts; we love games. We love to play games and we all but demand these games be entertainment that is up to our standards. We ensure that this can never happen by allowing the games we love to be driven to extinction or worse by self entitled kids and people with absolutely no understanding of the value of our time, money or jobs. Most of the people I have seen spearheading these cries of p2w have obviously never had any mouth to feed but their grubby own. They never had to work for a living, and anyone that believes youtube is a job has even less foundation in reality than the games we play. Your homes wont be built, your cars wont run and the roads wont be repaired by youtube. If you want entertainment, if you want GOOD games that are enjoyable and fun then it is high time to start acting in a way that promotes this in the developers. We are products of our actions as much as the games are a direct result of our voice as gamers. We act, they react. Not -we speak they do-. If you want quality games, be prepared to pay for them. If you want free to play the sad truth is that you aren't wanted by game developers, needed for the promotion of quality standards or in my opinion even welcome in any game that I enjoy. Developers wont say this outright but you are a useless waste of server space save only for adding a head count to their number, which by mockery of our desires is another demand we have on the developers; it has to be popular/high population.
    We will pay $60usd for a PS4 game and spend maybe, stretching it maybe 100 hours on something like final fantasy etc. and thats a huge value. Yet we spend $40 on BDO and spend thousands of hours. What kind of drugs are people on these days to be so ludicrous as to complain over the cash shop which YOU DON'T HAVE TO SPEND A DIME ON yet get 10x or far more entertainment hours out of a game you enjoy? And barring all this, people still brag about WoW yet you must purchase the game, pay a subscription to even log in every month AND buy each and every expansion? AND they have a cash shop too. Even sells T-Shirts.
    For anyone high enough to imagine they should be given an online game in its future entirety from one small initial purchase, grow up. The sooner the better because when real life smacks you in the mouth you may never recover. BDO has given us every expansion for free. They now even give daily log in rewards and they compensate your sorry worthless hides every time they get DDOS or have -omg- extended maintenance. Self entitled, spoiled and useless the lot of you. Honestly you should be ashamed in more ways than one. Worse to those that promote this type of ignorance.
    Oh yeah, 30 60 or 90 days worth of value pack for everyone that bought the game in its various packs as more compensation available to your account via the website, for free.
    Other games which I will not even bother mentioning are still praised, have higher player bases (one even more so than WoW) and allows buying and selling of its subscription on the market as well. Games that require a subscription to even log in. Perception is flawed here. Google some knowledge if you really do not know.
    The very fact that BDO allows you to log in every day, use their bandwidth and tax their servers (which they just upgraded too) without requiring a subscription is not enough for the self entitled. They also demand lower prices for outfits that they either A cannot afford/justify or B cannot talk their parents into affording. B needs to GTFO. I look forward to the day that BDO allows the sales of cash shop items on the player driven market because not only is it absolutely not pay to win (which I will delve into further momentarily) but it will also allow people of the A category above to now purchase these luxury items from within the game. Some could even say this combats pay to win as it allows equal access now to every aspect of the game. Many will see this come to pass and realize that now the billions of silver they have saved up can now be spent on value packs and outfits for their alts without spending even more real money to continue to keep BDO in development and pay its creators to continue this game because others that have the money to spare will do it for them.
    Delving on in as promised; There are many people in BDO with billions of silver with no decrease in sight, gaining passively every day more silver with nothing to spend it on. You argue that selling cash shop items on the market is 'P2W', the rally cry of ignorance is all I hear. People that have played this game since day 1 and work its mechanics properly will never be broke and never see a want for silver. This truth is marked by several distinct points which can be seen in KR even now, and they have had this 'p2w' model since the start.
    One thing to understand is silver doesn't win you anything. Most people even in KR do not have PEN gear, VERY few do. Much less will you even find TET/PEN boss gear on the market anytime in the foreseeable future unless someone extremely high tier quits or their account is hacked. To assume the disposable income crowd will buy all their boss gear and be gods of BDO is asinine at worse and woefully ignorant at best. And beyond that, what people spend irl vs what they can sell the purchased cash item for on the market will not make up for having to grind contribution points, knowledge for energy and most importantly levels. Very few level 60s and even fewer +60 in KR who have had this game much longer than us and I mean come on, they're Korean! The disparity between a level 55 and a level 60 in combat points alone is greater than the perceived differences most of you seem to believe exists in much of the gear. I am not going to expand more on this one point as there are far too many facets to thoroughly cover but I will say that of equal skill level players and passive 'hidden' stats gained from each character level earned you simply do not 'buy' your way to victory in BDO. Not going to happen and I hope many try so the developers get paid and continue releasing these wonderfully Free expansions.
    BDO is pay to be lazy. Pay to advance -up to a point- quicker. Pay for convenience even but it is in absolutely no way pay to win. Silver in BDO in any amount is never going to win your fights, nor even guarantee you upgrade your gear cause RNG is king, and even that does not bother me as I enjoy the game as it is. You may beat the dog out of someone who started the same time as you, has equal skill level but progressed slower in some regards because you 'bought some silver' but you will likely still never catch up to the top tier players and even if you do it will still require a large amount of skill to win your battles against those that know how to play.
    Investing large amounts of contribution and energy in the right places will net you far more silver far quicker than anything you would like to do in the cash shop, and to the Nth degree if they put a cap on the number of items you can sell in any given time. Simply playing the game will advance you in every regard far quicker than attempting to use real world money versus those that put in their hours correctly.
    We as gamers have a responsibility placed on us by the sheer fact that our words have weight concerning a games development. Companies are obviously afraid of the pay to win title and made even worse by social media such as youtube. People that will drive a game straight to its death and lulz whilst moving on to the next because they simply do not care and feel no reason to be invested. The self entitled need to have their teeth knocked out in more ways than one. If my kids ever acted half as spoiled rotten as many of the 25 and under gamers out there they would all be in dentures. Well not quite but they would certainly have their computers removed from their rooms and not be getting their own cars etc. We must stop rewarding this behavior, and none too soon before things become fatally worse. I am not speaking of BDO exclusively.
    There used to be a saying, you get what you pay for. This is still true. If you want Nike or Jordans it will cost more than well I don't know many brands of shoe I wear Wolverine etc. but you can get the idea looking at a fully restored GTO or Chevelle vs a Kia.
    I am not saying I completely agree with everything BDO has done or its prices in the cash shop but I can say with confidence it was caused by the players not the makers of the game. They will sell what we are willing to buy and are not at fault here. The biggest problem here is that BDO in my personal opinion is the best MMO to be released in more years than I can count. Many games out there have done well and avoided the pay to win title, but look at those games vs BDO, currently I see a lot of Kia's and one Chevelle. This game is beautiful and is loaded with content and everyone that has avoided looking for these perceived 'p2w' signs have thousands of hours logged and loads of fun. Even those that are shouting P2W have similar or greater hours. The fallacy of the logic here is beyond astounding.
    I do not wish to see this game ruined by self entitled people causing developers to make rash decisions as has happened so often recently.
    As I said in the beginning this is my one singular attempt at making a rational plea to the gaming community concerned with BDO and the future of Online, feature rich Interactive games. We need to hastily squelch the battle cry of the self entitled audience or suffer the consequences for years to come as it has been for the most recent years with potentially far worse on the way. Knowledge is power, and ignorance is not bliss. It will be my greatest hope that game developers/publishers find their way to this page and know that not everyone is so blind. I sincerely applaud anyone that wishes to take this torch and attempt to make a difference in the right direction. There is even a well known youtuber calling for a boycott of BDO, and he doesn't even play it anymore. I have not the patience nor self restraint for these types of people that want everything for nothing, as the only thing they truly deserve comes in steel toe.
     
  15. I think this update is inevitable so lets try to hone in what the price of the costumes should be on the AH.
    If we go by the price of dye, it should be about 15-17 million. 
  16. Post on Pay to Play in General

    By ownermantank, posted
    Anyone else here think that a pay to play structure with in game accessibility to cash shop items would be a platform than the current free to play and the upcoming pay 2 win. I barely play any f2p because shit like this always happens. I prefer i pay 15 or 20 a month and be on equal grounds with everyone else. The in-game gear visuals are horrible and its done on purpose. I would prefer that world bosses would drop these costumes and such. I would love to hear your guys opinions.  
  17. This forums poll system is extremely lacking so I had to make do with what I could make (only three questions, 10 slots each)
    That is why ninja/kuno and witch/wizard are lumped together. So it will skewer the numbers a little bit, but I can estimate what will win out lol
     
    The premise is simple. People need to know what to buy for you when the update comes. Why load the servers with Canape costumes if no one wants them? I'm here to provide information
     
    Without further ado, remember to vote and keep this topic bumped! Yes it is multiple choice.
     
    I await the results
     
    Shout out to @Ainrehtea for the idea in the first place
     
    Not enough room to make the kind of poll I wanted lol
     
  18. When I started I read up on game and seen both KR and JP had no buy in and had cash shop items avail for marketplace
    Now when a game wants to step up shop here in North America, what they do not tell you is this, international tax and fees. 
    In a sort they are setting up shop to take virtual jobs, and are charged through the nose.
    Servers are not cheap for this type of usage 100.000 + users using data to run this game lol
    Also Currency from Yen to USD is a joke see image
    Edited to show both in case of either
     
    Now keep in mind I am going by my opinion of starting in March.
    At that time they said Not at launch, so I knew it was coming, and seeing the fact as kr gets updates we do later on so you have to be a fool not to think oh they get mediah we get mediah they have valencia we get valencia ..... Oh wait they have cash shop items in market........ 
     
    anyhow it takes alot to do this and well I respect it. 
    Please remain calm and stop acting like no one knew this....
    and in a couple days we shall see what happens,  

     
    I think the items in cash shop will be limited, like to have 25% avail to resell only to encourage more to spend, Like at costco where they offer a sample of tasty crack to get you in the door 

    IN online gaming you see cash shops. they help with paying the staff, now if you are unemployed or living at home think of this, "whoever" feeds you be it Mom, Dad, Gramma, Grampa, the state or lotto. if they had been told today that they were no longer going to be paid that they were hoping to work for free. 
    you would not have anymore internet, food, or cheetos

     
    For me the Pearl shop is a form of tipping the server waitress etc "Jouska" 

    but if we paid to get in, and that income is going down, the fate of the server could close.
    if the game did go free to play you think it is bad now?
    we pay to get in and could pay, think of the leechers 

    Yes Black Friday, game goes free to play hordes of people rush in, card warriors and bots and rotten people
    You think it is bad, lol I played Lineage 2 when it started 20$ a month, it had bots and gold sellers but when it went free to play servers we're packed
     
    I think we all need to see how this plays out, and see if it can be made to work for us, as well we all love the game or you would not be here trolling 

    In life you will learn you can chose the devil you know vers the devil you don't

    IN any case this has been my time and thoughts.
    If you need an 

    Just leave, save some dignity and move on. 
    Stress will kill you
     
    Have a great day, if you agree may the RNG be with you so you find the booty

    and if you are that troll, may you find all the Bares crap and empty chests
     
     
  19. I'm currently sick to my stomach about this whole ordeal. To me personally the idea of this pearl to market idea isn't the worst thing and i don't need to do it personally. However I'm very concerned about what this is going to do to the game in ways you might not directly think about. Sure noob players will surpass hardcore players by spending a few 100$, yeah so what whatever. The issue here is that the community will likely become ruined and toxic more than it was before. Large guilds and small guilds are disbanding and a lot of people have already left. This is a game that myself and a lot of people have became completely captivated by and even in love with. I'm afraid after Wednesday the game is going to quickly die in the same way that archage did. A quick cash grab might be nice at the moment but you'll lose a lot more over the next year, not to mention now Daum is going to have a terrible reputation. I guess this post is my concern for the game and asking the community how and or what can we do to save the game? Is there anything? I did sign the petition for stopping this pearl to market change and i encourage everyone who cares about the games future to do so as well.
  20. Hi all,
    in Europe we have pretty strong laws against false / misleading advertising, and our courts (including the European Court of Justice)  have proven to use these laws in a very consumer friendly way.
    I don’t think Daum/Kakao has considered this properly. Before and after the launch they said on many occasions (multiple FAQs, News, Forum entries and Youtube) that BDO will not be P2W in the western markets. Many people even believe the success of BDO in the west is linked to this promise.
    Now, five months later, they want to break this promise. They can, but then they prove themselves guilty of misleading advertising. That means all players have the right to demand and receive a refund, for the initial purchase as well as for all the in game items they bought.
    http://ec.europa.eu/consumers/consumer_rights/unfair-trade/false-advertising/index_en.htm
    http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-07-1915_en.htm

  21. bin was das "P2W" - Feat angeht Neutral , kann beide Seiten verstehen
    aber nun mal unter uns -  
    Ohne GEAR als NEULING :
    max 30h bis lvl 50 mit Schwarzsteinquest 
    level bis 55 mit Leuten aus irgend einer "SemiProgress" Gilde  (sind wir bei maximal 60h Spielzeit - kann aufgeteilt werden in 3-5h wenn mann will)
    bei einem "Normalo Arbeitenden Gamer" mit 2h am Tag wär das ca 1 Monat wo er genug hat um sich in 60h Duo Grunil mit einer Duo Liverto zu ergattern! 
    Nun ein Suchti der Neu einsteigt mit "Guide/Anleitung" in einer Semi Progress Gilde! 
    ca. 8h gemütliche lvl 50 (mit ca 10 mio in der Tasche) - kauft sich mal schnell ne Liverto und macht sie auf +7 oder +10 (je nach glück)
    grindet bei Sausans (bis 56) dauert maximal ne Woche! hat nun ca. seine ersten 100-200 mio drin 
    8h am Tag x (minimum) 2 Millionen die Stunde = 16m * 7 Tage also minimum 112 mio      // ich mach schon 2 mio Solo - im Team bekommt man je nach Aufstellung mehr 
     
    +15 Gear kann man mittlerweile Super Kaufen für maximal 20 mio (Grunil)
    4 Teile +15 = 60 mio => Rest 52 mio  => Liverto +15 kostet ca 50-60 mio 
     
    so in 1 Woche hat man eben mal alle +15 mit +15 Liverto! 
    Grindet er weitere 20h bei Sausans Weiter (ohne gestört zu werden) ist er 57 mit 40 mio Extra 
    das reicht um sein Ganzes Gear auf Pri zu Bringen 
     
    TLDR: 
    Es ist einfach an Pri Gear zu kommen , Duo und Tri sind eher "Glück" aber immer noch machbar - je nachdem wie lange jemand am Tag spielt! 
    Laut einer Quelle soll das Verhältnis von Silber : € bei genau 1:1 handeln!
     
    Also Ein Kostüm hat ne Kosten Range von:
    ca. 17-38 Millionen Silber 
    => mit Abzug der Steuern eben ca. 30 Millionen Silber!
     
    EINER der nun sein BOSSGEAR kaufen will fertig (z.B. Tri: Kzarka) braucht wenn er tatsächlich schafft 5 Kostüme pro Woche zu verticken 
    ca 5 Wochen um auf 700+ mio zu kommen und Kostet ihm eben ca 700€+ 
    Gehen wir davon aus das wir in den Progress Gilden 20% eben Super Staatsleecher sind und bei Mama Hotel eingecheckt haben 
    so würden (nehmen wir mal die ersten Top 40 Gilden) mit nem schnitt von 70 Leuten 
     
    40x70x0,2  also ca 560 Menschen die für die ersten 2 Wochen nur 5 Kostüme anbieten
    wären also 5600 Kostüme die im AH landen (Pro Server) 
    also wie schnell wäre der Markt gesättigt?  
    bei 5600 Kostümen, wenn grade mal 5000 Pro Server Aktiv spielen? ( Die meisten haben Maximal 3 Sets , Desert Ghuilie, Ghuillie und eins mit EXP)
     
    und nun mit Pets .... 
    um ein Bestimmten Boni zu "Züchten" hat man ne Chance von 1/10 bei T1  
     
    man hat ca ne 50% Chance aus 2x T1 ein T3 zu Bekommen 
    Der Schnitt um 1 T4 Pet zu bekommen liegt bei 6 Pets im schnitt
     
    sagen wir , unser Testobjekt ist n scheiß Lucker und bekommt ein T4 mit immer 4 Pets! 
    Und da wir nun 4 Pets gleichzeitig haben können eben 4 mal !
    10 x 4 x 4  => 
    160 Pets um 4 x T4 mit mindestens einem Bonus zu haben das man WILL!
     
    5600 Pets in 2 Wochen würde die Nachfrage bei T4 Pets grade mal für 35 Personen Decken ... 
     
    nun mit Value Packs
     
    5600 Value Packs in 2 Wochen - ca. 5000 Aktive Spieler pro Server  
     
     
     
    @EVERYONE 
    SOOO .... Was würdest IHR nun als "P2W - Idiot" deiner Meinung nach Verkaufen ?  
    jedes mal 5 Kostüme? und Gambeln das sie Weg gehen?
     
    NEIN -  ein Casher wird warscheinlich sich eher seine Kunden im Channel/Server Chat Suchen und sie auf Bestellung anbieten! - Kostet Mühe und er kannt "betrogen werden" wenn der Kerl das eben nicht kauft  
    Denke das der Kerl dann sowieso mehrere Stunden am Tag das Versucht anzubieten! 
    Oder eben ne Kleine Gruppe bekannt wird an die man sich Wenden kann m Sets von denen zu Kaufen!
     
    Der Durchschnitt wird dann eher dabei Liegen : 3 Pets, 1 Value Pack und je nach dem ob einer fragt 1 Kostüm! 
    das wären 30 Mio an Pets , 15 Mio an Value und nochmal vllt 30 mio oder eben weniger je nach bedarf.
     
     
    75m Durchschnitts einkommen Pro Woche bei einem "P2W - Idiot" für Satte 75€ den Aufwand zu betreiben würde ich meinen , ich gönn ihm das und in der Zeit Grinde , Farme , oder mach PvP wo er nur vor dem AH hockt   
     
    selbst bei 10.000 Aktiven Spielern Pro Server! oder 20.000 wäre die Nachfrage in nicht mal 2 Monaten zu Ende!  
    Da bisher nur 1 Weitere Klasse Angekündigt wurde! 
    Sie müssten schon derbe neue Kostüme herausbringen mit Zusätzlich Extra Stats oder irgend was Heftiges um den Kaufrausch eben wieder anzutreiben
     
    und bis dahin sind die Pets/Valuepacks eben die Hauptennahme-Quelle 
    und machen minimum 50 mio / Woche 
     
    wenn sich Leute darüber beschweren - GG 
    aber Solange sich  DAUM an ihr Versprechen hält das die Begrenzung Permament bis die Server Krepieren  auch so Bleibt , seh ich da kein Problem! 
    (ich mach alleine schon in der Woche so 30-50 mio über nacht mit Auto Angeln .... ) 
     
    Natürlich "kann" sich die Begrenzung ändern, aber auch dann könnten die P2W eben nur mit Pets ihr Silber verdienen
    aber mal im Ernst  
    wer gibt 7600€ für ein TET: Ogre Ring aus? Wenn das überhaupt einer Anbietet ...
    Oder eben TET Kzarka Waffen? ... vereinzelnt bestimmt ... aber ohne das Angebot sitzt der P2W-Idiot eben auf dem ganzen Silber und kauft damit Energie aus dem AH (was wiederum begrentzt ist) und sitzt eben neben dem Nightvendor ....
     
    Ein Komplettes PEN: EQUIPT würde Umgerechnet eben wirklich viel Kosten (wenn es direkt im AH angeboten wird)
    ACC
    PEN: OGRE - 12k €
    PEN: Blue Whale x2 - 6k €
    PEN: Crescent x2 - 18k€
    PEN: Basilisk - 10k€
    BOSS ARMOR
    PEN: Bheg 15k€
    PEN: Giath 15k€
    PEN: Hebete 18k€
    PEN:Muskan 15K€
    BOSS WEAPON
    PEN: Kzarka 7k€ 
    PEN: Nuvea  5k€
    PEN: AWAKENING  -  kp denke mal auch so um die 7k€ 
    => also ca 130.000 € wenn das mal Tatsächlich im AH  zu snipen Wäre 
     
     
    die Leute müssten mit Begrenzung etwa 1000 Wochen Kostüm Sets verkaufen .... 
    und wer zum Teufel gibt 130k€ aus um allen anderen in die Tonne zu hauen? 
    nur so ... die TET Leute die Skill haben machen die PEN immer noch Platt - je nach Klasse 
     
    und wenn irgend ein P2W ohne AH mit Cronsteine eben das selbe Probiert alles auf PEN zu hauen 
    so kann er etwa mit dem 3 Fachen Silber Wert Rechnen, da die Accesoires eben trotzdem Failen können 
    also ca 300k € 
     
    Ich würd als NoLifer mir ne schöne kleine Wohnung in Amsterdam kaufen, mit ne Direkt Leitung zum Rechenzentrum legen lassen und mir n Schönes leben mit Fastfood und einer Kalten Linken Hand machen ( Scrubs anspielung*)
     
    Mal im Ernst - einer der Sich das Leisten kann und auch noch Umsetzt , müsste ein kompletten Dachschaden haben 
    (Wohnung 100k, Leitung 100k direkt ins Zentrum - und eben von den Zinsen Leben .... sind mehr als 100k die man benötigt aber okay)
     
    Wenn die Begrenzung weg Wäre, Gönn es den ... das Spiel wäre dann wirklich tot! 
    Perl/Daum hätte dann warschenlich schon genug und BDO2 oder so wäre da  
     
    Der Großteil der Community bleibt , weil eine Begrenzung Existiert  .... ob es ihnen gefällt ist ne Andere Sache  aber sie Bleiben!
    und ich mein - WIE WILL MAN 100k€ oder eben 300K€  im AH verticken? 
    Just my 2 Cents ...  
  22. Post on Cap Play Time in Suggestions

    By Diablerist, posted
    For people that work 40-80 hours a week providing for their community, keeping valid in the game can be struggle. While they are at work the people who don't work, or who play this game as work are far advanced in gear and skill. To make the game fair and to prevent play 2 win model, you should cap the amount of time people can play to 4 hours a day M-F.  This would put people on an equal playing field, and you could leave the market place untouched.
    An alternative to this proposal,  You could take 35% of the silver from people who play for over 4 hours a day, and distribute this to people  who play less. This would even the playing field on terms of silver generation. I realize some people that play more than 4 hours are afk fishing, but you could implement a system that detects afk fishing and does not count that as play time. Think of this as a welfare system, much like real life welfare systems. 
    Another proposal, You could allow pearl shop items to be sold on the marketplace for silver. This would allow people with low play time to catch up by the means of silver, and give access to peal shop items to those people who where blessed with playtime and not funding. If people have the silver to buy the pearl items from the marketplace, then they have the silver for upgrades and already have the access to the same benefit that the person selling the item would receive. 
  23. Post on Solution in General

    By Lulilummu, posted
    With all this talk about for p2w, not for p2w and whatnot, I've been wondering if anyone has actually come up with a solution?
     
    I mean in the end this is a business. I can't say how much money Kakau (previously name Daum Kakau prior to 2014) is actually making on this game, but they need to turn a profit to keep the game running. Everyone called them greedy but can anyone prove that they are making a lot more than they need to? Pearl Abyss made a magnificent game, I don't believe that it would have come at a cheap publishing price. Considering they don't charge for expansions or subs, It's hard to see how they make money. The thing about the f2p model is it's a dual edged sword. At times you can make more than either sub or b2p titles, or not make money at all.
     
    I love this game, i really do. So I'm a little biased myself. I don't think it's P2W, you can flame me later. I don't find money that vital considering if it did become actually P2W (at least in my standards). Right now cash items will net you silver, truck loads of it. That money is made from honest players (who for the most part are running for the hills right no) who will slowly thin out, meaning there won't be people to sell to (or so i think). It works on other servers since people in those regions are  not as aggressively against the idea as we are here evidently. Although most of this malice comes from the lying fiasco (though i think that's debatable whether these implementations are truly pay to win). Now that the P2Wers have their silver, there's only value if they spend it. So they tear everything off the market, which so happens to put up their by our previously mentioned "honest" players who like we've stated prior, may go extinct. In which case means with no amount of money will they be able to by anything since it's not on the market. The prices will jump to unprecedented levels thus barring all honest players from their gear. Said player are now even more discouraged. Now there's not supply for silver OR commodities, just a load of silver. So tl;dr, Kakau if your listening, the current state of matter is NOT P2W, HOWEVER, it will destroy the game. Payers won't win. Non payers won't win. Kakau won't win. It's everybody's loss. 
     
    This won't necessarily happen, but this community is just REALLY against the entire idea so chances are it will happen here.
     
    So the question is what CAN Kakau do? I mean their current model is working in other countries, but frankly NA players are hard to please (I'm not of NA origin so I've seen how MMOs work outside of here, and I can say that it's VERY different). With the quality of this game, if it went full subscription, I would be 100% on-board though i can't speak for anyone else. I might get iffy if we then have to pay of expansions but if that's what they settle on I'll live with it because this game is worth that. However, moving from a F2P model to a SUB model means collaborating with the Devs.to make the new program (flame me on that, I'm just assuming that it's not all on the publishers to make these changes). If that's the case, will Pearl think it's worth the effort & money? Even then, that kind of move mean a lot of effort on Kakau because they would have to re-campaign the game, and somehow earn back trust in its NA player base that's been brutally massacred. 
     
    Black Desert is in a really bad place now and hopefully some business executive at Kakau can make the right call. What do you guys think the right call at this point be?
    (I'm hoping for some well thought out ideas and potentially enlightening discussion, but those hopes aren't high :/)
     
    <not really important>
    <About PVP and how it can save BDO>
     
    welp flame incoming
  24. If you are going to do it, witch I think u are anyway despite all protest.
    Stop b1tchslapping us with these (not so) subtile changes.
    It makes us think u assume we are retards.
    I suggest given the ideas from players
    Put the pearlboxes in already and let ppl sell one a week:
    BOXMonneyPearlsSilver1 $€ / silverBOX 5100100002000000001/20000BOX 46060001500000001/25000BOX 33030001000000001/33333BOX 2202000500000001/25000BOX 1101000150000001/15000Box for €/$ 30 being the optimal box, want more silver at once in a week, pay more monney.
    Also box 3 will get u a suit if u buy it. At least P2W progression is slowed down.
     
    Then at least we know where it is heading to. 
    No tricks, no baits just straight forward: this is how it's going to be.
    Let us decide NOW if we wanna play this with P2W.
  25. Post on RP community on P2W in General

    By ghaz, posted
    I will start off by saying, I want this thread to be civil. No arguments, no flaming others.
    I am against the P2W aspect for a few reasons, however I do see the point from the other side of the community.  I am curious how -you- the RP community feel it would affect our situation? I know many of you play the game for its RP, many of you do a mix of RP and PvP. So I can likely imagine your stances on most of this situation. Will this P2W feature soften your view on the game? Will you continue to RP like normal?
    I personally am against it, as a working man, simply for the fact that I planned on doing more RPvX in the game. I cannot say that this new change will in fact change anything. For the most part, everyone here is judging off of speculation. Some of you might have come from the korean servers so you might have more insight. I do feel like I will be more so restricted to doing RP rather than the constructed node wars, open pvp, arena pvp, etc.