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"PvP penalty" suggestion


38 posts in this topic

Posted

Seeing the current events of PvP, the removal of xp lose in PvP, and how the lack of a real penalty has motivated karma griefing.
Is it possible to add a new penalty for pvp deaths that will discourage griefing, 
like if someone flags up and kills in pvp the person that gets killed can only get spawned in a major city.
What's everyone's else's thoughts on this?
yah or nah?
 

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Posted (edited)

I think they should change the spawn after dead several times to city and major city after dead several times.

Why?

Because it's a joke after killing people they appear again in 1min or less.

They don't care because they don't loose nothing so at least move them far away.

The only way for kick them out is guild war or lost all your karma because you can't do nothing.

I give you an example.

After dead 3 times spawn to near city.

And if you dead 5 times spawn to major city.

That could be an option.

This could be applicate by 1 hour. After that hour the counter is reset.

This is just my opinion you can share your idea. 

Edited by Lomacs
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Posted (edited)

Comment this thread please, I think is very important because the current system is bad.

Edited by Lomacs
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OMG! can we PLEASE leave the PVP system alone!!!

The system works well as is! It stops PKer's being selfish and childish when they immorally try and "CLAIM" a grinding spot as their own and stops PKer's killing innocent PVEers just for the fun of it and the PVEers are not penalised for being unfairly killed just for the fun of it.

The system works... END OF!

I think they should change the spawn after dead several times to city and major city after dead several times.

Why?

Because it's a joke after killing people they appear again in 1min or less.

They don't care because they don't loose nothing so at least move them far away.

The only way for kick them out is guild war or lost all your karma because you can't do nothing.

I give you an example.

After dead 3 times spawn to near city.

And if you dead 5 times spawn to major city.

That could be an option.

This could be applicate by 1 hour. After that hour the counter is reset.

This is just my opinion you can share your idea. 

Learn to share the area rather then being selfish, claiming the area for yourself. You are not the only one that plays this game, you dont own the spot, you dont own the area, the server of even the game. YOU are just a gamer like everyone else. LEARN TO SHARE.

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Posted

I suport this idea strongly. If you want open world pvp to have any meaning you MUST have a tool to forcefully "remove" other players. The only way to do this is by installing a real risk vs. reward system. As long as being killed in pvp has no consequence (or even worse - at the moment it has a negative consequence for the WINNER of the engagement!) it doesn't work out.

As the mostly PVE oriented people oppose the idea of equipment dropping / XP loss, respawning away from the spot is the best solution.

First death: respawn at the next node

Next death within 10 minutes: respawn at the next town

Third death within 10 minutes: respawn in the next city

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Posted

Seeing the current events of PvP, the removal of xp lose in PvP, and how the lack of a real penalty has motivated karma griefing.
Is it possible to add a new penalty for pvp deaths that will discourage griefing, 
like if someone flags up and kills in pvp the person that gets killed can only get spawned in a major city.
What's everyone's else's thoughts on this?
yah or nah?
 

And People will start to harass other People like there will be no Tomorrow.

 

NO THX.

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Posted

This is copied and pasted from Captaine Carnage: 

It's just a rough idea , but we can also think of a system like the first Guild Wars.
Something a like temporary debuff on death which diminish your total HP and MP/SP. It was 15 % on GW1, incrementing with each death, capped at 60 % (which could prevent your build to work properly), but you could dispel it faster by making XP (numbers, duration and coodldown could be ajusted here).
The idea is to have something that acts as a deterent to prevent karma bombing and allows PvP to act as an efficient tool for biologic competition on ressources, that must determine the statutes at the end of the fight: winner / loser, but without hurting the loser progression and XP in the long term (It's just a temporary debuff, nothing is lost forever).
It could be applied from the second death vs the same player within a certain timeframe, to prevent suffreing this kind of debuff on ninja deaths one could not see coming (an ultimate in the back while farming for example), or when changing spot, and provide a chance to fight back for the one really willing to take his spot back, but with its incrementing nature from the second death versus the same player and further, could prevent in some way suicide on loop to karma grief if it's harsh enough (but as said, always temporary).

Respawning at the closest major city was also proposed. the idea is always the same : something annoying on the moment, but not penalizing in the long term.

 I absolutely love the idea of this system. 

I suport this idea strongly. If you want open world pvp to have any meaning you MUST have a tool to forcefully "remove" other players. The only way to do this is by installing a real risk vs. reward system. As long as being killed in pvp has no consequence (or even worse - at the moment it has a negative consequence for the WINNER of the engagement!) it doesn't work out.

As the mostly PVE oriented people oppose the idea of equipment dropping / XP loss, respawning away from the spot is the best solution.

First death: respawn at the next node

Next death within 10 minutes: respawn at the next town

Third death within 10 minutes: respawn in the next city

+1

 

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Posted (edited)

OMG! can we PLEASE leave the PVP system alone!!!

The system works well as is! It stops PKer's being selfish and childish when they immorally try and "CLAIM" a grinding spot as their own and stops PKer's killing innocent PVEers just for the fun of it and the PVEers are not penalised for being unfairly killed just for the fun of it.

The system works... END OF!

Learn to share the area rather then being selfish, claiming the area for yourself. You are not the only one that plays this game, you dont own the spot, you dont own the area, the server of even the game. YOU are just a gamer like everyone else. LEARN TO SHARE.

"Learn to share the area rather then being selfish" Are you kidding me?

First of all I'm farming calm and someone arrive and they start disturbing me and if you kill them they appear again in 30seconds.

Is that normal?

I'm sorry but i'm not with you because is very annoying when people start doing ks and you can't grind. And if you want to kick them out, you can't because you lost your karma and you must to stop.

 

Edited by Lomacs
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Posted

"Learn to share the area rather then being selfish" Are you kidding me?

First of all I'm farming calm and someone arrive and they start disturbing me and if you kill them they appear again in 30seconds.

Is that normal?

I'm sorry but i'm not with you because is very annoying when people start doing ks and you can't grind. And if you want to kick them out, you can't because you lost your karma and you must to stop.

 

why don't you try NOT killing them and just grind with them? ya know, like a nice person?

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Posted

First we should distinguish between PK and PVP. Then we should change the way we play.

It is a MMORPG - all selfish, ignorant players who will attack first have to be punished.

Solution to all those kind of agro, selfish, ignorant player: Dialogue, share, team up, accept the other player.

No attacking = no karma loosing! Easy, isn't it?

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Posted

why don't you try NOT killing them and just grind with them? ya know, like a nice person?

What happens when you're a full party? but the person wants to force take over your spot? 

which is what happens 90% of the time.

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Posted

What happens when you're a full party? but the person wants to force take over your spot? 

which is what happens 90% of the time.

That is simple case, I'm full party with 5 and 1 warrior arrive w his awakening and start doing ks to all mobs. Are you ok with that?

Worst part is when you kill him but surprise!, he come back again and again until you lost all your karma.
(PD: This happen almost every day) most of case with warrior, sorcerer and ranger.

 

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Posted

First we should distinguish between PK and PVP. Then we should change the way we play.

It is a MMORPG - all selfish, ignorant players who will attack first have to be punished.

Solution to all those kind of agro, selfish, ignorant player: Dialogue, share, team up, accept the other player.

No attacking = no karma loosing! Easy, isn't it?

 

IM abdsolutly agree, 

PVP its not the same as PK, most of players dont like being disturbed by others who ruins their games and time, selfish players who want an spot only for them or only like to kill people for fun. Pk should be more pusnished if case, also karma recovering being in a party should dissapear. People cant play  propertly cause of that and they even leaving the game.

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Posted

That is simple case, I'm full party with 5 and 1 warrior arrive w his awakening and start doing ks to all mobs. Are you ok with that?

Worst part is when you kill him but surprise!, he come back again and again until you lost all your karma.
(PD: This happen almost every day) most of case with warrior, sorcerer and ranger.

 

Look maybe I'm just more of an accepting person when it comes to other players farming in the same farm sport I am. All the time I have player invading my area, you know what I do? I just share the area and continue to grind, I'm not losing EXP since all mob re spawn and to be honest I don't really see a fallout in EXP gathering rate. I just get on with it. I don't PK because it just encourages me getting angry about someone and I don't play angry. I just share...

First we should distinguish between PK and PVP. Then we should change the way we play.

It is a MMORPG - all selfish, ignorant players who will attack first have to be punished.

Solution to all those kind of agro, selfish, ignorant player: Dialogue, share, team up, accept the other player.

No attacking = no karma loosing! Easy, isn't it?

I wouldn't categorise myself as ignorant, ignorant implies lack of intelligence or putting you head in the sand and ignoring the problem. Im just a calm accepting player of other and think of others when they play.

unless I read this wrong, which in case I apologise.

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Posted (edited)

Look maybe I'm just more of an accepting person when it comes to other players farming in the same farm sport I am. All the time I have player invading my area, you know what I do? I just share the area and continue to grind, I'm not losing EXP since all mob re spawn and to be honest I don't really see a fallout in EXP gathering rate. I just get on with it. I don't PK because it just encourages me getting angry about someone and I don't play angry. I just share...

I wouldn't categorise myself as ignorant, ignorant implies lack of intelligence or putting you head in the sand and ignoring the problem. Im just a calm accepting player of other and think of others when they play.

unless I read this wrong, which in case I apologise.

but you do loose xp..... time = xp... do the math...

if you pop the daily xp bonus + an xp beer + the tea + weekend bonus + party xp elixir, at 57 you should do between 8 and 10% in 1 hour on a full group.. If just 1 guy decides to come and screw the rotation, now you might do 5% in that huor, and in order to prevent him from stealing your spot, you run faster around so you leave the drop in the ground, and you are not only loosing xp, you also loosing money. sausans duo yields 10kk / hour (20kk for the duo). with a full group may be 7kk (35kk for a group of 5) per hour with only 1 karma bomber you end up getting about 5kk per hour (25kk so 15kk less) and lot less xp....

so what ends up happening is that you switch channels to find a free spot and might even risk loosing even more while the karma bomber keeps the spot....

why should the better geared, better organized group be penalized and the solo guy be rewarded?

 

I think they should change the spawn after dead several times to city and major city after dead several times.

Why?

Because it's a joke after killing people they appear again in 1min or less.

They don't care because they don't loose nothing so at least move them far away.

The only way for kick them out is guild war or lost all your karma because you can't do nothing.

I give you an example.

After dead 3 times spawn to near city.

And if you dead 5 times spawn to major city.

That could be an option.

This could be applicate by 1 hour. After that hour the counter is reset.

This is just my opinion you can share your idea. 

I suport this idea strongly. If you want open world pvp to have any meaning you MUST have a tool to forcefully "remove" other players. The only way to do this is by installing a real risk vs. reward system. As long as being killed in pvp has no consequence (or even worse - at the moment it has a negative consequence for the WINNER of the engagement!) it doesn't work out.

As the mostly PVE oriented people oppose the idea of equipment dropping / XP loss, respawning away from the spot is the best solution.

First death: respawn at the next node

Next death within 10 minutes: respawn at the next town

Third death within 10 minutes: respawn in the next city

these are actually great middle grounds... may be you can do it so that on pvp death you cannot respawn on the same place more than once within 10 minutes (just like channel switching)...

 

so closest node (sausans main)... closest node again (sausans wharf) clsoest node again, (to the next and so on and so forth, until the 10 minute timer on sausans main expires.... that way the guy has 3 or 4 chances to actually fight for the spot.....

Edited by Leon0

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Posted

The reason why they instantly re-spawn is because they have tears, tears they have paid good money to have.

I'm sorry the the system isn't broken and works fantastic now. It prevents unfairly being killed as the system says you are. It prevents being ganged up on and it prevents being PK'd for doing nothing wrong.

I will say this again. The mobs are for EVERYONE. No one owns a spot, just because you there first does not give you the sole rights to it and killing people for it is your choice but don't expect not to be penalised for it which you now are which was a good move on BDO's part.

The system works and it works very well, people are coming back to the game because of it. If you make the tears obsolete by making players spawn later and in further away areas people wont buy tears, ergo wont give BDO money ergo BDO has less revenue..

Do you really think BDO will choose your solution over less revenue? I don't think so. I buy 100's of tears so I can spawn instantly in the same location everytime, that's what they are for. If I can't do that then BDO will lose money since there is no point in buying them.

PVP is a SMALL part of this game just because you can do it everywhere doesn't make it a large part. 

I would just love it or lump it. If they go back on the changes then it will just stir things up again which caused the change in the first place.

"Learn to share the area rather then being selfish" Are you kidding me?

First of all I'm farming calm and someone arrive and they start disturbing me and if you kill them they appear again in 30seconds.

Is that normal?

I'm sorry but i'm not with you because is very annoying when people start doing ks and you can't grind. And if you want to kick them out, you can't because you lost your karma and you must to stop.

 

That's the point! you said it yourself, someone arrives and you get disturbed, why? you don't own the spot, why not let the guy just farm there? are you generally a angry person? do u have anger issues? do u have a problem with sharing?

why cant you just share the spot and play nice? are you in such a rush to get as much EXP as possible in a short period of time??

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Posted

The reason why they instantly re-spawn is because they have tears, tears they have paid good money to have.

I'm sorry the the system isn't broken and works fantastic now. It prevents unfairly being killed as the system says you are. It prevents being ganged up on and it prevents being PK'd for doing nothing wrong.

I will say this again. The mobs are for EVERYONE. No one owns a spot, just because you there first does not give you the sole rights to it and killing people for it is your choice but don't expect not to be penalised for it which you now are which was a good move on BDO's part.

The system works and it works very well, people are coming back to the game because of it. If you make the tears obsolete by making players spawn later and in further away areas people wont buy tears, ergo wont give BDO money ergo BDO has less revenue..

Do you really think BDO will choose your solution over less revenue? I don't think so. I buy 100's of tears so I can spawn instantly in the same location everytime, that's what they are for. If I can't do that then BDO will lose money since there is no point in buying them.

PVP is a SMALL part of this game just because you can do it everywhere doesn't make it a large part. 

I would just love it or lump it. If they go back on the changes then it will just stir things up again which caused the change in the first place.

That's the point! you said it yourself, someone arrives and you get disturbed, why? you don't own the spot, why not let the guy just farm there? are you generally a angry person? do u have anger issues? do u have a problem with sharing?
why cant you just share the spot and play nice? are you in such a rush to get as much EXP as possible in a short period of time??

I won't lost my time with you because i gave you an example and you don't care if people ks you so lost your time lvling. I think you're low lvl because your answer haven't sense.

I used to grind with full party and if you need around 80 hours for up 1 lvl.... If someone ks you all the time you lost additional time (less xp, drop) because 1 person don't understand that is disturbing to my group....

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I won't lost my time with you because i gave you an example and you don't care if people ks you so lost your time lvling. I think you're low lvl because your answer haven't sense.

I used to grind with full party and if you need around 80 hours for up 1 lvl.... If someone ks you all the time you lost additional time (less xp, drop) because 1 person don't understand that is disturbing to my group....

Your entire comment doesn't make sense purely because the actual English your using isn't structurally sound. 

For you information i'm lvl 57 193/243 AP/DP, sometimes I party, sometimes I don't, many people tell me to leave which I ignore, they kill me since I don't bother fighting back, i die, I re-spawn until they give up and we just share the area. I don't PK because really what is the point, your only pissing someone off which isn't why I play this game for. I'm in no rush to level so I just try and play nice.

 

People don't disturb me, I just get on with it. I feel sorry for you that something so small disturbs you, but the system wont change since they have already changed it and Dev's hate admitting their wrong and changing things back so there is a good chance your just going to have to live with it since id be massively surprised if they change it back or change it yet again.

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In a game where PK does exist, the gear is not even for PVP, nothing about the own skill mostly its about gear and level .  So ... some people want to pk freely to ensure a certain amount of exp and money to make a big difference between them and rest, taking advantage of this. Also considering that you use the same gear and lvl to real PVP thats sound like a really bad policy. for a game.

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Look maybe I'm just more of an accepting person when it comes to other players farming in the same farm sport I am. All the time I have player invading my area, you know what I do? I just share the area and continue to grind, I'm not losing EXP since all mob re spawn and to be honest I don't really see a fallout in EXP gathering rate. I just get on with it. I don't PK because it just encourages me getting angry about someone and I don't play angry. I just share...

I wouldn't categorise myself as ignorant, ignorant implies lack of intelligence or putting you head in the sand and ignoring the problem. Im just a calm accepting player of other and think of others when they play.

unless I read this wrong, which in case I apologise.

Yes, you are right. I shouldn't use the word "ignorant". I will fix it right now: (read next quote below)

but you do loose xp..... time = xp... do the math...

if you pop the daily xp bonus + an xp beer + the tea + weekend bonus + party xp elixir, at 57 you should do between 8 and 10% in 1 hour on a full group.. If just 1 guy decides to come and screw the rotation, now you might do 5% in that huor, and in order to prevent him from stealing your spot, you run faster around so you leave the drop in the ground, and you are not only loosing xp, you also loosing money. sausans duo yields 10kk / hour (20kk for the duo). with a full group may be 7kk (35kk for a group of 5) per hour with only 1 karma bomber you end up getting about 5kk per hour (25kk so 15kk less) and lot less xp....

so what ends up happening is that you switch channels to find a free spot and might even risk loosing even more while the karma bomber keeps the spot....

why should the better geared, better organized group be penalized and the solo guy be rewarded?

 

 

 

these are actually great middle grounds... may be you can do it so that on pvp death you cannot respawn on the same place more than once within 10 minutes (just like channel switching)...

 

so closest node (sausans main)... closest node again (sausans wharf) clsoest node again, (to the next and so on and so forth, until the 10 minute timer on sausans main expires.... that way the guy has 3 or 4 chances to actually fight for the spot.....

"

First we should distinguish between PK and PVP. Then we should change the way we play.

It is a MMORPG - all selfish, greedy players who will attack first have to be punished.

Solution to all those kind of agro, selfish, greedy player: Dialogue, share, team up, accept the other player.

No attacking (first) = no karma loosing! Easy, isn't it?

"

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Posted

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OMG! can we PLEASE leave the PVP system alone!!!

The system works well as is! It stops PKer's being selfish and childish when they immorally try and "CLAIM" a grinding spot as their own and stops PKer's killing innocent PVEers just for the fun of it and the PVEers are not penalised for being unfairly killed just for the fun of it.

The system works... END OF!

Learn to share the area rather then being selfish, claiming the area for yourself. You are not the only one that plays this game, you dont own the spot, you dont own the area, the server of even the game. YOU are just a gamer like everyone else. LEARN TO SHARE.

innocent my ass y'all are karma grieving, this game is suppose to be an open world sand box, and was advertised as such. They keep moving more and more away from that, if you cant defend your spot you cant have it that's the point of open world PvP. find some honor in defeat, to top things off the jail system is pointless without xp loss, it was put in the game with the intent of xp loss to punish those who pk. Now its being used as a mechanic to grief those who are trying to grind. its pointless without xp loss if your not going to bring back xp loss get rid of the jail system.

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innocent my ass y'all are karma grieving, this game is suppose to be an open world sand box, and was advertised as such. They keep moving more and more away from that, if you cant defend your spot you cant have it that's the point of open world PvP. find some honor in defeat, to top things off the jail system is pointless without xp loss, it was put in the game with the intent of xp loss to punish those who pk. Now its being used as a mechanic to grief those who are trying to grind. its pointless without xp loss if your not going to bring back xp loss get rid of the jail system.

oh dear, another butthurt pker that doesn't like to share and play nice.... I don't karma grief, I don't provoke people, I just play the game... AGAIN... no one OWN a spot, they belong to everyone.

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oh dear, another butthurt pker that doesn't like to share and play nice.... I don't karma grief, I don't provoke people, I just play the game... AGAIN... no one OWN a spot, they belong to everyone.

You fail to understand what an open world sand box is.

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Another idea (actually an idea of one of my guildmates which I found pretty good) would be to let the looser of a pvp fight spawn at a major city without xp loss and at the clostest note with a certain xp loss. In case of such a pvp model the looser can exclusively decide if he wants to be back at the spot within 1 minute or within 10 minutes. This system would not put an major advantage or disadvantage for any side and would avoid that guildless players are able to karmagrief without an end and without receiving any punishment even in case that they are actually the looser of a fight and just because it is not possible to declare war. 

A second idea would be to implement an big pve ap/dp debuff in case that a player gets killed in such pk spotfights multiple times within some minutes. This debuff should lower the pve farming speed in such a way that the looser is not able to easily carry on to steal mobs from the winner. In this case the looser keeps his xp but is not able to disturb the winner so much that the winner is forced to carry on with pk.

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