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Would you rather have a Dungeon or a Raid?

75 posts in this topic

Posted

66145814.jpg

still the class is broken

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Posted

Even Crescent mobs drop an exclusive item, it's not what I meant. I am talking about themed dungeons with themed drops. Like boss armors and weapons with themed skins.

hmmm. More variety in the in game armours would be nice.. in fact, they don't even have to make unique op armour if they don't want to. Reskin existing armours and give them a special name.

Aakhmans spirit armour, looks like generate but the chest, abdomen and shoulders git metal plates and the bottom is a metal skirt. Same stats as tree spirit.

He'll. Even lower level dungeons which drop reskinned grunils, heve, rocaba. In fact maybe have the bosses have a low chance to drop +15 armour/weps

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Posted

this game would be amazeing with dungeons and raids, I actually dont get why we dont really have any apart from that one in the desert.

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Posted

this game would be amazeing with dungeons and raids, I actually dont get why we dont really have any apart from that one in the desert.

I get why we didn't before. I don't get why we don't now that they decided to kill OWPvP.

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Posted

The topic itself about dungeons has gone around sometime, and I think we can all agree that BDO's playstyle is very nice. We definitely don't want to end up like up MMO's with dungeon settings in which all you have left to do is run it over and over and over....  But that doesn't necessarily mean that having a dungeon of some kind is a bad thing.

So, if we were to get some type of dungeon, what would you prefer? Open field? Instanced zone? Solo? Party? Full Scale Raid? "Waves" (think disco ball)? What kind of drops? Gear? Bosses?

I'd love to pick everyones brain on the matter.

 

Me personally, I would love to an open instanced dungeon that is never the same twice.  A true Labyrinth of constantly changing walls, traps, monsters, and spontaneous difficulty.  What better type of dungeon to compliment BDO's RNG feature than a Labyrinth? A truly *unfair* dungeon.

I really would like something on the line of the good old "Extreme Cube System", was best of both worlds, a pve dungeon with pvp option. Only cons I see it's this would mean having it instanced - differing somehow from the game philosophy.

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Posted

I would be happy to see if they will improve little social part,I mean in 1st place playing in groups...

There no need to be dungeon just maybe more role playing - maybe some class connected (then ppl will have reason to group anywhere) some bonus if you play in group,more harder zones,bosses...

Some small scale pvp,strategic like 3vs3,5vs5,6vs6 to boost little rbf...

Anyhow in my opinion and what I heard ppl get bored because solo grind fest.

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Posted

I would be happy to see if they will improve little social part,I mean in 1st place playing in groups...

There no need to be dungeon just maybe more role playing - maybe some class connected (then ppl will have reason to group anywhere) some bonus if you play in group,more harder zones,bosses...

Some small scale pvp,strategic like 3vs3,5vs5,6vs6 to boost little rbf...

Anyhow in my opinion and what I heard ppl get bored because solo grind fest.

like perhaps a weekly system event that everyone can attend? this is probably my next topic

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Posted (edited)

anything what will make ppl to play together more  :)

I played 4y 1 very bad game,but I stayed so much there because of the ppl,and they are still there...

You have here a beautiful game but its solo game and after a few months became boring...

No its not up to guild,etc...The game is currently like this...solo playing game...

 

Edited by Lehel
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Posted

Well, the thing is, games have instanced dungeons for bosses because that's what allows for the most interesting fights. I mean, take a game like Vindictus for example; the big bosses there are very challenging and skill-based, to the point that 1 great player can solo them while a full party of 8 people can have 0 chance of success if none of them are good enough, even with the exact same gear as the solo player. But what happens if you throw 50 people at it instead, with unlimited revives because it's in an open world, so people can just walk back? What happens is that skill is no longer important, because sheer numbers and persistence (i.e., zerging) will bring the boss down anyway.

Of course, this has been tackled before with "world event" type scenarios. In GW2 for example, the big world bosses are beaten not through the player's skill at controlling their character, but by the mechanics that are provided by the event. For example, you may have siege weaponry that players must fire at the otherwise-invulnerable boss while other players have to protect the siege weapons from attack, alongside other mechanics and usually changing between each phase. Done well this can provide a challenge immune to simple zerging and can be incredibly interesting and engaging...the first few times you do it. The problem is that these events get stale all the same because they are, by their nature, the same thing every time; the mechanics that are so intricately-designed become no less routine when you've done them 100 times before.

So we have three choices here:

1. The current choice, open world zerg bosses. Boring, to be sure, but the simplest means of making open-world bosses.

2. Instanced bosses, which the player-base in general doesn't want but can be the most consistently-fun because they can demand very high player skill, keeping you on your toes and engaged in every encounter.

3. Open world "event"-type bosses, which can again be much more entertaining at first but just as mind-numbing as zerg bosses once the player-base gets used to the mechanics. They are also much more difficult and time-consuming to create, adding the additional layer of intricate mechanics to the mix.

Is it worth the extra development time to go with option 3 just for the initial enjoyment when the boss is first released? We would still be complaining a month after that when the boss becomes stale and mind-numbing, but it would definitely make me more excited about new bosses. My personal choice would be number 2, but I realize it's an unpopular opinion.

All that said, maybe there's a way to make 3 more consistently-entertaining; maybe through a random combination of mechanics on each spawn, chosen from a long list of options? I've never seen it done and I don't think it's quite PA's forte so I don't think they'll be the ones to figure such a thing out, but it's always possible I suppose.

^ Totally true points.

I'd personally prefer #2, but I realize that's an "unpopular opinion" among the Black Desert playerbase. 

Or is it? I feel like they should send current players an official poll with incentives to complete the poll (Like a 1G bar). Tons of players could miss a lone thread on the forums. I know my RL friends all love dungeons and we miss the feeling of having to ban together to accomplish something in PvE. Grinding gets boring :/ Our minds want to be challenged. 

 

Some small scale pvp,strategic like 3vs3,5vs5,6vs6 to boost little rbf...

 

The problem with PvP in this game is that it's too gear dependent. That would be okay, except gear is too RNG dependent. A lot of casual players have given up on the idea of ever participating in PvP. 

Even if they do implement small scale PvP, we wouldn't have a chance of participating UNLESS it went purely Skill2Win OR gave us a cheaper alternative to force enchant our gear. 

As it stands, only people who have time and/or amazing luck are engaging in PvP. 

I prefer PvE content to be added to Black Desert - not because I enjoy PvE more, but because I've given up on ever being able to be competitive. The RNG is waaaay too depressing for someone who can't play daily. Even on the days when I log in, I can only play for 30 minutes- an hour max. Sometimes I have to skip 3-6 days. 

Other MMOs have made PvP skill based so everyone can participate in PvP, but I doubt Black Desert will ever go that route. 

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Posted (edited)

 

 I understand your point regarding pvp but it will never be nowhere "fair" play. :x

Near the gear what is much or less the same mostly in all games ( somewhere is normal who are playing more to have more) think about how much influence has fluent internet,good mouse,good computer,current psycho state and other environment things...

I would put myself in active casual player group,I know I will never be competitive to the top geared,experience ppl but I dont care.I would like to have fun in pvp and in pve too... Btw, they could make random groups vs random groups and made groups vs made groups like small scale strategical pvp...bring something from point A to point B in RBF,destroy xp things in RBF,etc... :)

Random vs random group pvp will give you equal chance to get the same chance like everyone and maybe will boost pvp...

Also they can add some seal near the red ones which could be exchanged for gear,memory frags,costume part or anything....

Edited by Lehel
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Posted

Dynamically changing difficulty, amount of mobs, spawn-rate, drop-rate, loot and xp depending on player number and level for any area and dungeon is missing totally in BDO. Promoting teaming up / grouping up or just "grinding" together should be also rewarded.

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Posted

66145814.thumb.jpg.80df2ba58baa26d660aec

Afbeeldingsresultaat voor what if i told you that i don't care

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Posted

One Word..... None

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Posted

I would love to see open-world dungeons AND the ability to form raids of 10-20 people. I understand that might impact PVP, so I'd be okay with the game somehow disallowing PVP while in a raid, or only being able to raid in a certain radius of the dungeon, etc. I think one of the things this game is missing the most is large-scale group content. Sure, there's RBF. But it has ONE map (maybe new maps?) that's essentially just Castle Ruins copied and pasted...and world bosses at all are kinda meh at this point. Dungeons where people need to work together could help guilds and encourage community.

I'd also like to see at least some group dungeon/raid quests where there is more than just combat - maybe puzzles, mazes, WITH combat, but have a logical portion of the area, too. Or even just secret areas.

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Posted

Great topic!

Thoughts on a great dungeon for BDO:

A BIG NO to instanced dungeons.  Where's the reward or excitement in that?  NONE. 
They should be open world, open pvp, high risk-reward (gather XYZ amount of an item for turns-in, etc.)
They should be something actually challenging\fun.  Unique mobs that you approach carefully.  Grinding can be fun when done right.
Best dungeon's in any MMO to date are those found in Lineage 2 \ Old school Catacombs \ TOI was also great.
Dungeons should NOT be considered as a "daily" to get done.  That's cheap and becomes a chore...  
It should be an organic dwelling place of awesomeness, risk, reward, and excitement!
Something that would push more of a need for group mechanics\play.

Oh, and the ability to stay in a dungeon for days\weeks if I wanted to. 

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Posted (edited)

Promoting teaming up / grouping up or just "grinding" together should be also rewarded.

^ This!

At the very least they should remove the debuff to loot we get when we group up together. I don't understand an MMO that punishes players for wanting to do stuff together. 

Promoting teaming up / grouping up or just "grinding" together should be also rewarded.

Agreed.

At the very least they should remove the debuff to loot we get when we group up together. I don't understand an MMO that punishes players for wanting to do stuff together. 

Edited by Vorkrunne

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Posted (edited)

Fan of dungeons and raids. Not a fan of gear gating the community behind dungeons and raids. I cannot casual play every other MMO in the industry without just looking and being plain with zero growth of the character. 

In BDO RNG is our raid which makes it possible for even the most casual player to see BiS gear at somepoint. Now if they made dungeons/raids capable of being solo'd as well with worse RNG than a full on party that could be good

Edited by Majorapplesauce

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Posted

raid boss is coming, aka, awakening scroll, dungeon... idk man, I just don't know :(

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Posted

An open world, moving walls, labyrinth would be great. Have it take away the map function once inside too.

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Posted (edited)

You guys want to turn this into another dungeon/instance game instead of what it truly is... go home, drunk people man... 

 

1 instance that you can clear and never go at it again?? WTF, this is not even part of black desert... we still go to olvia to do daily quests that are important even if ur lvl 60... heck I do them and im 60 with decent life skill cuz theyre rewarding... why do you guys wanna turn this into an mmo where after you clear one map you move on to the next, never to go back at it again? 

 

Why do you guys want dungeon? for a boss at the end of the run? dude, we have world boss for that and heck tons of mobs drop various gear... some may say boss gear isnt the best but some may not... i see people with various gear and they still kick ass without boss gear. Are you making this post because you dont have boss gear and you want one easily obtain via dungeon/instance?? is it because people out there are way too strong for you and you cant compete with them so you want a solo based instance where no-one else can grind except you? and do it over and over again?? without getting griefed? 

 

thats not bdo man... just not bdo... 

 

you are given the option to group to whatever you want... heck even grouping in worldboss/field boss is rewarding cuz they give higher loot chance... hysteria and ahkman is rewarding in group because to be able to be effecient, you need people who can use party pots, drag mobs, aoe mobs and cc mobs...all these group stuff you are looking for are already in game... the only thing stopping you is you. 

 

if you guys want a computer generated field in the game... ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR FKING MIND!!?? we have desync, bad pop up that crashes the game AND YOU WANT MORE FEATURE THAT WILL FUQ THE GAME ENGINE? THIS IS JUST -.- do you even understand the capabilities of a game engine?

Edited by Nanaro
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Posted (edited)

More PVE content is never a bad thing. I'm pretty sure this game has more people leaving than joining. And a huge reason is RNG and the grind. Some PVE besides grinding the same mobs over and over again in a circle would be great.  A good dungeon system with guaranteed drops (doesn't have to be BiS) would go a long way to keeping this game alive. 

Edited by klientel

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Posted

A dungeon with a boss with REAL mechanics would be so darn nice. Black desert is great but they need to fix the bosses mechanics ( majority) and players mechanics too because is really a mess when it comes down to raid and what not. 

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Posted

speaking individually on the subject of Raids....what do you think constitutes a RAID system? large group? traps? many levels? time limitations?

also on another note, what type of gear do you think would be worthy of such a system? perhaps some ideas on some stats? or maybe an artwork concept?

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Posted (edited)

speaking individually on the subject of Raids....what do you think constitutes a RAID system? large group? traps? many levels? time limitations?

also on another note, what type of gear do you think would be worthy of such a system? perhaps some ideas on some stats? or maybe an artwork concept?

I have an idea of a complex RAID mechanic: The Mobs / Monsters are intelligent and have an ingenious attacking and defence strategy which is split up into many different  and specialised units and groups.

To survive your group just need to be strong, very strong! But to win your group must also split up into different sub-groups with different task and must act in time to disable enemy traps, weapons and e.g. powerful mages who do resurrect their fallen member continuously. So, her is also timing and thinking required to succeed.

And if the enemy randomly do change their strategy, this will make it more challenging.  

Edited by Joungf

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Posted

I have an idea of a complex RAID mechanic: The Mobs / Monsters are intelligent and have an ingenious attacking and defence strategy which is split up into many different  and specialised units and groups.

To survive your group just need to be strong, very strong! But to win your group must also split up into different sub-groups with different task and must act in time to disable enemy traps, weapons and e.g. powerful mages who do resurrect their fallen member continuously. So, her is also timing and thinking required to succeed.

And if the enemy randomly do change their strategy, this will make it more challenging.  

This is an interesting concept indeed. Would you care to elaborate and go into more detail if you have some time to write it up? ^_^

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