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Serious question about Wizard

31 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

How come this warrior didn't get one shot through block with ULT.

Just sayin.

This is for you Irrelevant.  As you have shown your Tamer getting blown up through block I bring you equal geared warrior and wiz.  Warrior walking right into the ult and barely hurts him.

 

Wiz ap 202 dp 272. Warr ap 222 dp 268.

Edited by Lemonz

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Posted

Argument for NA/EU game client

Shows a kr video.

*Clap Clap*

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Posted

plz dun nurf wiz, I wud haev to postphone my pvp debute for 9 more months!

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Posted

Better than the rigged videos in the other thread.

Perhaps someone can make a real duel video with equal geared wiz vs war, sorc, tamer..... 

Version wise they have the same stuff as us.  Well KR just modified the 100% on wiz.  But this video was before that change so still relevant to our version.

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Posted

This video is a bit more credible since it's an actual fight, and low and behold the meteor strike does not one shot. 

The thing is, and what someone mention in the earlier post is they think I that I'm too arrogant to admit I could be wrong. Well that's not true, I will gladly admit fault if I truly believe that with enough evidence of test conditions that the spell oneshots when would admit it is OP. But clearly through another video it isn't, not in a real battle. 

And true even this video isn't enough proof to be 100% sure so the only way for it to be sure is run wizard against all classes, multiple times under test condition in different scenarios. You would have then results that are factual and hopefully unbiased. 

Me personally I don't think it's op. Wizard in my opinion is meant to have awesome AP to make up for crappy mobility, crappy DP and prone to knockdowns and stun more than any other class in my opinion. 

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Posted

Argument for NA/EU game client

Shows a kr video.

*Clap Clap*

That isn't KR

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Posted

Tamer block and Warrior block are innately different. Not to mention, the innate dp scaling is much higher on warrior + their passive tree boosts it further. WIth 260 dp, they're tankier than other classes. It doesn't help that they can add 40 more dp via buffs.

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Posted

 

 

Wiz ap 202 dp 272. Warr ap 222 dp 268.

Source for these stats? I have looked through all of the videos linked tot hat youtube account from the past 5 months (not so many). And he doesn't show his gear in any.

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Posted (edited)

I found the original thread. Honestly, Irrelevant is... a big crybaby, just like a lot of the other tamers. He's had better gear than the majority of the players on NA/EU for a long time, and is apparently incredibly high ranked in RBF despite the apparent issues his class faces. I've seen a tamer with 20 less awakened ap and 18 dp just completely wreck people in one combo while it would take me two combos to kill them. Tamer is an extremely strong 1v1 class with good presence in small scale battles. They aren't as entirely broken as the top tier classes, but they are extremely strong. Not to mention the fact that their %s are significantly lower than the other classes, yet they have no issues putting out some real hurting on other people. But this thread isn't about tamers.

Wizards are overpowered. Extremely. As are witches. Their kit is way too complete. But then again, that's all the main classes in this game are and have been since the start. They just raised the bar up to 11 for them with awakening and some subsequent buffs that the classes really didn't need. Honestly, when they do get around to balancing things better, I don't see the situation improving much. Certain classes have just continued to get better and better each rebalance. Since they start of the game, they've done nothing but buff zerkers when they didn't need any additional buffs beyond what they got pre-awakening. It's become the strongest 1v1 class, with extremely strong presence up even into sieges.

The original intention of awakenings was to extend the abilities of the class beyond their initial conceived role. Most of the best awakenings accomplish this, meanwhile the lower tier classes don't get this benefit. Their awakenings, while making the classes themselves stronger as whole, don't really expand their capabilities besides funneling more single-target damage into the class or making them tankier. It's why valk, ninja, and tamer are considered dumpster fire classes. They have somewhat strong presence in small scale, but decline greatly when they're pitted into the endgame with the other classes with more wholesome kits.

Back to the main point with the wizard ult....Like I said, Warrior block is very strong because 1. All blocks scale off of hp and dp, which warriors will always have more in in spades compared to other classes besides valk/zerker/dp witch. 2. DP scales slightly better for warrior before and after block. 3. Warriors have better defense pre-dp scaling due to the way the passive tree works. 4. Warriors can get a free extra 40 dp as well, making them even tankier. Then you also take into account that the wizard ult didn't get off the first initial hit, and what I believe is that he didn't break the warrior's block, but rather got some hits off around the block. Why? The warrior isn't stunned as he would be for a second if you broke his block. He continued forward and grabbed the wizard, then finished him off.

Source for these stats? I have looked through all of the videos linked tot hat youtube account from the past 5 months (not so many). And he doesn't show his gear in any.

d6a65720f5.png

Edited by Xenon
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Posted

Source for these stats? I have looked through all of the videos linked tot hat youtube account from the past 5 months (not so many). And he doesn't show his gear in any.

I'm glad you looked extremely hard to find his stats that above poster mentioned lol.

 

He also shows his gear in this video... if you watched it.
He puts on a new dagger bringing up his stats...

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Posted

Crappy mobility?

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Posted

Wizard need buff, everyone know that.

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Posted

Tamer block and Warrior block are innately different. Not to mention, the innate dp scaling is much higher on warrior + their passive tree boosts it further. WIth 260 dp, they're tankier than other classes. It doesn't help that they can add 40 more dp via buffs.

The real question should be then is tamer broken against magic damage or something of that sort.  Not nerf Wizard.

Because its not just warrior that doesn't get one shot and can block their ULT.  Its multiple other classes including the witch that was in the video with the tamer that got one shot.

The witch survived.  

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Posted (edited)

The real question should be then is tamer broken against magic damage or something of that sort.  Not nerf Wizard.
Because its not just warrior that doesn't get one shot and can block their ULT.  Its multiple other classes including the witch that was in the video with the tamer that got one shot.

The witch survived.  

I think you are missing the overall point. 200 AP in terms of the gamestate now is doable in less than a month of playing. It is easily achievable. Anyone even casually playing to the nth degree can reach it. Look at what the ulti does at that AP. Now take 205 AP, 210, 215.... none of the witch abilities do what that ult does for example at those levels of AP. The wiz ult is the best ult in the game without even trying. It does the most damage with the least requirement of gear and takes 0 aiming. That is what makes something broken, its power compared to gear score. If you don't see how ridiculously powerful that ability is with basically no gear.... I don't even know why we are talking. Look I get it, wizards got beat on for a while with no awakening and now that we all have our awakenings you don't want this incredibly powerful ability nerfed..... but dude you guys gotta look past that for a second and really see how broken of an ulti it is. 

Literally wizards in pvp now just sit back, wait for ulti, ulti bomb, profit. Its cheesy as hell and poor design. If wizards are worried they are too weak after I assure you they arent, but I'd even be fine with then giving a slight buff on their regular spells to compensate. Right now the wiz ulti is just cheezy and boring. There really isn't counterplay to it given its size, teleport, protected area, etc. combos. If you feel like the way to win this argument is that a 200 AP wiz didn't 1 shot a warrior holding block so its balanced.... I just shake my head.

 

Then again, these discussions are irrelevant. Kakao does not take our feedback, never has never will. They maybe take KR feedback and frankly from what I can tell there, they generally have their idea of balance and ignore others for the most part (and move very very slowly). Given their timetable even if they think the wiz ulti needs toning down, it won't happen for another 4-5 months on the KR server (given past nerfs and their timelines). To be clear anyone who thinks removing bound on their ulti actually makes it weaker damage wise is kidding themselves.

 

 

 

edit: upon rewatching im actually skeptical the warrior even got hit by the ulti. At least by a full hit. Almost looks like desync on the wiz screen that the warrior is in the area, but I don't think he actually is for the first half of the ulti.

Edited by Huntler
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Posted

isn't their head chase a iframe? he was nearing the end of his dash animation on the initial hit and took no damage until the after the initial explosion

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Posted

I think you are missing the overall point. 200 AP in terms of the gamestate now is doable in less than a month of playing. It is easily achievable. Anyone even casually playing to the nth degree can reach it. Look at what the ulti does at that AP. Now take 205 AP, 210, 215.... none of the witch abilities do what that ult does for example at those levels of AP. The wiz ult is the best ult in the game without even trying. It does the most damage with the least requirement of gear and takes 0 aiming. That is what makes something broken, its power compared to gear score. If you don't see how ridiculously powerful that ability is with basically no gear.... I don't even know why we are talking. Look I get it, wizards got beat on for a while with no awakening and now that we all have our awakenings you don't want this incredibly powerful ability nerfed..... but dude you guys gotta look past that for a second and really see how broken of an ulti it is. 

Literally wizards in pvp now just sit back, wait for ulti, ulti bomb, profit. Its cheesy as hell and poor design. If wizards are worried they are too weak after I assure you they arent, but I'd even be fine with then giving a slight buff on their regular spells to compensate. Right now the wiz ulti is just cheezy and boring. There really isn't counterplay to it given its size, teleport, protected area, etc. combos. If you feel like the way to win this argument is that a 200 AP wiz didn't 1 shot a warrior holding block so its balanced.... I just shake my head.

 

Then again, these discussions are irrelevant. Kakao does not take our feedback, never has never will. They maybe take KR feedback and frankly from what I can tell there, they generally have their idea of balance and ignore others for the most part (and move very very slowly). Given their timetable even if they think the wiz ulti needs toning down, it won't happen for another 4-5 months on the KR server (given past nerfs and their timelines). To be clear anyone who thinks removing bound on their ulti actually makes it weaker damage wise is kidding themselves.

Im not trying to win the argument im pointing out that not everyone is getting one shot and theres nothing to do about it.  Again I will reference the vid irrelevant posted where his tamer is one shot yet the witch that was also blocking lived just fine.

Which brings me back to the point I made earlier that maybe its a problem with Tamer.  I am not denying the ULT is strong.  But at the same time Wiz/Witch literally have the least amount of mobility in game.  And are fairly easy to take down once you lock them down. Just like any class I suppose.

However if you are super armored and in a frontal block then a Wiz ULT is not going to do much.  If you just stand there and take it while they are E buffed then ya its gg most of the time.  Unless you are a zerker or war/valk.  Even standing still they will still have like 25% hp left.

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Posted

video proves wiz isn't op. Why this Convo still exists is beyond me

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Posted

I wonder at what AP this becomes OP because its not at 190 to 200 ap.

Also isn't there already a nerf for this ability that just came out in KR that hasn't reached NA servers yet.

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Posted (edited)

Well..

https://clips.twitch.tv/twirow/SleepyLyrebirdKAPOW

The guy is more geared than most players... but one person wiping out guilds? Warriors all over again..

More geared than most?  Try .1% top geared.  He has nearly full PEN pushing close to 285 AP..... any class will nuke at his gear level haha. If he had his PEN Nouver equipped it would have been even more damage.

Edited by Lemonz

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Posted

More geared than most?  Try .1% top geared.  He has nearly full PEN pushing close to 300 AP..... any class will nuke at his gear level haha.

thats what i was about to say as well... i saw a vid of a kr witch with nearly full PEN boss gear + PEN dande killing a whole guild, but thats not the class that is op. its the gear.

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Posted

thats what i was about to say as well... i saw a vid of a kr witch with nearly full PEN boss gear + PEN dande killing a whole guild, but thats not the class that is op. its the gear.

Id love to see a link of that haha for science.

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Posted (edited)

Id love to see a link of that haha for science.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QgGjRuICK8&t=515s i think this might be the one....

if you go to 1:40 ish you will see this person jumping into a group of enemy and killed a bunch

Edited by Naberios

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Posted

So I play a zerk and have 4K hp and 288 dp and was oneshot by a wizard ultimate...still don't think the ulti needs a nerf.  The thing with wizards is that even with double teleport they're easy to catch and if they're caught their dead unless they have a SIGNIFICANT gear advantage.  Their mobility sucks and if you can't catch them you're bad, double teleport has a cd and EVERY class can cover the distance of the teleport before its off cd

 

honestly i have more of a problem with the stupid spammable water bubble that knocks people down, only because it's irritating 

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Posted (edited)

Something I'm noticing that's incredibly common with people getting hit by the Wizard Ult.

They are stood directly in the middle of the explosion radius.

If it works like the Witch one, that means it's also hitting in the back as they're not blocking all the hits generated, try dodging backwards then blocking, that way you aren't getting hit in the back.

Edit: Yes the explosion generates hits in the radius, therefore if you're on the edge and blocking you should block it, but if you're in the middle your block is doing nothing because it's going to hit you in the back.

Edited by MadMaximoff

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