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Fix desert pvp


8 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

In the current state of the game, killing an another player in the desert is more punishing than being killed (respawning at the closest node), in my opinion this is a flawed mechanic because the desert area was supposed to be an area that encourages pvp between players, which it clearly does not as dying in the desert with an outlaw debuff is worse than dying in mainland with a lvl 60 character who's at 0.00 xp.

There have to be consequences for pking in the desert so that it doesn't turn into a killing fest, however pvp should be encouraged. This is why I believe that the desert pvp mechanics should be changed, first of all you have to take into consideration that the outlaw buff lasts for 30 minutes meaning that if you manage to kill someone (even on positive karma) you cannot defend yourself for the next 30 minutes until you're going to contribute to losing more karma. This pushes a player who kills a single person in the desert to further negative karma which does not encourage pvping at all, this is because going negative karma has alot more consequences than staying at postive karma and is hard to grind back, especially in the desert.

Negative karma causes you to become freely attackable by anyone and causes you to be isolated in the desert unless you're going to risk losing gems,xp and possible enchantment levels in the mainland. This means that the game also excludes you from majority of game content such as bosses as even in the desert doing nouver will be pretty much impossible, this is because you're permanently flagged for pvp.

Combating this in my opinion is really easy, firstly remove karma loss in the desert, this would allow players who pvp in the desert to still attend bosses and normal grinding spots as long as they do not kill anyone on mainland, in short I believe that karma should be only applied to non desert areas and should have no effect on the desert area, the desert is well, deserted so there are not enough witnesses to make you 'hated' in mainland (as a role playing excuse if anyone needs it)

secondly make the outlaw buff appear instantly after you attack someone (this is so that you do not have to die on purpose to send someone to jail) but if the attacker does not manage to kill the target make the duration of it shorter e.g 15 minutes instead of 30 minutes for a normal kill. 

Furthermore being flagged permanently for negative karma in the desert has to be removed, the only time where a person should be flagged for pvp is when he has killed/attacked someone in the past 30/15 minutes. This would create an equal ground for people in the desert showing that theres no negative karma/positive karma players in the desert. Also this allows frequent player killers to attempt nouver as long as they've not attacked/killed anyone in the past 15/30 minutes

Lastly in my opinion respawning at the closest node should be removed from the desert, this would also equal out the rules between positive/negative karma players for example a player with an outlaw debuff goes to jail if killed whilst a victim of an outlaw can respawn at the nearest town if killed, this means that death in the desert has small consequences for both people because they waste a little bit of time although nothing extreme like exp loss. This also removes the "kill someone come back 1 minute later and send the dude to jail" situation that can be exploited currently, by respawning in the closest town it is still possible to take revenge on an outlaw player but it will take around 5-10 minutes before you can get back to the place/find where he is. 

One more thing, if you get attacked in the desert whilst having an outlaw debuff your duration should be reset up to 3 minutes even if blocking. This is to combat ppl who wait out combat by continuously blocking and making themselves lose the debuff, you should not be able to lose the outlaw status whilst under attack or else it just does not make sense, if your timer is above 3 minutes no penalty is applied.

probably an unpopular opinion but thanks.

Edited by Przemoboski

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Posted

In the current state of the game, killing an another player in the desert is more punishing than being killed (respawning at the closest node), in my opinion this is a flawed mechanic because the desert area was supposed to be an area that encourages pvp between players, which it clearly does not as dying in the desert with an outlaw debuff is worse than dying in mainland with a lvl 60 character who's at 0.00 xp.

There have to be consequences for pking in the desert so that it doesn't turn into a killing fest, however pvp should be encouraged. This is why I believe that the desert pvp mechanics should be changed, first of all you have to take into consideration that the outlaw buff lasts for 30 minutes meaning that if you manage to kill someone (even on positive karma) you cannot defend yourself for the next 30 minutes until you're going to contribute to losing more karma. This pushes a player who kills a single person in the desert to further negative karma which does not encourage pvping at all, this is because going negative karma has alot more consequences than staying at postive karma and is hard to grind back, especially in the desert.

Negative karma causes you to become freely attackable by anyone and causes you to be isolated in the desert unless you're going to risk losing gems,xp and possible enchantment levels in the mainland. This means that the game also excludes you from majority of game content such as bosses as even in the desert doing nouver will be pretty much impossible, this is because you're permanently flagged for pvp.

Combating this in my opinion is really easy, firstly remove karma loss in the desert, this would allow players who pvp in the desert to still attend bosses and normal grinding spots as long as they do not kill anyone on mainland, in short I believe that karma should be only applied to non desert areas and should have no effect on the desert area, the desert is well, deserted so there are not enough witnesses to make you 'hated' in mainland (as a role playing excuse if anyone needs it)

secondly make the outlaw buff appear instantly after you attack someone (this is so that you do not have to die on purpose to send someone to jail) but if the attacker does not manage to kill the target make the duration of it shorter e.g 15 minutes instead of 30 minutes for a normal kill. 

Furthermore being flagged permanently for negative karma in the desert has to be removed, the only time where a person should be flagged for pvp is when he has killed/attacked someone in the past 30/15 minutes. This would create an equal ground for people in the desert showing that theres no negative karma/positive karma players in the desert. Also this allows frequent player killers to attempt nouver as long as they've not attacked/killed anyone in the past 15/30 minutes

Lastly in my opinion respawning at the closest node should be removed from the desert, this would also equal out the rules between positive/negative karma players for example a player with an outlaw debuff goes to jail if killed whilst a victim of an outlaw can respawn at the nearest town if killed, this means that death in the desert has small consequences for both people because they waste a little bit of time although nothing extreme like exp loss. This also removes the "kill someone come back 1 minute later and send the dude to jail" situation that can be exploited currently, by respawning in the closest town it is still possible to take revenge on an outlaw player but it will take around 5-10 minutes before you can get back to the place/find where he is. 

One more thing, if you get attacked in the desert whilst having an outlaw debuff your duration should be reset up to 3 minutes even if blocking. This is to combat ppl who wait out combat by continuously blocking and making themselves lose the debuff, you should not be able to lose the outlaw status whilst under attack or else it just does not make sense, if your timer is above 3 minutes no penalty is applied.

probably an unpopular opinion but thanks.

That s because the desert is actually a jail in itself to contain the "evil" players (lol):

- kill someone get "Evil debuff"

- Guy come back you have two option: kill him again (in the end you are gonna be -karma coz butthurt dude is gonna keep coming back), or leave which render killing him in the first place useless (welcome to carebear desert).

So now you are negative karma (assuming you stick to pvp mentality) leaving desert expose you to downgrade etc.

- You gonna keep grinding and hoppe you get your karma back before someone come annoy you, and you have no other choice than defend yourself (loose more karma).

Where this is getting realy perverted is that in desert area karma recovery, given by mobs you kill, is infinitly lowered compared to everywhere else. This increasing greatly the chances for you to encounter another guy you gonna have to defend yourself against. And then it s just an endless vicious circle keeping you stuck in the desert.

 

Outlaw system in this game is broken in many aspects (described a million times already on the forum) and most of it could be fixed just by implementing a self defense condition, where you don't loose karma for just defending yourself being -karma or just having Evil Debuff.

I agree about the fact that they should make respawn everyone positive karma at ibellab for exemple, and miquuin (for negative karma) if they get killed in pvp with no other option possible.

I disagree that they should remove karma loss totaly in the desert, that would just be as retarded as current system but the other way around for attacker and attacked players.

Yes you shouldn't be able to disable Outlaw while still fighting it s stupid.

And one more thing fix the fact that when your mount/boat is carrying items you can't remote collect it where you do the remote collect. If you ever got killed with Evil debuff + positive karma and your camel had item on it, i m sure you know why i m saying this.

 

Well anyway don't expect anything constructive from this thread it s just gonna end up like the others, carebears calling Outlaw bully, Outlaw calling carebear well... carebear :P

 

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Posted

Where this is getting realy perverted is that in desert area karma recovery, given by mobs you kill, is infinitly lowered compared to everywhere else. This increasing greatly the chances for you to encounter another guy you gonna have to defend yourself against. And then it s just an endless vicious circle keeping you stuck in the desert.

Hey Panpan :) Source of this? (and you tried personaly?) 

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Posted (edited)

Hey Panpan :) Source of this? (and you tried personaly?) 

i was red only once but i remember how slow karma in the desert recovered. I believe it took me around 1hr to grind back 30k karma. Then i went to sausans and got the same in a few minutes.

Edited by Alexiel

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Posted

the karma system is in tatters really.

1. Agreed, no karma loss in the desert. Its a lawless land, who the heck is around to keep score.

2. desert system in all areas BUT the desert. again. lawless land, where da heck do the guards who drag you to prison come from?

3. In regualr areas, negative karma comes with all the bad stuff as well as being transported to Valencia prison on death. No killing 1 person then being treated like youre in negative karma for 30 mins.

4. Number 3 will help minimalise greifing from geared players side, but some form of concequence needs to go the other way to also keep karma greifing to minimum,

right now the game is about having patience to NOT Alt+C first, regular areas, just greif the players spot untill he flags, dies since i obviously out gear him, then wait patiently as he futily wastes 15-30 minutes of both our time till he realises he cant outfarm neither PK me so he leaves
In the desert its about greifing the other guy into flagging, letting him kill you first, then coming back from node 1 second away and sending him to jail.

That is a horribly SAD situation

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Posted

Or just remove the fact that once you're below like -100k karma you can't loose enchants or xp anymore, or only when your -1m. 

Would stop carebear nerds from trying to get you to die to mobs outside the desert to loose enchants, and encourage ppl to go balls deep red.

Desert wise I think maquin town (or however you spell it) should let you defend yourself too. Right now since it's a safe zone and when you're neg karma you can get attacked but not defend.

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Hey Panpan :) Source of this? (and you tried personaly?) 

Don t know any other source than my own experience on this but it s simple to test if you wanna see for yourself. Drop some karma try to recover it on mobs in desert and mediah for exemple and you ll see the difference.

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Posted (edited)

1st Any PvP death should be respawn in nearest city regardless what continet.

2nd Any second and above PvP death in same time span should add 10-20-30-40-50sec-up to 120 seconds(cap) respawn timer.

3rd That desert debuff needs to be reworked.

1st and 2nd would reduce PvE griefing by A LOT.

Edited by Aluminat

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