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Attendance on Sieges and Nodewars


94 posts in this topic

Posted

Having 10 fps and desyncs all over the place? 0 balance with warr/witch/wiz/zerk ? Ask Kakao to fix their shit or you won't have a single pvp guild by the end of the year.

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Posted

There's to many guilds aiming for Node Wars/Siege and not enough players to fill them. Every 60 sec or more there's a PvX or PvP guild recruiting for Node Wars and no one cares. BDO had this problem for a long time, ever since the hardcore PvP crowd started dropped of due to changes to open world PvP(protected guilds+ no PK XP loss).

I do see players looking for guild. However, they all search for a casual life skill guild with free fish buff lol. Apparently there's not enough of those. 

This game attracts a lot of casual players now for obvious reasons(you can play it afk). Big part of the community aren't interested in PvP period. While other semi-casuals(like myself) lacks free gaming time during evenings and has to avoid more competitive guilds for that reason.

There's also the gear- and level gap v.s new and older players. You have all these established guilds asking for level 58-59 and 460-480 AP/DP to join. Realise how long it takes for a new PvP oriented player to reach that.

But I think the main problem is lack of incentives. People aren't all that interested in doing stuff just "for fun" or to improve skill wise. It's a pretty standard(and sad) attitude in MMORPG's. They want a reward just for showing up. But unless you're in a powerhouse guild with T3 node + region in this game, always the winner, you're not getting much of a salary or incentive from doing GvG related.

 

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Posted

A reason why alot of the nodes seem "unclaimed" is not because no guild faught for it.
But 8 guilds tried to fight for it in 2 hours.

PA / Kakao had the great idea that merging servers into one and reducing node war times down to 2 hours would be a great idea.
It is not, if you are fighting 4+ guilds who are roughly equally matched, then you have almost 0 chance of anyone winning a node.
Actually they need to change it back to the 3 hours.

I am in a rather casual guild, a 'do whatever you like, no obligations' one, we do node wars twice a week with varying attendance besides the usual suspects that always show up so that we have a core team of maybe 15 people.

Sometimes we win sometimes we lose, but usually not without having a good time during the fight.

We go for T1 nodes and I have to fully agree with nollywood, since the merge there is alot more going on on T1s last big and fun fight was with 6 forts build, 3 guilds teaming up against us, nobody got the node in the end, that was when we had the 3 hour duration back, 2 hours is just not enough to wear down so many opponents, at the 2 hour mark we are usually in the heat of the fight with no clear winner yet, at least when you meet equally geared guilds, the exception being when you meet a more zergy guild.

I hope Pearl Abyss/Kakao will reconsider going back to 3 hours for node wars.

In regards to getting more people to attend node wars, difficult, from what I see and hear a lot of people think they are not ready yet for node wars, too low gear etc. I can only say that even a lower geared player can do a lot in a Hwacha or a Flame Tower while we level 60s go for the frontline, node wars are a team effort, the ones in the backline need some positive feedback.

I agree that some kind of pay out for taking part in a node war, equal in numbers to what you can make grinding in that time, could be something that makes more people consider it.

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Posted (edited)

I do believe that they have ruined siege wars by forcing guilds to remain on a single territory. As of right now it seems that Valencia and Mediah are uncontested, that would atleast be two large guilds in rotation if they woudn't be locked. It also made the sieges in general more dynamic, just very sad that they had to intervene in this way.

Edited by Judaism

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Posted

having low fps wars 

We've had ppl leave the guild and the game this week only because of this. And it happened continiously in all guilds i've been part of. Unless you have a monster pc, where siege is just a decent experience while still unpleasnt, the experience you will have during sieges is VERY BAD. 

I myself run the game from a laptop, which to my surprise can run games released in 2016 such as BF1 and other on ultira settings at 50-90fps; but bdo in siege is just terrible running at 1-15fps. 

 

It's just not fun. You do it, for the community that the guild has, but you get annoyed and bored of it at one moment.

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Posted

The optimisation is terrible, Today wasn't as bad as in previous weeks in Calpheon, when Wasted or just Oldskool were near our base (FUzion) it was playable (12-20 fps... yeah but playable) but when two guilds are inside/near your base its just impossible to fight in Calpheon Siege Area, its just terrible. 

That could be the main reason, but to be honest its just the lack of incentives for the losing guilds that makes people not want to join the Siege Scene, people just dont like taking orders and doing node and siege wars all week only to then get a small payout (heck even for me I feel money is not the reason I siege, come on... I can get 20-60+m a week from it even losing the siege itself so most guilds just skip that part (siege).

Look at former Jordine for example, from all the guilds that server has had in the Siege Scene today we just saw, Millennium and Sfora (Balanos), Enemy (Serendia) and FUzion (Calpheon), Morghulis is Rebuilding (Sfora just finished doing the same and they look solid), I don't know which guilds are from Alustin and Which are from Croxus but I guess the picture isn't much different, just a few guilds left from each server in the siege scene, the merge was promising, but the game itself is just not captivating pvp players it seems. Pearl Abyss/Kakao need to step up there game and put in some incentives at least for T2/T3 Node Wars and Siege (Especially SIEGE!)

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Posted (edited)

1. No reason for newer players to even try to compete with ppl who have played since day one and are 2 Levels and 50/50 AP/AAP ahead.

2. No reason for ppl with a PC with medium or low speccs to do Wars/Sieges because of insane bad optimisation and the resulting 5 FPS.

3. No reason for valks, ninjas, kunos, tamers, etc to do large scale PvP because their classes are just not viable.

Edited by Shinqt
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Posted

It's a PVE game that's why

 

 

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Posted

1. No reason for newer players to even try to compete with ppl who have played since day one and are 2 Levels and 50/50 AP/AAP ahead.

2. No reason for ppl with a PC with medium or low speccs to do Wars/Sieges because of insane bad optimisation and the resulting 5 FPS.

3. No reason for valks, ninjas, kunos, tamers, etc to do large scale PvP because their classes are just not viable.

1. ok il take that statement but nowadays you get Gear so much more easy via AH. We had to farm months of months to get gear actually can be bought of the AH

2. i got the worst PC EU and still can shotcall and fight so thats not really an excuse

3. Valks are beasts in Masspvp wtf you talkin bout? Ninjas and Kunos could act as invisible scouts or cannoneers just to give you an idea and the Tamer kit is OP IMHO

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Posted

1. No reason for newer players to even try to compete with ppl who have played since day one and are 2 Levels and 50/50 AP/AAP ahead.

2. No reason for ppl with a PC with medium or low speccs to do Wars/Sieges because of insane bad optimisation and the resulting 5 FPS.

3. No reason for valks, ninjas, kunos, tamers, etc to do large scale PvP because their classes are just not viable.

1. During a siege there is a job for everyone even when someone lack gear and level, those players can use flame towers, help with scouting, repair base and fences, ride an elephant etc.

2. Well thats a huge problem, it happened to us that our defence machines became usless becouse even best computers couldnt handle 150+ people zergs in one place, but on smaller scale with optimalization mode game should work smoothly.

3. You say so becouse you havent seen good tamers, kunos destroyin your cannon team with ease ;)

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Posted

Tbh tri grunil liverto and acc offhand is still pretty viable against people full boss gear if the class matchup and other things favour you.

Lvl 58 pvp wise is still pretty viable.

Valks are amaazing at pulling groups in mass pvp, really annoying.

Tamers, ninjas etc amazing at harrassing the backline or protecting your own.  We have a couple of really great tamers in our guild at least.

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Posted (edited)

 

1. ok il take that statement but nowadays you get Gear so much more easy via AH. We had to farm months of months to get gear actually can be bought of the AH

2. i got the worst PC EU and still can shotcall and fight so thats not really an excuse

3. Valks are beasts in Masspvp wtf you talkin bout? Ninjas and Kunos could act as invisible scouts or cannoneers just to give you an idea and the Tamer kit is OP IMHO

1. Doesn't matter if the gear is easy obtainable or not. People still have to farm Billions to be even halfway useful in T3 Nodewars. Which is not easy for newer players because every good Farmspot in the game is taken 90% of the time by people that allready have the gear and work on TET/PEN.

2. I got a decent PC and cant even do Zarka on primetime because its laggy af and I won't play in optimisation mode because it looks just ass.

3. Valks are beasts because they can pull, buff and use their 100% when its up to zone. Thats it. The fun part (fighting and killing) is for the other (FOTM) classes. Same goes for scouting.

-

1. During a siege there is a job for everyone even when someone lack gear and level, those players can use flame towers, help with scouting, repair base and fences, ride an elephant etc.

2. Well thats a huge problem, it happened to us that our defence machines became usless becouse even best computers couldnt handle 150+ people zergs in one place, but on smaller scale with optimalization mode game should work smoothly.

3. You say so becouse you havent seen good tamers, kunos destroyin your cannon team with ease ;)

1. The fun part (fighting) is for the other (FOTM) classes and geared players. Yaaaay.

2. Yes it is. Playing the game in optimisation mode is unfun just because it looks shit.

3. I have seen Level 61 players with sick gear doing that yes. (I played in a top 5 EU Guild) If you are just a average joe chances are high that you just die. And to get 100 people together you have to have many average joes that will have no fun in sieges/wars then. Which results in them not showing up. And if there are not enough people showing up you cant contest the Node/Castle.

 

I'm not devaluing that we all did alot to get our wins/levels/gear. But newer players will just not do PvP because its a 99% unfun experience if you are not playing for at least 3-4 Months. The barrier of entry is just too high and only a small group of people are willing to put the required work / time / money into the game to be able to compete.

 

Edited by Shinqt

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Posted

 

1. Doesn't matter if the gear is easy obtainable or not. People still have to farm Billions to be even halfway useful in T3 Nodewars. Which is not easy for newer players because every good Farmspot in the game is taken 90% of the time by people that allready have the gear and work on TET/PEN.

2. I got a decent PC and cant even do Zarka because its laggy af and I won't play in optimisation mode because it looks just ass.

3. Valks are beasts because they can pull, buff and use their 100% when its up to zone. Thats it. The fun part (fighting) is for the other (FOTM) classes. Same goes for scouting.

-

1. The fun part (fighting) is for the other (FOTM) classes and geared players. Yaaaay.

2. Yes it is.

3. I have seen Level 61 players with sick gear doing that yes. If you are just a average joe chances are high that you just die. And to get 100 people together you have to have many average joes that will have no fun in sieges/wars then.

It seems you just wanna say something bad bout the Game that you push that through no matter what tho. We dies countless times on Bosses from or from PK just do obtain gear that now gets casually into the AH. And if you say 96mil is much well then stop being that "average joe" and go grind! Go Pirates this is easy ~8mil/h even with your "average joe" gear. And just to block of the "But Spot blabberish" there are so many spots that arent grinded anymore cause the people have better gear then back in the days that those smaller spots are nearly always free. I just grinded my Sorc alt at pirates for like 1~2 weeks without any kind of disturbance cause i used that old spot. And well if you arent willing to put in work to ,no offense but, "git gud" you dont deserve to git gud. 

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Posted (edited)

You don't have to tell me to "git gud" because i am "gud". Atleast good enough to play in a Top 5 EU guild. I'm just trying to explain to you why there allways won't be enough people to have big competition on Sieges. This has nothing to do with my personal opinion on the game.

Newer or Weaker players will just not do PvP because its a 99% unfun experience if you are not playing for at least 3-4 Months. The barrier of entry is just too high and only a small group of people are willing to put the required work / time / money into the game to be able to compete. This means there are only a few people getting siege ready every month. On the same time there are people getting burned out and ragequitting over their bad luck at TET/PEN every day.

Edited by Shinqt

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Posted

You don't have to tell me to "git gud" because i am "gud". Atleast good enough to play in a Top 5 EU guild. I'm just trying to explain to you why there allways won't be enough people to have big competition on Sieges. This has nothing to do with my personal opinion on the game.

Newer or Weaker players will just not do PvP because its a 99% unfun experience if you are not playing for at least 3-4 Months. The barrier of entry is just too high and only a small group of people are willing to put the required work / time / money into the game to be able to compete. This means there are only a few people getting siege ready every month. On the same time there are people getting burned out and ragequitting over their bad luck at TET/PEN every day.

Like i said that was no offense i just wanted to use a Term the whole Forums i familiar with. And even then i wanna encourage them to get started doing Nodewars. The Thrill of a good fight is the most enjoyable thing for me in this game. And even if the gap between new and old might be big its not a thing People cant overcome and get head to head. So please be a bit more encouraging too so we might get even more nice wars going on and even a few new guilds that can compete with the "Top 10" Guilds!

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You don't have to tell me to "git gud" because i am "gud". Atleast good enough to play in a Top 5 EU guild. I'm just trying to explain to you why there allways won't be enough people to have big competition on Sieges. This has nothing to do with my personal opinion on the game.

Newer or Weaker players will just not do PvP because its a 99% unfun experience if you are not playing for at least 3-4 Months. The barrier of entry is just too high and only a small group of people are willing to put the required work / time / money into the game to be able to compete. This means there are only a few people getting siege ready every month. On the same time there are people getting burned out and ragequitting over their bad luck at TET/PEN every day.

So "gud" you won't even say what guild.

Also Top 5 before of after merge? Cause before merge the difference between #1 and #5 had a bigger hole than the point you're trying to make with your posts

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Posted (edited)

Change the Rules.

Node Wars:
Increase Node Wars time back to 3h.
Create Rental-Equipment players can use for 4 weeks of Node/Siege Wars after creation of their account/whenever they talk to said NPC with DUO Gear status (Can only be used when Node Wars at Node Wars Channel) which will then disappear.
Gives people the taste of what's to come. Now obviosly this system can be "abused" by players that create 7day trial accounts that want to play with DUO gear without any work.
Question is then, is that really a big deal?
DUO isn't endgame, but they can atleast be "useful" and try out whether or not BDO is a "PvP" game they want to invest in heavily.
 

T1 nodes should be limited to guilds of size 20-40
T2 nodes should be limited to guilds of size 20-60
T3 nodes shouldn't have a limit, if you wanna go, you can go.

Siege Wars:
Considering there aren't any real 100/100 Guilds left and the majority can pull 50-75 people, create a NPC where Guilds have to sign up before Siege and they can only register up to 50/60/70/75 players - Guilds can still have 100 or even 200 Members in their Guild if they wanted to with this system, as you can only sign up a portion of your Guild anyway.
Would create smaller GvGs which focuses more on the mechanics of the game, the teamplay of it and also create a "healtier" balance between Guilds that can't pull 70+ Players.

NUMBERS ARE ALL CHANGEABLE AND NOT SET IN STONE, DONT FOCUS ON THE NUMBERS GOOOYS.

There are plenty of Players out there that want to do real pvp and show off that they're the better players/guild, they're just not interested in "lagging" to victory.
The system is flawed, it's not all just the Players fault.

Edited by Norcal
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Posted

The reason why smaller guilds do not take part in nodewars is because they usually will either get zerged or ganged. This applies to any guild actually.

To be honest, the lack of an actual alliance system is the biggest issue. There's also no incentive for them to participate in those said wars. T1/T2 cost more to fight for than their actual payout most of the time. On top of that, there's little to no actual skill involved in large scale fights if you can pull enough numbers and macro management. If your macro is good enough, micro won't matter.

I think PA missed a good opportunity to make people engage in small-scale GvG : they could have implemented some kind of dynamic events as tax wagons popping up randomly, and whichever guild deals the most gets a payout, or each member of the guild who won gets a % of the wagon's content.

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Posted

It makes me almost touched to listen about all those ideas and rules regarding increased population of pvpers in BDO whereas we all know that there are only 2 reasons why pvp is not developing in the way we want:

-you need to be dedicated enough to reach really proper gear or you will be ripped in 1 combo -and thats on players side and thare are no short cuts and fast solutions

-you need to have provided conditions of play which encourage you to come node wars i.e. lag free, optimised environment - this is highly -----ed up by Devs

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Posted (edited)

its different reasons for different people. Only thing that bugs me tho is that after x amount of time the average apdp of everyone that put in minuscule amount of progression will eventually average on the same apdp required  to have a presence in mass pvp which means that soon numbers and numbers only will be king . In which case I do understand why some guilds without alliance choose to not come , low numbers but strong enough= ganged on (Ember on saturday). Low numbers= stomped. There just isn't any middleground. It's sad that the only way to beat an alliance of average apdp  guilds is to start doing alliances yourself but meh maybe in the future there will be other options. Evidence of this is already in Russia and Korea where allies of up to 300+ is made in sieges.

Edited by HOMRAH

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Posted

@Norcal 

There would be no reason to grow as a guild beyond certain points. (you stomp T1/T2? why grow and risk getting stomped on T3/siege?)

It would also kill a lot of guilds that are somewhere in between. (have the numbers but not strong enough to fight the big dogs on T3 and some T2, but too strong for majority of T1/T2, etc.)

Who would want to be in a 100 man guild when you have to sit at the sideline bcuz restrictions. who would even want to have 100 members when theres no use for it.

 

There's more than enough players in the game, just give them a chance to catch up and get into the siege/node scene.

And the optimization is being worked on.

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Posted

And the optimization is being worked on.

Can you elaborate?

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Posted

Can you elaborate?

Just read about PA working on it in a post somewhere. Hoping it's true lol :D

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Posted

Who on earth wants to spend every saturday evening from 7 PM till (possible) 12 PM for a siege where you play with -20.000 FPS on the most awfull lowest settings with terrible desync all around, besides that if a big guild makes an engage the lagg is so unbareable that before your screen recovered the FPS you were either oneshotted or you did your class combo in the "air" because somehow it will hit people.

@Norcal
Your ideas seem actually legit, would also help with the annoying facts stated above.

 

It's just not fun. You do it, for the community that the guild has, but you get annoyed and bored of it at one moment.

^   ^    ^   ^    ^ 
This

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Posted

Indeed good topic, those +lv60s in unknown guilds are in those guilds cuz they are comfortable there? i been in 2x semi-hc so far and it my experience was not worth the 50% slow down in my progress, these guilds can't afford to make up for this 50% progress unless you are sitting on a castle for too long like some NA guilds,

As lv60 with 220 ap & 3b silver liquidity, i don't see the point at all to even join "unknown guild", speaking for myself, unless you find a guild that is worth your time & 50% slow down in progress then you are better off, lots of ppl whisper me how i make my silver and my answer was always been "being guildless" if i want to pvp then i have arena/rbf/or low karma in desert, group pvp is coming soon in a 5v5/3v3 form.

I think we will be witnessing small scale guilds more than +90 attendance, all those big hc guilds ended in disbanding for different reasons.

i have lvl 60 with 240 ap and 1.5bil silver liquid, i don't see your point here, you just make up shitty excuses for being bad at the game and being a joke in pvp, you've always been and you'll always be, guilds have nothing to do with your progress, it's just you can't keep up with the pvp scene and you never have :)

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