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Why I think BDO is not Pay to win at all.


42 posts in this topic

Posted

I might be wrong, but here goes... my argument excludes pets because pets are too useful and effective (Pleaseee release ocean update so I can spend my time getting T3 pets from golden chests)

People do play BDO and work (I know cuz' ppl say they do without saying they lie) Working cuts out your time allotted to play and get better at the game (this means learning how to deal with other players, mobs, how to farm effectively, research, messing around so that you can bring yourself to grind for 4 or more hours non-stop [ONLY BREAK NO STOP] and much much more, BDO is a huge game).

Let's assume you spend 1200$ at 20% off buying value packs because Christmas bonuses are a thing I've heard and I REALLY want a value pack) You do this because you want to pay to win the game, you are a bad person! You bad person you! You sell 100 value packs at rounded up to 10m (because I am bad at maths) YOU JUST MADE 1Billion SILVER!!!!!!!!!! YOU WIN BDO

Not really, here is why. you just gave 100 people 30% more income from the market place for 30 days and 10% value on their grinding time for experience some of these players are hardcore players who don't spend money on games because they do not have excess or are simply Neets who  need a new video card (440 GE-FORCE please halp...) who play for 8 hours a day or more instead of working 40 hours a week.

If you want to talk costumes I make the same argument 10% experience gain plus other stuff, exchanging 30% from marketplace for vanity. YES for costumes!!

Pets are indispensable so can someone spend 50,000$ on pets so that I can win 10 bids (I really want t3 hawks plzz)

What I think people mistake, since you can never win a bid, is that when someone pays to win, they are at best simply paying to recover the time they could not spend on the game because they were working, they only do this they like the game and want to stay relative in the game because this game is competitive, and that is why WE PLAY SO FREAKING MUCH, we want to get good, and no amount of silver can make up for the experience and skills that you developing from actually investing yourself in the game and doing your best. That goes for people who put a few or a bunch of items in the Marketplace and who pick up a few or a bunch of items from the cash shop for themselves. The cash shop increases the value of your time and in my opinion that sucks, but game needs to live (P.S. please don't make things that cannot go to market like maid and fish costumeee). If you don't have pets the value of your time goes down, I think the more people who can get pets, the better, all game time should be of equal value in my opinion (P.S. Capitalism sucks)

I honestly think that being able to buy cash items for silver is a REALLY GOOD THING (don't hurt me) I am vain in games, I want costumes. I don't like to spend a lot of money on games for personal reasons... yeah... paying 20-50$ is pretty reasonable to be since BDO is a great game and if you have not already, you really should get 3 pets and earrings and a maid costume.

  • I would say that more than 1% of all items listed are asked to be listed by players in channel chat
  • Pearl tab of market is empty and is always empty so people clearly appreciate the help that people give by selling pearl items
  • Pearl items are price capped (Good work high-five!! Please fix normal market price caps too)
  • Value of items is less than 1$ per 2 million silver and I would trade all my silver for money at half that rate if there were a game supported way to do it (90% of you would do the same [ADMIT IT!!!]

Thank you for supporting both the game developers and players by using the cash shop, you rock! (POST 100 value packs please, or more. I think my luck requires at least 500 listed)
 

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Posted

All that text, but I really had a hard time finding anything valuable in it.

It kind of sounded like I'm totally new to the Free to Play model that has been out for years, so here are my thoughts on it!

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Posted

Houses.

Horses.

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Posted

basically what i have realised with p2w in this game is that it scales with your progression 

 

compare week old players with 50ap each, now give one of them 125mil extra silver on top of what they're getting now 

 

now compare end game players that are 220ap each and give on of them 125mil per week 

 

 

p2w is a non issue and end game, however new players get a HUGE boost in comparison 

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Posted (edited)

If you, sir, think that BDO is not P2W, then you haven't reached the end-game enchanting of boss armor/weapons. Once you get to the point where TET is your next upgrade, you will realize how P2W ARTISANS MEMORIES really are. PLUS you can make a ton of silver with them, just by upgrading stuff, and selling them.

 

Most people who claim this game not being P2W haven't reached the TET+ enchanting. This games only end-game is literally gear, and silver = gear.

Edited by Miki
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Posted

If you, sir, think that BDO is not P2W, then you haven't reached the end-game enchanting of boss armor/weapons. Once you get to the point where TET is your next upgrade, you will realize how P2W ARTISANS MEMORIES really are. PLUS you can make a ton of silver with them, just by upgrading stuff, and selling them.

 

Most people who claim this game not being P2W haven't reached the TET+ enchanting. This games only end-game is literally gear, and silver = gear.

... thinks Artisan will make you win. I have no word.

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Posted

We need certainly more threads about this subject, i've never seen it before or it hasn't been exhausted completely. I am truly convinced that since the release of the game, we didn't have a single thread about this matter with the personal opinion of someone and we didn't have time to discuss it nor the knowledges to agree/disagree with it. 

I am looking forward to see many threads like this one as i am in love to see the same argument with the same content repeated over and over again in different places, especially if the user is not the same and is unknown to the rest of playerbase.
So here's my like OP, you did an awesome job today and you also gained a follower!

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Posted

I think BDO is not pay 2 win at all if you ignore one of the major components of the cash shop

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Posted

If you, sir, think that BDO is not P2W, then you haven't reached the end-game enchanting of boss armor/weapons. Once you get to the point where TET is your next upgrade, you will realize how P2W ARTISANS MEMORIES really are. PLUS you can make a ton of silver with them, just by upgrading stuff, and selling them.

 

Most people who claim this game not being P2W haven't reached the TET+ enchanting. This games only end-game is literally gear, and silver = gear.

How about instead of repeating that line over and over yourself and everyone unfortunate enough to be in sight range of your posts, why dont you back it up with some actual numbers?

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Posted

It is not really hard math. I mean, if you know anything about how probabilities work, you should realize the facts.

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Posted

@OP Think harder.

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Posted

... thinks Artisan will make you win. I have no word.

He thinks that artisan memory will reduce a timesink/bottleneck that is fragments and subsequently give him more attempts on going Tet on his gear...what exactly is not making sense to you? If gear doesnt make you win why the hell is everyone blowing stuff up all day everyday?

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Posted

u know the costume selling is not all that bad and infact i think it benefits everyone but op do tell me how the 30% tax reduce from the value pack is not p2w. for players like me who have workers pumping out daggers/grunil/etc and then grind mobs and selling all the rare stuff that cost millions on market, do u have any idea how much more i make compare to ppl who does the same thing but without the value pack?

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Posted

as long as the game has some service that can be said to be similar to some premium membership (with in-game benefits) and/or cash shop items that are not purely cosmetic the game is essentially pay2win

pay4convenience can be considered pay2win and only isn't if you look at it very obscurely

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Posted

It's not a pay2win game, but there's so many pay4convenience stuff that someone willing to pay will get ahead.

Since you decided not to include pets, i will not but pets are crazy high in the list of pay4convenience.

 

1/ Artisan memory : CBA doing scrolls?  Save lot of time, lot of silver(not invested in scrolls), therefore more money gained ( from the time not wasted in scrolls)

2/ Storage Maids/ Branding of items : I know we all pretty much got free branding out of the black spirit games but still branding combined to maids(if you bought enough maids) is a lot of time gained on grinding time

3/ Bag/ LT increase : one of my personnal worst nightmare, trained my weight up to lvl33 (it takes forever past lvl30) and reached the maximum of LT increase through loyalties. Done all quests regarding bag size. The one paying get so much out of extra weight ( grinding time, afk processing, loading unloading crates ....) and bag size ( fishing mostly). You can never hope to get close with F2P.

Also depending on your class you can't be competitive for siege without LT increase. I was playing melee class, so I was chugging a lot of health pots, with low LT I couldn't carry enough of them. I was even crafting my own grain juice ( weight less than regular pots).

4/ Costumes (or anything that can be sold on marketplace) : $ for Ingame Money , enough said.

5/ Fish/ghillie/ processing costume : Both fish and ghillie are broken for obvious reasons. Processing, because combined with enough LT, you can pretty much afk process during your sleep time. The horse costume isn't there because it sucks ass.

6/ Combat Costumes : bunch of little advantages that gets you ahead

7/ Value pack : should probably be higher on the list since people try to snipe them of the marketplace all the time, you need to have one running.

8/ Storage in cities : Oh god how did I forgot this one? Should probably be top 2 in the broken pay4convenience items: you don't invest contribution in storage, contribution that you can put somewhere else where it will generate you money. Also you don't spend time grinding the contribution. But best of it all, the good houses are not used for storage, so you can use them for factories.

I probably already forgot a few.

And this doesn't include pets and the tier system on them.

 

Before I conclude it all, I believe the prices are way too high in this game for someone to buy all those conveniences yet there are a ton of players that don't mind paying weekly. And you'll need to play more than them to be able to compete, and still you'll get behind.

 

Ask a veteran of the game, they will all tell you to buy pets/ LT increase (and maybe costume?) to start the game comfortably.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted

long winded demonstration of ignorance

Artisan's Memory now allow a conversion rate of 1 euro to roughly 3.75 million silver on yellow boss gear and around 5.625 million silver on liverto or blue awakening (assuming 9mil per base item) with no monthly limit - confirmed by Kakao. (Korea is $300 / month max across all your cash shop spends, due to it being the law there).

There is a reason liverto and base blue awakening weapons went from dozens of each type available on the marketplace to sold out the day Artisan's Memory came into the cash shop. Coincidentally there was suddenly an abundance of TRI/TET for sale the same day, and ever since.

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Posted

Pay to win confirmed for Artisan's Memory...  the death of black desert is coming... it is a pity ;(

 

 

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Posted

how the ----- can people still be having page long write ups on this tired ass topic?

TL;DR

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Posted (edited)

I might be wrong, but here goes... my argument excludes pets because pets are too useful and effective (Pleaseee release ocean update so I can spend my time getting T3 pets from golden chests)

People do play BDO and work (I know cuz' ppl say they do without saying they lie) Working cuts out your time allotted to play and get better at the game (this means learning how to deal with other players, mobs, how to farm effectively, research, messing around so that you can bring yourself to grind for 4 or more hours non-stop [ONLY BREAK NO STOP] and much much more, BDO is a huge game).

Let's assume you spend 1200$ at 20% off buying value packs because Christmas bonuses are a thing I've heard and I REALLY want a value pack) You do this because you want to pay to win the game, you are a bad person! You bad person you! You sell 100 value packs at rounded up to 10m (because I am bad at maths) YOU JUST MADE 1Billion SILVER!!!!!!!!!! YOU WIN BDO

Not really, here is why. you just gave 100 people 30% more income from the market place for 30 days and 10% value on their grinding time for experience some of these players are hardcore players who don't spend money on games because they do not have excess or are simply Neets who  need a new video card (440 GE-FORCE please halp...) who play for 8 hours a day or more instead of working 40 hours a week.

If you want to talk costumes I make the same argument 10% experience gain plus other stuff, exchanging 30% from marketplace for vanity. YES for costumes!!

Pets are indispensable so can someone spend 50,000$ on pets so that I can win 10 bids (I really want t3 hawks plzz)

What I think people mistake, since you can never win a bid, is that when someone pays to win, they are at best simply paying to recover the time they could not spend on the game because they were working, they only do this they like the game and want to stay relative in the game because this game is competitive, and that is why WE PLAY SO FREAKING MUCH, we want to get good, and no amount of silver can make up for the experience and skills that you developing from actually investing yourself in the game and doing your best. That goes for people who put a few or a bunch of items in the Marketplace and who pick up a few or a bunch of items from the cash shop for themselves. The cash shop increases the value of your time and in my opinion that sucks, but game needs to live (P.S. please don't make things that cannot go to market like maid and fish costumeee). If you don't have pets the value of your time goes down, I think the more people who can get pets, the better, all game time should be of equal value in my opinion (P.S. Capitalism sucks)

I honestly think that being able to buy cash items for silver is a REALLY GOOD THING (don't hurt me) I am vain in games, I want costumes. I don't like to spend a lot of money on games for personal reasons... yeah... paying 20-50$ is pretty reasonable to be since BDO is a great game and if you have not already, you really should get 3 pets and earrings and a maid costume.

  • I would say that more than 1% of all items listed are asked to be listed by players in channel chat
  • Pearl tab of market is empty and is always empty so people clearly appreciate the help that people give by selling pearl items
  • Pearl items are price capped (Good work high-five!! Please fix normal market price caps too)
  • Value of items is less than 1$ per 2 million silver and I would trade all my silver for money at half that rate if there were a game supported way to do it (90% of you would do the same [ADMIT IT!!!]

Thank you for supporting both the game developers and players by using the cash shop, you rock! (POST 100 value packs please, or more. I think my luck requires at least 500 listed)
 

Wall of text and nothing really worth to read...

Anyway tell me pls why you try to scam players who spend money on this game? You did all of this just to pursuade ppl to buy Vp and give you bigger chance to buy VP?

Look at math:

Value pack is around 700k silver per 1 euro spend

Artisan memories is around 3,3m per 1 euro spend

Artisan memories give you simply over 400% more silver then VP that means you pursuading players to buy VP and sell them on VP which in the end will give them less silver then they could get by buying artisan memories- is simply scam...

Edited by Dorsai

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Posted (edited)

Artisan's Memory now allow a conversion rate of 1 euro to roughly 3.75 million silver on yellow boss gear and around 5.625 million silver on liverto or blue awakening (assuming 9mil per base item) with no monthly limit - confirmed by Kakao. (Korea is $300 / month max across all your cash shop spends, due to it being the law there).

There is a reason liverto and base blue awakening weapons went from dozens of each type available on the marketplace to sold out the day Artisan's Memory came into the cash shop. Coincidentally there was suddenly an abundance of TRI/TET for sale the same day, and ever since.

So there really is a monthly limit in Korea? Our "Buy2Play" version has unlimited artisans memories. How f*cked up is that? People yelling Korea is P2W but hey, look what we have here.

And to that upgrade-to-sell part, yeah that's a huge silver generator. Not many people seem to even realize it.

Edited by Miki

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Posted

YAY, another pointless Topic.....¬¬

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Posted (edited)

Yes, might be a pointless topic because the damage has been done already. But IMHO it is sad that there's a lot of people who don't realize those P2W aspects, until they get to the late game.

 

Better know early, than regret putting in hundreds of hours and maybe some cash, just to realize the facts.

Edited by Miki

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Posted

"Thinking is a hazard to yourself, and a burden to others."

                                                           - Mr. Krabs

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Posted (edited)

If you, sir, think that BDO is not P2W, then you haven't reached the end-game enchanting of boss armor/weapons. Once you get to the point where TET is your next upgrade, you will realize how P2W ARTISANS MEMORIES really are. PLUS you can make a ton of silver with them, just by upgrading stuff, and selling them.

 

Most people who claim this game not being P2W haven't reached the TET+ enchanting. This games only end-game is literally gear, and silver = gear.

And what about us players who are full TET and already starting the transition to PEN who don't buy anything?

/wtfpwn

#fatality

Edited by Xpert

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Posted

You have no life, or you are much more luckier than average Joe, enough said :D 

Good luck with PENs, FeelsPriMan.

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