• Announcements

    • IMPORTANT - REACH US IN THE NEW FORUM   05/04/2017

      Ladies and gentlemen ATTENTION please:
      It's time to move into a new house!
        As previously announced, from now on IT WON'T BE POSSIBLE TO CREATE THREADS OR REPLY in the old forums. From now on the old forums will be readable only. If you need to move/copy/migrate any post/material from here, feel free to contact the staff in the new home. We’ll be waiting for you in the NEW Forums!

      https://community.blackdesertonline.com/index.php

      *New features and amazing tools are waiting for you, even more is yet to come in the future.. just like world exploration in BDO leads to new possibilities.
      So don't be afraid about changes, click the link above and follow us!
      Enjoy and see you on the other side!  
    • WICHTIG: Das Forum ist umgezogen!   05/04/2017

      Damen und Herren, wir bitten um Eure Aufmerksamkeit, es ist an der Zeit umzuziehen!
        Wie wir bereits angekündigt hatten, ist es ab sofort nicht mehr möglich, neue Diskussionen in diesem Forum zu starten. Um Euch Zeit zu geben, laufende Diskussionen abzuschließen, könnt Ihr noch für zwei Wochen in offenen Diskussionen antworten. Danach geht dieses Forum hier in den Ruhestand und das NEUE FORUM übernimmt vollständig.
      Das Forum hier bleibt allerdings erhalten und lesbar.   Neue und verbesserte Funktionen warten auf Euch im neuen Forum und wir arbeiten bereits an weiteren Erweiterungen.
      Wir sehen uns auf der anderen Seite!

      https://community.blackdesertonline.com/index.php Update:
      Wie angekündigt könen ab sofort in diesem Forum auch keine neuen Beiträge mehr veröffentlicht werden.
    • IMPORTANT: Le nouveau forum   05/04/2017

      Aventurières, aventuriers, votre attention s'il vous plaît, il est grand temps de déménager!
      Comme nous vous l'avons déjà annoncé précédemment, il n'est désormais plus possible de créer de nouveau sujet ni de répondre aux anciens sur ce bon vieux forum.
      Venez visiter le nouveau forum!
      https://community.blackdesertonline.com
      De nouvelles fonctionnalités ainsi que de nouveaux outils vous attendent dès à présent et d'autres arriveront prochainement! N'ayez pas peur du changement et rejoignez-nous! Amusez-vous bien et a bientôt dans notre nouveau chez nous

Pearl boxes sellable on MP instead of pearl items


pearl boxes on MP   291 votes

  1. 1. Good idea or not?

    • Good idea
      200
    • Bad idea
      91

Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

165 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Take your time, just a seems odd that you'd make a post like this and then take your time to reply...

Perhaps my wording is off, I should have said they'd make less money from me. My bad there and I'll admit that I don't have a source. We don't know whether they'd make more money or less money, however from my standpoint I'd spend less on the game if I could purchase pearl boxes directly from the marketplace.

True, but you can't say that they'd make the same or more money with the proposed change. I agree that it would be easier for players to be able to purchase the pearl boxes from the marketplace, but I THINK that Kakao would make less money with this change. Key word is think there, I'm not saying that they WILL make less money as I don't have a source but I do believe they'd make less money. At the moment there are 3 types of players; those who spend money, those that will never spend money and those who will spend money if they frustrated enough. With the proposed system you eliminate the player who gets frustrated, they no longer need to spend money as they can just purchase pearl boxes to get what they want. 

Im just tired after 2 weeks of hardcore playing during event (but earned stuff worth few billions then it was worth) and rest now playing league of legends all time... No time for silly things... But i will answer it sooner or later, dont worry :)

Well like i said in my opinion there is chance for them to even increase profit... Cause that change can encourage players who spend money on pearl items they sell on Mp to spend more... In last months i noticed fall in number of pearl shop items registered on MP on Eu server and thats what worry me... I dont want them to take drastic steps to encourage players to spend money on pearl items they sell on Mp and thats why i made this topic to propose sth less drastic and good for both sellers and buyers...

Well if its too risky then there is another option- to test my propose on servers for 1 month... 1 month will not hurt Kakao financial too much and its enough to test it out :)

 

You are mistaken about completely eliminating frustated players from spending money, pearl boxes will still be extremely hard to snipe... Its same with VP right now, players can snipe them from MP, but me and a lot others are forced to buy Vp with real money, cause we manage to snipe 1 Vp per 6 months max... When we still buy VP even though its on Mp available for almost free why do you think it will not be same with pearl boxes?

Edited by Dorsai

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

In last months i noticed fall in number of pearl shop items registered on MP on Eu server and thats what worry me... I dont want them to take drastic steps to encourage players to spend money on pearl items they sell on Mp and thats why i made this topic to propose sth less drastic and good for both sellers and buyers...

Its also caused by silver inflation... Better gear = easier grind = more silver... Also household funds and many events we had... Silver/gear simply aint as valuable as it was, with the amounts we get currently... Thats affects it as well... Hence why i think even bigger increase in silver-pearl ratio would be OK even with p2w critics... We earn more and boxes would be usable on anything in cashshop... Hence their silver price can go up...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

You're kinda right about that sadly. I'm a typical player B. I have no financial problems preventing me from buying stuff like weight limit, inventory or maids. So I buy functional stuff now and again. However, if I could get any Pearl stuff using in-game silver, I would never use my credit card ever :ph34r:

It would also devalue Loyalties massively, that's suppose to be a major carrot making people log in every day.

I'm all for Pearl Bundles being sold in the marketplace of course, but they definitely loose money by doing that, so wont happen.

Ok, but that doesn't matter because for those pearls to exist and be used someone had to of spent money. The amount of pearls obtained and used doesn't magically go down just because you're now not buying them and having someone else buy them for you then spending them. The publisher is STILL getting the same money regardless of WHO bought them.

$30 of pearls are used. The publisher gets $30 Who or what bought it or how they obtained them does not DOES NOT MATTER. They cost $30 from someone.

This isn't rocket science, people.

Edited by Shiyo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

just sell BiS PEN and down gear already and get this joke out of the way.. moronic systems

Edited by Fredi Urea Kami Uour

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

just sell BiS PEN and down gear already and get this joke out of the way.. moronic systems

Yes because being able to buy BIS gear from the cash shop and selling cash shop currency for silver are CLEARLY equal!

Let's just go to the highest extreme possible because that makes sense, right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

That silver ratio is horrible specially to get tax from AH.. I still wouldn't sell anything.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

This idea might be appealing to players at first glance but people have to understand, at the very least, the basics of economics in order to realize the positives and negatives of this idea for both the players and Kakao.

The market is controlled to prevent the notion of p2w. How much is p2w is subjective; Kakao determines that. If they are happy with the profits they are making considering the quantity limit for posting pearl shop items, why would they change anything? Why would they risk losing business with p2w averse players? For only a selective few complain about competing with others on an equal footing to purchase items on the market. It might be frustrating, much less than enchanting, but if there's one thing you got to learn from this game, it is patience. That love-hate relationship, you know?

Back to the economics side...Picture the current supply vs demand, the demand for individual pearl shop items on the in-game market is way higher than the amount of people (suppliers) willing to spend their own real cash to sell for in-game currency. Kakao placed a price ceiling below equilibrium and limited pearl shop item postings intentionally to prevent p2w (refer to paragraph 2). An alternate approach, as many others have suggested, is for Kakao to redefine what p2w is for them and allow postings of other pearl shop items. Better yet, Kakao can adjust the prices for the loyalty shop and include pleb version pets (e.g. 7.5s pick-up time), or alternatives to pearl shop items with lesser benefits.

Regarding your idea, pearls are obviously much more valuable than individual pearl items, so with your idea demand will be exponentially greater, therefore price must also exponentially increase in order for supply and demand to reach equilibrium. That is where the problem lies, how much is too much? how much is p2w? This question cannot be answered based on your own experience. Just because some people make 20M/hr, 200M/day, 1.5B/week, etc., doesn't mean the average player does. More importantly, with the exponential increase in demand, if it took you 2 months to get 1 value pack, it'd take you double or even triple that to get a pearl box on the market. No matter what, there will be a shortage in supply if they want to keep their business model.

tldr; play smart and enjoy the game, Kakao knows what they are doing.

Edited by IKShuko

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

That silver ratio is horrible specially to get tax from AH.. I still wouldn't sell anything.

There's 0% tax on pearl items.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

No one's claiming that this is happening, you're just trying to deflect by using insults and strawman fallacies because you can't refute my point. Here I'll repeat it for you.

Person A wants to use their real money to acquire silver. 

Person B just wants to buy the Weight Limit Increase

Current situation -> A buys costumes using real money and sells them for silver. B gets annoyed that he doesn't have enough weight and spends real money to buy an increase. BOTH A and B have spent real money. $30 for the costume, $30 for the weight limit. Total spent = $60

Proposed situation -> A buys a silver box and lists it on the marketplace, B buys it using silver and then uses the pearls to buy the weight increase. ONLY A has spent real money. $30 for the costume. Total spent = $30

If you can't understand that 30 is in fact a SMALLER number than  60, then I understand why you need to use insults in all your posts. :) 

Just want to point out that in the "current situation" example there is also a player(s) C who is the buyer(s) of player A's costumes who therefore wont have to spend any real money for his(their) pearl item(s).

 

Ontopic, Since the game has already passed my preferences in regards to p2w I believe this change would benefit me in my current situation so I voted yes.

I'm still sitting on 0 pearl items bought from marketplace despite my best effort in doing so for the last several months so I honestly dont think the playerbase who buy stuff themselves out of frustration would be affected that much.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

The demand for pearl boxes will be far too great unless of course they were even more expensive then the costumes currently are.  Not many people would sell anything outside of pearl boxes either.  Better be saving your tens of millions for pearl boxes if this ever gets implemented.  We could be looking at 3k pearls= 25-35m, 6k pearls= 50-60m, 10k pearls= 75-85m.  I'm accounting for the bonus pearls as well, nor do I see a reason to exclude 6k pearls or 10k pearls.  

Nobody would sell anything besides pearl boxes at that rate, not too mention most people won't be able to get a pearl box as well(If you think getting a costume is tricky now, wait till you imagine this process heh)

Edited by JerryBoyle

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

i say remove the pearl items and just set it to post pearl boxes so the buyer can buy whatever they want and not have to spam to get something like many people do

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

What guys do you think about replacing current system with few items sellable on MP for silver with pearl boxes instead? Ofc with current limit 5 boxes per week... 

3k box= 27m

2k box- 18m

1k box- 9m 

You forget one point. The item restriction is there on purpose. We were told it's to reduce pay to win but the only things restricted are the P2W items.

If a player is going to be selling stuff for silver they will sell anything as it will sell. The seller always gets thier max silver each week.

This means that they player who wants to buy that p2w costume/item will still have no choice but to use cash.

It's evil genius on Kakao and PA's part.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

i say remove the pearl items and just set it to post pearl boxes so the buyer can buy whatever they want and not have to spam to get something like many people do

Oh yeah... Those -----ing spammers... Even if for nothing else, just bcs of those its a good idea...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Oh yeah... Those -----ing spammers... Even if for nothing else, just bcs of those its a good idea...

I don't blame them, I spam too sometimes. Not many people can justify spending $30 for a single costume on a single character in a video game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Well like i said in my opinion there is chance for them to even increase profit... Cause that change can encourage players who spend money on pearl items they sell on Mp to spend more...

Depends entirely on the exchange rate, which shouldn't be changed in my view. People are crying enough with the current 125 million, if it were changed (even if it were decreased) there would be public outcry.

In last months i noticed fall in number of pearl shop items registered on MP on Eu server and thats what worry me...

That's what you noticed, you're also heavily biased so we'll ignore it. 

I dont want them to take drastic steps to encourage players to spend money on pearl items they sell on Mp and thats why i made this topic to propose sth less drastic and good for both sellers and buyers...

Well if its too risky then there is another option- to test my propose on servers for 1 month... 1 month will not hurt Kakao financial too much and its enough to test it out :)

Why test it out at all? As shown in Q2 and Q3 reports the game is very profitable. If it aint broke, then don't fix it as the saying goes. 

You are mistaken about completely eliminating frustated players from spending money, pearl boxes will still be extremely hard to snipe...

Harder than sniping that specific costume that you want in the hopes that someone lists that exact one rather than the many other costumes?

Its same with VP right now, players can snipe them from MP, but me and a lot others are forced to buy Vp with real money, cause we manage to snipe 1 Vp per 6 months max... When we still buy VP even though its on Mp available for almost free why do you think it will not be same with pearl boxes?

Because VP have a lower pearl to silver ratio? Why would someone list a VP when they can just list 5 costumes and make 125 million?

Just want to point out that in the "current situation" example there is also a player(s) C who is the buyer(s) of player A's costumes who therefore wont have to spend any real money for his(their) pearl item(s).

That doesn't really have anything to do with the discussion as we're talking about Kakao making money. Player C doesn't spend money in either system, so can be ignored. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

i say remove the pearl items and just set it to post pearl boxes so the buyer can buy whatever they want and not have to spam to get something like many people do

Simply add the three words "wtb", "wts" and "gift" to the chat filter and enjoy your spam-free gaming experience :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Simply add the three words "wtb", "wts" and "gift" to the chat filter and enjoy your spam-free gaming experience :P

Looking for seller, exchanger, lister, list, listing, selling, exchanging, trading, trade, trader, pearls, costume...

And those assholes will find other way to say it, and you are already missing on some debate regarding cashshop or RP even with these... It should be considered spam...

Depends entirely on the exchange rate, which shouldn't be changed in my view. People are crying enough with the current 125 million, if it were changed (even if it were decreased) there would be public outcry.

Havent seen anyone seirously mentioning p2w in quite a while... Just some trolls saying p2w on everything to get attention... So those 125M should already be deep under the p2w ceiling even for most of the haters...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Oh no no no, then what will we do with all the "WTB Dande Box, will gift pearls if I win bid" posts? (✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)(✿◡‿◡)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Doesn't sound like bad idea, as long as there is some limit, of how many pearls can you sell on market, so people won't cry about p2w.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

If there is proper limitations in place, I think it is much better to have pearls on the market place instead of the most profitable for the seller items. This way the seller will get his silver and the buyers will get what they want. We must be prepared thought that the demand will  xxxxxx times bigger than the supply.

Edited by Isteria

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

 

That doesn't really have anything to do with the discussion as we're talking about Kakao making money. Player C doesn't spend money in either system, so can be ignored. 

 

But if not for player C then player A cant do his money -> silver trade so even if its just an example it cant be done that simple.

 

What I believe would happen is that the supply of pearl items/pearls would stay roughly the same but the amount of buyers would increase simply because of a larger selection of items avalible. This could potentially lead to more frustrated players paying real money instead when pearl items/pearls would get even harder to come by.

Just speculations though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

But if not for player C then player A cant do his money -> silver trade so even if its just an example it cant be done that simple.

Player C exists in both situation, the current one with items being sold and the proposed one with pearl boxes being sold. Player C doesn't change at all, so can be ignored when comparing both situations. 

What I believe would happen is that the supply of pearl items/pearls would stay roughly the same but the amount of buyers would increase simply because of a larger selection of items avalible. This could potentially lead to more frustrated players paying real money instead when pearl items/pearls would get even harder to come by.

Just speculations though.

Dunno whether supply would increase or decrease, but the fact is right now the system is working. Cash shop items are being sold and Kakao is making a healthy profit, why make a gamble when the current system is working? Just look at the outcry there was when costumes were able to be listed, people didn't even know the prices and were screaming that it would be 100 million per costume. If they made it so that pearl boxes could be sold we'd most likely see a similar outcry before the actual rates were released and the QQers suddenly went silent. Why burn the forums like that? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Depends entirely on the exchange rate, which shouldn't be changed in my view. People are crying enough with the current 125 million, if it were changed (even if it were decreased) there would be public outcry.

Not only, like i said right now if you want to sell Vp you still need to buy Daum cash for 20 euro, not for 15, cause you cant just simply transfer 15... Same for pets, they cost 11 euro!! its really frustrating that only options to transfer cash into game are 10,20,30 euro and making pearl boxes sellable on MP would simply repair it and encourage players to spend more...

That's what you noticed, you're also heavily biased so we'll ignore it. 

You are heavily based, cause you play on NA and someone else on forum posted that in 3 weeks numbers of VP sold was almost 4k (from 29k to 32,8k)... In same time on Eu number of VP sold was around 400 (from 12,1k to 12,5k)... You can log in on Eu any time and compare number of pearl shop items sold on MP....

Why test it out at all? As shown in Q2 and Q3 reports the game is very profitable. If it aint broke, then don't fix it as the saying goes. 

Tell me pls where in Q2 and Q3 reports you can see profit Kakao got from pearl items players sold on MP? Its only small part of their whole profit (and whole Black Desert profit) and only their financial department know that numbers... Also im really curious how you read their financial reports? I will link it to you and tell me pls where you see Kakao profit from BDO... I will only remind you that BDO is not their only game... 

http://www.kakaocorp.com/upload_resources/ir/siljeok/siljeok_20161110080425_2.pdf

 

Also if you really think that BDO was so big thing for Kakao compare then their net profit and game content profit from 2014 to 2016... Friendly reminder- OBT in Korea started in december 2014, that means first period with that game is Q1 2015...

 

Harder than sniping that specific costume that you want in the hopes that someone lists that exact one rather than the many other costumes?

Because VP have a lower pearl to silver ratio? Why would someone list a VP when they can just list 5 costumes and make 125 million?

 

Why you avoid my argument? i said that VP is example how frustrated players already spend real money to get them, cause a lot of them cant snipe them from MP...  Also currently there is 12,5k VP sold  and around 50k all costumes sold on EU and from what i heard lately there are 32k Vp sold on NA... Clearly there are some players who list Vp on MP...

Edited by Dorsai
2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Not only, like i said right now if you want to sell Vp you still need to buy Daum cash for 20 euro, not for 15, cause you cant just simply transfer 15... Same for pets, they cost 11 euro!! its really frustrating that only options to transfer cash into game are 10,20,30 euro and making pearl boxes sellable on MP would simply repair it and encourage players to spend more...

In what way would it encourage people to spend more? Pricing things at 15 when the boxes are only for 10/20/30 is something quite a lot of MMO companies do as it's there to encourage people to spend more. A person is much more likely to buy another box of pearls if they've got 500 pearls leftover. 

You are heavily based, cause you play on NA and someone else on forum posted that in 3 weeks numbers of VP sold was almost 4k (from 29k to 32,8k)... In same time on Eu number of VP sold was around 400 (from 12,1k to 12,5k)... You can log in on Eu any time and compare number of pearl shop items sold on MP....

You didn't provide any evidence, you merely said "I noticed" which isn't a viable source as you are heavily biased. 

Tell me pls where in Q2 and Q3 reports you can see profit Kakao got from pearl items players sold on MP? Its only small part of their whole profit (and whole Black Desert profit) and only their financial department know that numbers...

Because you can compare the amounts they made in each quarter...BDO is their only on-line game, so don't factor in mobile gaming. By end of June they had sold over 1 million copies of the game, so as with EVERY game in existence you'd see a drop in box sales over time going into Q3. Q1 = ~$15 million, Q2 = ~$30 million and Q3 = $25 million.

Source

 

Also if you really think that BDO was so big thing for Kakao compare then their net profit and game content profit from 2014 to 2016... Friendly reminder- OBT in Korea started in december 2014, that means first period with that game is Q1 2015...

I don't understand what you're trying to argue here.

Q1 2015 = ~$10 million

Q3 2015 = ~$25 million

Why you avoid my argument?

Are you really using this argument when you're still REFUSING to reply to this thread? It's rather hippo critical to use this line of argument when you're the one ignoring arguments. Tell you what, until you reply to that thread I'm just going to ignore all your posts; after all you're crying about points being ignored (when they're not) whilst doing the same thing. :) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

In what way would it encourage people to spend more? Pricing things at 15 when the boxes are only for 10/20/30 is something quite a lot of MMO companies do as it's there to encourage people to spend more. A person is much more likely to buy another box of pearls if they've got 500 pearls leftover. 

You overlook fact that it frustrate players and discourage ppl to spend more in long term... Cause when i see pet for 11 euro with only 10/20 euro option to spend i feel so annoyed that in long term i dotn feel like i want to support company who use cheap tricks like this...

You didn't provide any evidence, you merely said "I noticed" which isn't a viable source as you are heavily biased. 

i said you already that i observe value packs all time, cause i bid on them at least 20 times per day... But if you dont belive into my words i can make screenshots for 1,2,3 weeks period, its no problem...

Because you can compare the amounts they made in each quarter...BDO is their only on-line game, so don't factor in mobile gaming. By end of June they had sold over 1 million copies of the game, so as with EVERY game in existence you'd see a drop in box sales over time going into Q3. Q1 = ~$15 million, Q2 = ~$30 million and Q3 = $25 million.

Source

If BDO is their only online game why there is PC game content profit in Q3 2014 and Q4 2014? BDO was released in Korea in 17th december 2014, that means their first profit was in Q1 2015... Also like you already know (cause you did math on it) game content profit contain both mobile games and pc games and to see percents you need to check full report in pdf... Like you know in Q3 mobile games still made 66% of their profits in game content...

Also you misinformed players with your quotes, what you counted isnt net profit, but profit without costs... Look at full report pls:

http://www.kakaocorp.com/upload_resources/ir/siljeok/siljeok_20161110080425_2.pdf

Like you see that numbers you counted for Q1,Q2,Q3  are from game content line, but below you have their costs... You have their net profit a lot lower... Its completely useless to just quote profits without considering costs... They can earn millions and still have negative profit... Look in Q3 2014 they made almost 58M $ with their mobile and PC game content! A lot, right? And they still end that period with 5,5M $ lost...

I don't understand what you're trying to argue here.

Q1 2015 = ~$10 million

Q3 2015 = ~$25 million

I dont know why you compared Q1 2015 to Q3 2015, i didnt asked for that...

Are you really using this argument when you're still REFUSING to reply to this thread? It's rather hippo critical to use this line of argument when you're the one ignoring arguments. Tell you what, until you reply to that thread I'm just going to ignore all your posts; after all you're crying about points being ignored (when they're not) whilst doing the same thing. :) 

I said i will answer you there when i will have more time... I not ignore anything, cause i didnt replied in that thread yet, stop lieyng... That topic is separate discussion and they have nothing to do with themself... 
 

Also my point stay:

 i said that VP is example how frustrated players already spend real money to get them, cause a lot of them cant snipe them from MP...  Also currently there is 12,5k VP sold  and around 50k all costumes sold on EU and from what i heard lately there are 32k Vp sold on NA... Clearly there are some players who list Vp on MP...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites