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Player griefing.

Lowbie griefing.   289 votes

  1. 1. Has a new player griefed you in the past few weeks while grinding?

    • Yes
      91
    • No
      95
    • I fed him to mobs
      41
    • I don't care
      62
  2. 2. Would you like to see something done about this issue?

    • Yes
      95
    • No
      144
    • maybe
      50

Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

183 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Honestly I read this and just say to myself if you're geared and at a popular leveling grinding spot and their are lowbies there to level be a respectful player and change channels regardless if you were there first because they have more need to be there then you.. Just because you make silver there fast doesn't mean you deserve to be there more then someone who needs that area to level and not to gain silver. You can always go to other places since you're geared instead of disrupting new players gameplay. Imo you deserved to be zerged.

 

Also why would they party with you, not only would it of been 3 people giving less EXP but your level is also higher also reducing their EXP.

Edited by Excisionex
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Funny how these situations always come about when someone feels entitled and claims that its "their" spot because "I was here first and have been for hours" then murders anyone who looks at them wrong, and wonders why things start to go wrong. This is why I always move around when grinding, if I find a nice quiet spot with decent mob density I'll stay, but if someone comes along and starts killing? I move on. Haven't had a single problem this way, do I progress slower? Sure I do! But have I been griefed or karma bombed? Nope! Incidentally this means I never go to Sausans because that place is cancerous and reeks of players with entitlement issues.

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Funny how these situations always come about when someone feels entitled and claims that its "their" spot because "I was here first and have been for hours" then murders anyone who looks at them wrong, and wonders why things start to go wrong. This is why I always move around when grinding, if I find a nice quiet spot with decent mob density I'll stay, but if someone comes along and starts killing? I move on. Haven't had a single problem this way, do I progress slower? Sure I do! But have I been griefed or karma bombed? Nope! Incidentally this means I never go to Sausans because that place is cancerous and reeks of players with entitlement issues.

This is a good approach as well. The Sausan problem is due to it being one of the few very efficient leveling places under 56, especially for alts. I went Valencia as soon as I got 56 on both of my characters. And since then, I never had any issues. 

And no, I wasn't directing my answer to any specific person on the forum, or in game. I was talking about the pker mentality in general. Honestly, when you see people in those camouflage suits running like bats out of hell on you just for existing in a hunting ground, you can't think more of them than poor frustrated people who really need to grab onto a straw to show a display of fake power for a second. And I'm pretty sure in 100% of the cases I had pkers flag up without words and kill me, you would see those same people trolling in channel chat, flaming general chat, especially if killing you isn't working as their allmightyness imagined. Maybe 20% of the cases is 'talk first then kill' and usually it comes to 'leave or die noob'.

The people who'd actually try to come to a gentlemen's agreement wouldn't flag up in the first place - and somehow, even Pirates are very contested too, whenever I usually went there, people would run to me, full of enthusiasm and say 'join ussss', 'lets party' etc. Everybody wins. :D

Maybe pearl abyss hid some mind controlling thing in the Sausan garrison, giving 50% increased chance of being a jerk there :P

Oh yeah, in Valencia I had maybe one situation of instant flag up and attempt to kill (after all, in Valencia you don't oneshot people anymore, now you twoshot 'em :P), cuz I was killing an elite, and someone wanted it for himself. Fortunately, situations there are very rare, and almost entirely based on Gahaz bandits, pretty much because it takes a few months for the general community to start hearing about new hunting grounds (even if they were around for far longer), so for some people those bandits are the new Sausans. (I personally profit far more on Cadrys and anyone who turned up was nice, it was either party, or they take one side and I take the other). 

And as far as respect goes... well, Koreans always took it to much higher levels in every game since forever, and for us, it kinda broke back with Barrens chat and hell knows what else back then. So the survivors of Barrens chat and the similar stuff combined with the younger super toxic League generation - kinda hard for most of these guys to know respect in the online world. Especially when they had none whatsoever. But that isn't to say it doesn't exist. The game mechanics just don't require it to succeed, unlike some economy oriented mmos where respect can mean everything. 

You can always find like-minded people, at least that isn't an issue :D 

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Posted

Funny how these situations always come about when someone feels entitled and claims that its "their" spot because "I was here first and have been for hours" then murders anyone who looks at them wrong, and wonders why things start to go wrong. This is why I always move around when grinding, if I find a nice quiet spot with decent mob density I'll stay, but if someone comes along and starts killing? I move on. Haven't had a single problem this way, do I progress slower? Sure I do! But have I been griefed or karma bombed? Nope! Incidentally this means I never go to Sausans because that place is cancerous and reeks of players with entitlement issues.

I dont do that for one. Im talking about the lowbie griefers but you cant read so move on.

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you aren't getting griefed.  move on.

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Posted (edited)

I like what you said against Col but the first part is what you are not getting. It's really not fair to the player to get chased out of channels and forced to switch channel and then get chased down again and again by other players on the channel you switch to. I can kill people but rather not because the karma system works in their favor. I am lucky to even grind 30-60mins every few hours. Farming early morning and very late night away from prime time kids coming home from school or work to come and grief people because they "can". In my opinion, you shouldn't have the ability to screw someone over in a game like this. UO wasn't even this toxic and even if it was full loot PvP. People respected everyone else a lot more. Even KR for BDo the koreason respect eachothers grind. 

Hi Virukin,

I still don't see how it is not "fair" to do such a thing. Is the "chaser" using cheats or something? If he is not, then I think it is fair what he's doing. You don't chase people out of nowhere, you do it for a reason wether as a provocation to a guild, a punishment for a karma bomber, and so on and so forth. People don't organize a party to harass other players out of nowhere, that's disconnected from the reality of the game I believe.

What I see every single day when I play, is low level and low geared players attracted by Sausan's/Pirates' fame and wanting a piece of cake of those places, then complaining they can't eat it. Those places are not for them, it is obvious how highly contested/highly dangerous they are, they know for a fact they are going to die in there, so I think any mechanic that is rewarding their temerity should be discouraged. Moreover, these low geared players usually come in party, making impossible to kick them out of your rotation because ofc killing 5 persons will make you go negative (and taking into account that killing the five of them once won't do anything, since you typically have to kill them 5-6 times each for them to frustrate and leave).

So no, not one step further for lows that are out of their place.

About the toxic community, in all honestly I believe this is mainly because of karma. Karma restrains the freedom of players, allows for karma bombing, PK protection, and so on, and I believe it creates a high deal of frustration that manifests through people being angry with each other. I, for example, was much more relaxed playing TERA (no penalties to OWPvP) than I'm playing BDO. Watching someone pissing me off and not being able to kill him/her drives me nuts sometimes :( 

Edited by Tinaral
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Posted

So sympathy? Did you not read that I ask for party and want to help new players level and figure the game out rather than keep secrets to myself and just hoard information for only me to know? I'd like you to PM me in game on NA servers if you need help. (Psycha_Mew)

Thankyou, that's sweet of you to offer but I have a 60 witch and was just bringing my Tamer in line with my other 11 toons. She is now 56 and I have moved back to my witch and Valencia since I find it a lot more lucrative to farm certain area's there when one has the level and the gear.

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Why do you think you have the right to be protected from other characters? If you are kicked out of helms/manes, then you have two options 1) accept it and move somewhere else, or 2) refuse and fight back. Don't expect the game mechanics to babysit you, this is not a WoW PVE server :( .

"Elitist" being an euphemism for "better".

not really.  superior gear, perhaps.  Just had another one of these gank clowns tonight try to gank me at ogres.  Lol.  he attacked with zero warning.  finally killed me after i killed a few ogres.  So i karmabombed the crap out of him.  just let him kill me, as i popped elion tears.  I bought more just to drive his karma negative. Had he spoken to me to tell me he was grinding ogres, I'd have switched channels.  Nope, he wanted to be a douche so he spent the next large period of time red.  Of course I let everyone know in server that he was negative and where he was.  hahahahah.  suck it.

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Posted

Why should a level 52 or 53 have claim to a lower level spot over a player whose 59 or 60? They both need the spot even if it is for different reasons. They have every right to flag up and attempt to take the spot. The issue is what they do if they lose.This is a game where power talks. If you don't have power then you don't get to talk. This is especially true for crowded grind spots. 

They do have every right to flag up and take the spot if they can...just as any player has the same right to utilise game mechanics and keep popping up in an attempt to take back their spot. Don't like it...hop. Game enables both scenario's.

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not really.  superior gear, perhaps.  Just had another one of these gank clowns tonight try to gank me at ogres.  Lol.  he attacked with zero warning.  finally killed me after i killed a few ogres.  So i karmabombed the crap out of him.  just let him kill me, as i popped elion tears.  I bought more just to drive his karma negative. Had he spoken to me to tell me he was grinding ogres, I'd have switched channels.  Nope, he wanted to be a douche so he spent the next large period of time red.  Of course I let everyone know in server that he was negative and where he was.  hahahahah.  suck it.

Wether he killed you because of level, gear, skill... He killed you because he is overall a better player. Also if a person ganks you, he probably doesn't care to go red :/ 

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Posted

Wether he killed you because of level, gear, skill... He killed you because he is overall a better player. Also if a person ganks you, he probably doesn't care to go red :/ 

lol that explains the pissed off whispers.  Doesn't matter.  he got angry which was my goal.

 

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Posted

What do you think they should do? Yeah it sucks and all but I don't think they should start banning people for it or anything. Really it's just part of the game, and if it were me I'd just factor the situation into my gameplay and find a way to counter it.

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Posted (edited)

as i popped elion tears

rofl

"He killed me. I can't stand that ! Quick ! Let's waste my time and money to waste his time !".

Whatever you say, with the mentality you're displaying, pretty sure you wouldn't move away even if asked and Ogres are the perfect example of mobs you don't want to share.

Edited by WeaselPaw
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Posted

Hi Virukin,

I still don't see how it is not "fair" to do such a thing. Is the "chaser" using cheats or something? If he is not, then I think it is fair what he's doing. You don't chase people out of nowhere, you do it for a reason wether as a provocation to a guild, a punishment for a karma bomber, and so on and so forth. People don't organize a party to harass other players out of nowhere, that's disconnected from the reality of the game I believe.

What I see every single day when I play, is low level and low geared players attracted by Sausan's/Pirates' fame and wanting a piece of cake of those places, then complaining they can't eat it. Those places are not for them, it is obvious how highly contested/highly dangerous they are, they know for a fact they are going to die in there, so I think any mechanic that is rewarding their temerity should be discouraged. Moreover, these low geared players usually come in party, making impossible to kick them out of your rotation because ofc killing 5 persons will make you go negative (and taking into account that killing the five of them once won't do anything, since you typically have to kill them 5-6 times each for them to frustrate and leave).

So no, not one step further for lows that are out of their place.

About the toxic community, in all honestly I believe this is mainly because of karma. Karma restrains the freedom of players, allows for karma bombing, PK protection, and so on, and I believe it creates a high deal of frustration that manifests through people being angry with each other. I, for example, was much more relaxed playing TERA (no penalties to OWPvP) than I'm playing BDO. Watching someone pissing me off and not being able to kill him/her drives me nuts sometimes :( 

Yeah I loved TERA PvP. it was rewarding fun sometimes. 7k hours and made 12 separate warriors with 13-14 gear. Compare these two games its just night and day. TERA being a good design and BDO being a good idea but poorly executed by devs. PvP needs to be put on hold here and make some PVE content worth talking about like dungeons and actually raids since we already have world bosses. With the graphics we have here and combat, it'd make dungeons hella fun like aakman. 

rofl

"He killed me. I can't stand that ! Quick ! Let's waste my time and money to waste his time !".

Whatever you say, with the mentality you're displaying, pretty sure you wouldn't move away even if asked and Ogres are the perfect example of mobs you don't want to share.

Yep. this guy keeps saying share in the game but hes one of those griefers in the end...

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Tell me how Elin are good design ?

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We have dungeons.. they're just so damn OP(no idea about what drops) nobody really goes there.

Tera had it's time. It's crap now. They are literally just prolonging the Elin costume milking that weeaboo boys(who probably like MLP) are eating up like candy.

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So far I see only two sides, two different points of view - the level 60s who want to rule over everyone and everything - and those few who wanna spite them. Since those capable of ruling over everyone else are the minority, and so are the stubborn 'karmabombers' like me (someone mentioned kill them 5-6 and they give up, I don't ever-give-up), I think the game is fine as it is - since the problem isn't related to most of the people.

This game is a lot about perseverance, in most of it's aspects - grinding, failing and blowing up hundreds of items, grinding horses, grinding life skills, in the end, those who come out on top are those who had the nerve to keep going and not get bored or give up. Same goes for the karma conflicts - those who really wish to display true power will go perma red and once they've had their point, they'll hide near outlaw town and grind it back up at Fogans. Those who want to stay but are weaker, they'll keep letting themselves be killed by the pretenders, and the pretenders will give up in the end, because they aren't strong enough themselves to go red. 

And finally, people fail to realize over and over again that this is pretty much a sandbox -- it means everything and anything counts. As far as that explorer who just sails the ocean for little profit is concerned, you can be lv 62, you're still not better than him. Cuz his goals are something else. So having high gear/level doesn't mean you win this game. No one does. You win for yourself if you attain your set goals. Don't play a sandbox if you need goals given by the devs and written with huge letters. I mean, there's plenty of themeparks in the sea, and last time i played WoW, it wasn't bad, it was actually fun (Pandaria). And you might start having more fun if you stopped grinding and chasing 61-62 and billions of silver if you realized you haven't been to 80% of the world.

I seriously think people should stop listening to streamers/youtubers when it comes to game opinion, goals, and even mechanics... just because they got tons of subs, doesn't mean they're right. Thanks to them we have people thinking this game is all about getting gear and going node wars and nothing else. Thanks to them we have people believe Sausans and Pirates are the only place to be in the game. Open your eyes people, and start enjoying the game! :D

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Posted (edited)

rofl

"He killed me. I can't stand that ! Quick ! Let's waste my time and money to waste his time !".

Whatever you say, with the mentality you're displaying, pretty sure you wouldn't move away even if asked and Ogres are the perfect example of mobs you don't want to share.

I was there before he was.   for a long time.  I would have been happy to share, but he clearly wasn't happy to share.  learn logic.

Yeah I loved TERA PvP. it was rewarding fun sometimes. 7k hours and made 12 separate warriors with 13-14 gear. Compare these two games its just night and day. TERA being a good design and BDO being a good idea but poorly executed by devs. PvP needs to be put on hold here and make some PVE content worth talking about like dungeons and actually raids since we already have world bosses. With the graphics we have here and combat, it'd make dungeons hella fun like aakman. 

Yep. this guy keeps saying share in the game but hes one of those griefers in the end...

Nope/  I was there first.  I would have been happy to share, but clearly he wasn't.  That's why eliminating karma bombing by allowing pking is a bad idea.

Edited by Columba

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this is a pvp mmo so you got to fight for spots plain and simple, if too weak you don't have the right to stay we need harsh punishment for trolls who die over and over yet wont leave! oh look im red -6 mill karma omg all I was doing was defending my rotation wth? so the grifeing trolls always wins and that crap is stupid and infact is borderline harrassment we need better game masters who will ban trolls that keep grifing lets say same person 20 times in half a hour.

 

want to be a carebear? play another game!

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Posted

So far I see only two sides, two different points of view - the level 60s who want to rule over everyone and everything - and those few who wanna spite them. Since those capable of ruling over everyone else are the minority, and so are the stubborn 'karmabombers' like me (someone mentioned kill them 5-6 and they give up, I don't ever-give-up), I think the game is fine as it is - since the problem isn't related to most of the people.

This game is a lot about perseverance, in most of it's aspects - grinding, failing and blowing up hundreds of items, grinding horses, grinding life skills, in the end, those who come out on top are those who had the nerve to keep going and not get bored or give up. Same goes for the karma conflicts - those who really wish to display true power will go perma red and once they've had their point, they'll hide near outlaw town and grind it back up at Fogans. Those who want to stay but are weaker, they'll keep letting themselves be killed by the pretenders, and the pretenders will give up in the end, because they aren't strong enough themselves to go red. 

And finally, people fail to realize over and over again that this is pretty much a sandbox -- it means everything and anything counts. As far as that explorer who just sails the ocean for little profit is concerned, you can be lv 62, you're still not better than him. Cuz his goals are something else. So having high gear/level doesn't mean you win this game. No one does. You win for yourself if you attain your set goals. Don't play a sandbox if you need goals given by the devs and written with huge letters. I mean, there's plenty of themeparks in the sea, and last time i played WoW, it wasn't bad, it was actually fun (Pandaria). And you might start having more fun if you stopped grinding and chasing 61-62 and billions of silver if you realized you haven't been to 80% of the world.

I seriously think people should stop listening to streamers/youtubers when it comes to game opinion, goals, and even mechanics... just because they got tons of subs, doesn't mean they're right. Thanks to them we have people thinking this game is all about getting gear and going node wars and nothing else. Thanks to them we have people believe Sausans and Pirates are the only place to be in the game. Open your eyes people, and start enjoying the game! :D

Yep.. streamers keep showing off PvP and secret money making ways and ruining grind spots by grinding in them and saying how wonderful it all is. thats how elrics got screwed was BJgodna on YT made a video explaining you can make 50-100mil a day there then the next day it was swarmed by rangers and musa. The thing that killed it for this game is the streamers and youtubers with high subs like you said. Making and advertising this game as a hardcore grinding OWpvp game. Which it's not and I do take my time and explore/craft/gather. I do grind but in my boredom hours I grind for a while.

While it's easy to say I may be the idiot not switching channels or finding new spots but it's the bad systems in place that enforced people to become toxic and antisocial mountain lions over anything even if its gathering pig hide or sap from trees. Everywhere you go, you may find a lion that is very much in place to flag on you if you touch his tree or grass bush -_-... 

PvP in this game is a major flaw and makes it fun for the 1 or 2 % of guilds and people but others just want to hang out with friends and have a good time in the world. Like all games should be is fun even if it is a sandbox it is meant to have fun together with family or friends. Just going around having "fun" killing and murdering people trying to enjoy their game they gladly payed for and kept paying is something I don't like this see just because the other person killing thinks he can do it because its a sandbox and free OWPVP. It's a sad design that will sadly never go away and only get worse as newer and stronger mobs come out in later content making it harder and harder for new players to check it out with guilds camping the new zones like they did for launch of Mediah.

If you remember the guilds that camped sausans and never allowed anyone in to grind on the first few weeks of mediah then you know whats coming when Kama update comes around with newer better mobs and good drops. Top guilds will control it. Only thing they cant control is the market and they keep trying with the black stone drop rate event. They hoarded stones and now there is 40K + stones on market sometimes a day after the event is over to try and make profits off people. But sadly they get no money back because they tank the price lol.

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Posted (edited)

Again.

Make it so that you will not get drops or experience x amount of levels over a mob's level(3 or so). Nerf silver at pirates and sausans. High levels are forced to vacate areas where lowers use to grind to level and go where they belong.

Edited by PandoraRose
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Posted

What do you think they should do? Yeah it sucks and all but I don't think they should start banning people for it or anything. Really it's just part of the game, and if it were me I'd just factor the situation into my gameplay and find a way to counter it.

Not sure what they can do tbh, because the community is so divided when it comes to grind etiquette or "rules".

I feel like the majority of more seasoned players accepts he "first come first serve" philosophy. Don't mess with someone else's rotation period. Find another spot. I also think that's the right way to go about things personally.

But almost as many seasoned players thinks the strongest player(best gear, highest level and PvP skills) should get the spot. Doesn't matter who was there first, the looser needs to gtfo.

Than you have the inconsiderate trash that doesn't give a shit about anything besides their own XP and silver gain. This is also the group that has the biggest amount of karma bombers. However, many of them have no problem flagging up when the opponent is some level 52 horse trainer ofc.

Finally there's all the people in big guilds who thinks grind spots should be secured with raw GvG strength. Not go the best player or to the guy who was there first. It should go to whoever can bring the most guildmates and zerg their way to victory. Endgame is GvG oriented after all, so it makes sense to.

But good luck making a system that everyone is happy with, cant abuse or take advantage of. I hate to say it, but the only thing that would work 100% is instanced grind spots.

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this is a pvp mmo so you got to fight for spots plain and simple, if too weak you don't have the right to stay we need harsh punishment for trolls who die over and over yet wont leave! oh look im red -6 mill karma omg all I was doing was defending my rotation wth? so the grifeing trolls always wins and that crap is stupid and infact is borderline harrassment we need better game masters who will ban trolls that keep grifing lets say same person 20 times in half a hour.

 

want to be a carebear? play another game!

the real Care Bears are the elitist grinding in low level areas.  I prefer Valencia.

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Again.

Make it so that you will not get drops or experience x amount of levels over a mob's level(3 or so). Nerf silver at pirates and sausans. High levels are forced to vacate areas where lowers use to grind to level and go where they belong.

that would restrict the freedom and also would make partialy pointless to gear your alter... Allow OWPvP and let players populate the map according to their capacities. This is the only reliable way.

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Few days ago on Sausages I had this wizard tryna to outgrind me as i was helping a friend lvl his reroll to 56. Killed him a few times to make it clear, I wasn't gonna party with him and spot was taken. Instead he just kept karmabombing, fed him to mobs. Eventually started whispering me as if I was the bad guy griefing him by PKing and I had to apoligize according to him. Just kept outgrinding him and when I had karma enough I'd kill him if he got annoying, he kept coming even as he was being fed to mobs though.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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