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Petition to decrease guild drop out cooldown timer to 12hrs


Should guild drop out timer to be decreased?   76 votes

  1. 1. Should guild drop out timer to be decreased?

    • Yes
      12
    • No
      23
    • It should be increased
      41
  2. 2. Should there be "alternative" Node War region for Siege winners to participate during the week?

    • Yes
      27
    • No
      49

Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

30 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

It has become common-practice among many siege-warring guilds to guild hop to an alternative guild after their main guild has won a siege. 

This of course enables them to participate in Node Wars still which owning the region would otherwise bar. In addition with New World came a rule where guilds owning a region cannot built on other regions during siege days. These kind of restrictions have their place in making sure no one entity will eat up whole game. 

Sieges and Node Wars are the pinnacle of mass-scale PvP in this game and when the reward for getting to top and owning a region is that you can't no longer participate in it without resorting to alternative guild. Problem there being the awfully long wait of 24 hours x 2 per week without a guild, missing out on 2 possible Node War days, not to mention losing in-game community and the guild-chat for the duration as well.

Ending up in this kind of arrangement is bad game design and quickest fix would be to lower the guild drop cool-down by 12 hours or more in order to have opportunity to participate on any given Node War. This is also something that should be easy to implement and hopefully something Kakao could easily make happen for us and hence I put that as petition but for longer term solution that could be passed to PA I'd suggest either to lift some restrictions or have some alternative-node war region for non-siege days for those guilds who control a region.

If such an alternative Node War for siege winners were introduced it would also mean that the top-tier guilds controlling the regions would have another option rather than guild hopping and then dropping randomly on nodes in alt-guilds and making things bad for new guilds trying to push into Node Warring.

Edited by Gobarnachta
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Posted

if something changes, it should be INCREASED by several days to make bigger guild follow the same rules as small ones do that don't have such a lame way to circumvent those rules :P

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Posted

if something changes, it should be INCREASED by several days to make bigger guild follow the same rules as small ones do that don't have such a lame way to circumvent those rules :P

So you are saying that the reward for being good at doing something that you love to do in this game is that you are barred from doing it? How very englightened view into the matter!

Also I can understand the reason to not like the first option then but how about the second one, why would you vote no on something that has possibilty of being win-win solution for both to new / smaller guilds aswell as bigger siege guilds? Or is it just jealousy?

 

Added option for those in poll who wants drop out timer to be increased. Albeit I cannot fathom a reason other than own insecurities for wanting that.. 

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Posted (edited)

So you are saying that the reward for being good at doing something that you love to do in this game is that you are barred from doing it? How very englightened view into the matter!

Also I can understand the reason to not like the first option then but how about the second one, why would you vote no on something that has possibilty of being win-win solution for both to new / smaller guilds aswell as bigger siege guilds? Or is it just jealousy?

no, i'm saying you're abusing an ingame mechanic to screw smaller guilds to never get a decent nodes because every top guild already has it's maximum nodes and earning money from them, including transfering funds as they should have leveled their guild enough..... so they now, after they got their share for this week, they jump to their smaller 'let's exploit the shit out of this system and screw every smaller guild' guild and screw the smaller guilds ...

imho that's a tatic that should be prevented at all coast and even better become sanctionized.

Edited by cann0nf0dder
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Posted (edited)

no, i'm saying you're abusing an ingame mechanic to screw smaller guilds to never get a decent nodes because every top guild already has it's maximum nodes and earning money from them, including transfering funds as they should have leveled their guild enough..... so they now, after they got their share for this week, they jump to their smaller 'let's exploit the shit out of this system and screw every smaller guild' guild and screw the smaller guilds ...

imho that's a tatic that should be prevented at all coast and even better sanctionized.

Siege guilds have the territory, no nodes (except for duration of first week until the day comes the node is up for grabs). Changing guilds is not an 'exploit', if you think on it hard you'd know this even without confirming it from GMs as it is something anyone is able to do.

Again I get the reasoning for voting no first poll question but why vote no for the exclusive Siege winner's Node War region (or even same region but some other channel perhaps? - with only 5 guilds tho it can't be whole map but perhaps 2 nodes per non-siege day so 12 nodes)

Edited by Gobarnachta

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Posted (edited)

Siege guilds have the territory, no nodes (except for duration of first week until the day comes the node is up for grabs). Changing guilds is not an 'exploit', if you think on it hard you'd know this even without confirming it from GMs as it is something anyone is able to do.
Again I get the reasoning for voting no first poll question but why vote no for the exclusive Siege winner's Node War region (or even same region but some other channel perhaps? - with only 5 guilds tho it can't be whole map but just 2-3 nodes)

switching guilds to prevent the maximum 'whatever maximum per week count' is an exploit ihmo, you're using an ingame game mechanic in a non intended way to increase your gain over other guilds to prevent the weekly siege limit.

i can't call it anything else as an exploit, even if not declared by the devs or not severe enough to be punished simmilar to the 'rolling around with xxxx% overweight' one, it's still exploiting ingame mechanics to prevent a rule you don't like, that's exploiting. i don't see it as a severe exploit, but still it's an exploit but  not like the rolling around one as this is influencing smaller guilds fun during those sieges.

i don't mind the big territory holders for example have a direct fight for calpheon castle or another nice estate for supreme whatever at all, but i'm completely against decreasing the exploit cooldown to carter to those guilds ;)

Edited by cann0nf0dder

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Posted (edited)

switching guilds to prevent the maximum 'whatever maximum per week count' is an exploit ihmo, you're using an ingame game mechanic in a non intended way to increase your gain over other guilds to prevent the weekly siege limit.

i can't call it anything else as an exploit, even if not declared by the devs or not severe enough to be punished simmilar to the 'rolling around with xxxx% overweight' one, it's still exploiting ingame mechanics to prevent a rule you don't like, that's exploiting. i don't see it as a severe exploit, but still it's an exploit but  not like the rolling around one as this is influencing smaller guilds fun during those sieges.

i don't mind the big territory holders for example have a direct fight for calpheon castle or another nice estate for supreme whatever at all, but i'm completely against decreasing the exploit cooldown to carter to those guilds ;)

Well I wish you could change your vote then as at the time of your first post there was no yes votes for the second poll question. Again as I said enabling top-guilds to fight among themselves would be the long-term solution for this but the short term of barring them even more off PvP will only have bad side effects such as them soon running negative karma 24/7 just to find some PvP content out of this game.

Edited by Gobarnachta

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Posted

Siege guilds have the territory, no nodes (except for duration of first week until the day comes the node is up for grabs). Changing guilds is not an 'exploit', if you think on it hard you'd know this even without confirming it from GMs as it is something anyone is able to do.
Again I get the reasoning for voting no first poll question but why vote no for the exclusive Siege winner's Node War region (or even same region but some other channel perhaps? - with only 5 guilds tho it can't be whole map but just 2-3 nodes)

I voted no on the second one since I don't sympathise with the position the siege winners are in since they have been exploiting the system of quitting and joining guilds. 

If you asked that second question without asking for the cooldown to be reduced so you could have an easier time exploiting the system then people might have been more sympathetic with your situation.

I also realise you will claim it's not an exploit to quit and rejoin guilds repeatedly and routinely for the purpose of node wars but at the very best it's abusing the actual purpose of the system which is why the cooldown should be increased. There are systems in place to prevent highly geared guilds going for weaker nodes for a reason which you completely ignore.

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Posted

If you asked that second question without asking for the cooldown to be reduced so you could have an easier time exploiting the system then people might have been more sympathetic with your situation.

I also realise you will claim it's not an exploit to quit and rejoin guilds repeatedly and routinely for the purpose of node wars but at the very best it's abusing the actual purpose of the system which is why the cooldown should be increased. There are systems in place to prevent highly geared guilds going for weaker nodes for a reason which you completely ignore.

I am not asking for sympathy but your opinions on the matter. I do admit that you are right about my poll-question setup being bad due provoking nature of the first question. But I did want to also provoke discussion and hopefully some constructive feedback which hopefully is being read by someone in actual position to affect these matters or the very least forward the word to Pearl Abyss.

Again my opinion is that they should rather use carrot (alternative node wars for top-tier guilds) than stick (more restrictions) in order to solve this problem.

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Posted

don't bother more than 99% of this forum has never been in a guild holding a castle for 4+ weeks after merge and can't understand how boring it gets.

by the way, 2 weeks ago two guilds gave away their region because they were being dodged every single weekend. how is this intended mechanic?

on EU we're not swapping guilds for some reason which makes T3s even more boring for top guilds not holding a castle and locks some guilds pvp during multiple weeks.

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Posted

Just let guilds that have a city fight on T3 nodes, nobody is fighting on them currently.  Sad thing is players will always work around the mechanics to get what they want.  T3's going uncontested while smurf guilds are down in t2s

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Posted

It should decrease to 12 hours for joining another guild.  
And increase to 12 days for re-joining the same guild after leaving it. 

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Posted

1 week timer for rejoining the guild you left. 

 

Overgeared players need to stop smurfing in node war guilds just because they're bored. You're hurting the future of the game. Let the new players duke it out in t1's. 

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Posted

Apparently yesterday a 95 man siege guild (i won't say the name) dropped on a T1 node to help a 4 man guild get the node.... Fun times.

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Posted

Apparently yesterday a 95 man siege guild (i won't say the name) dropped on a T1 node to help a 4 man guild get the node.... Fun times.

meanwhile "We have to give the node away so we dont cap out too early"  and that very same day how many t3s went uncontested? 

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Posted

You can't let region holders drop on T3s unless you drop the reqs for placing a guild HQ to owning 2 T2 nodes instead of 2 Tier 3 nodes. If you want to give region holders some PvP I would do 1 region node a day as there is only 5 guilds that could even place on it, Sunday-Friday, no limit to how many days you can drop and no rewards for winning, just PvP.

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Posted

I don't think the people hating on siege guilds that do node wars get it, most of those guilds go into node wars with like 20% of their actual member count and MAYBE bring a couple of players from their core, the really hardcore ones however, the ones you should be afraid of stay in the main guild most of the time grinding, life skilling or both to be able to save up for the next TET accesory to get posted on the market.

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Posted (edited)

I don't think the people hating on siege guilds that do node wars get it, most of those guilds go into node wars with like 20% of their actual member count and MAYBE bring a couple of players from their core, the really hardcore ones however, the ones you should be afraid of stay in the main guild most of the time grinding, life skilling or both to be able to save up for the next TET accesory to get posted on the market.

This is the minority actually. Vision and gravity had about half of their pvp cores and manup 2/5th. Barcode had 1/4th but were using a large guild as foundation. I really love the idea of getting good fights with these guilds like this. I'm personally just not a fan of paying off allies with this method. I'm all for alliances on nodes when it makes sense, my guild gets quadruple penetrated from time to time and it's usually justified, but siege guilds are the strongest on t2 nodes every time and would require combined effort to have a shot at eliminating them. In terms of good competitive play, allying with a siege guild on a low tier node can certainly scare many players away. A lot of ppl don't like what vertex does in terms of only recruiting players who hold their own weight, but we will always attack the strongest enemies first on our nodes if we are able to do so. We've had great fights with siege guilds once or twice a week for the past couple weeks and it's always a refreshing experience. 

Edited by Vudani
edited so salty boys can see clearly

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Posted

A lot of ppl don't like what vertex does in terms of recruitment

Lul I wonder why :^).

easy-poached-eggs-b-600.jpg

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Posted

Lul I wonder why :^).

easy-poached-eggs-b-600.jpg

I'm referring to holding a high standard and only picking up players that hold their own weight. Larger guilds typically will take in nooblets and try to train em up. That just ain't my cup of tea.

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Posted

I mean, half of this discussion is hypocritical and simply idiotic. Everyone is complaining about siege guilds going and dropping in alt guilds and wrecking weaker people, but that's been something that's been happening since node wars really started... but instead of it being smurf guilds it's just straight up very geared people choosing to build on a tier of node that is below the average level of skill and gear of it's members. There will always be people that enjoy going and completely dominating weaker players and if you think it's only siege guild players that do that, then you're all idiots. So the fact of the matter is, the argument about siege tier guilds "exploiting" is idiotic. Because if you are going to complain about this being unfair but not about high tier players being in low tier guilds or carrying their guild or just high average gear/skill guilds building on t1's and t2's then well -----. But you can't complain about that because you can't control where people choose to go or what they choose to do especially in a game like this. Then, you shouldn't be complaining about the siege tier guilds, cause lets face it, if you're that weak, you will be getting dominated by these people too which should be "unfair". Just take the loss and use it as an opportunity to make a goal of what to aim towards instead of coming to the forums and crying about how unfair it is and just progress and get to the point you can fight back, or band together to fight them, they are still just players and numbers > any amount of skill or gear tbh. 

On a side note, I can say with confidence that most siege guilds would never bring their entire force to a node war especially if they are on a t2 or lower, every time I've had to be on a t3 node from losing a region it's been over within the first half hour and that shit is boring af, only times it's not is when there is another siege tier guild on the node.

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Posted

I'm referring to holding a high standard and only picking up players that hold their own weight. Larger guilds typically will take in nooblets and try to train em up. That just ain't my cup of tea.

Are you being serious or is this just a really good shitpost?

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Posted

Are you being serious or is this just a really good shitpost?

Poaching would imply an effort for me to recruit from other peoples guilds. I know it's hard for some to understand, but I do not start dialogues regarding joining my guild with the former members of manup, barcode, gravity, iconic, and quite a few other siege guilds who for one reason or another find a situation void of most of the problems people have with siege wars to be appealing. If anything, I chat with friends about video games and shit. A lot of players message me, I always talk with people who want to do so. A lot get turned away but most players who pass our reqs do come from some high profile guilds. Blame the shit state of siege pvp tbh. If my guys wanna siege they can pretty much go anywhere, which is fine, we are a very different guild and my members enjoy what we do. Some who lack a decent core of players very much do not enjoy fighting us due to the lack of softies and our small numbers in comparison.

My initial comment, if you could get out of your bubble, was aimed at saying that my guild is similar to ringer guilds and we like fights that we can lose. We don't bring allies because that would be stupid overkill and we enjoy competitive play. Many ringer guilds opt to pay off siege allies and completely zerg down nodes, that is not competitive, that is business.

It's unfortunate that there aren't more guilds operating, T3 nodes are a shot in the dark at either getting a siege guild passing the node to an ally or a decent fight that a low tier siege guild might be able to do something with. Many guilds seem to be avoiding conflict on T2s or just try to snipe for the cash and a lot of old T2 guilds have dropped down to T1. I guess most of that is just due to natural attrition. Many guilds we see on T2s we go toe to toe with, very even fights and end up stalemating often. It's hard to encounter such guilds though since many players continue to drop down to more casual statuses, similar to the state of siege guilds. 

Will a reduction in guild timers help competitive play? probably. Do other T2/T1 guilds want to see ringer guilds every day of the week? Probably not, many guilds fight friday/sunday to avoid some of that. Honestly, people should nut up and fight it out. Hit the hardest targets and the ringers wont always win as they have been. FML and my guild managed to do it, I know there have been 2 other opportunities completely squandered to take down ringer guilds on my nodes due to politics or fear. My vote was in favor, but it will never happen.

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Poaching would imply an effort for me to recruit from other peoples guilds. I know it's hard for some to understand, but I do not start dialogues regarding joining my guild with the former members of manup, barcode, gravity, iconic, and quite a few other siege guilds who for one reason or another find a situation void of most of the problems people have with siege wars to be appealing. If anything, I chat with friends about video games and shit. A lot of players message me, I always talk with people who want to do so. A lot get turned away but most players who pass our reqs do come from some high profile guilds. Blame the shit state of siege pvp tbh. If my guys wanna siege they can pretty much go anywhere, which is fine, we are a very different guild and my members enjoy what we do. Some who lack a decent core of players very much do not enjoy fighting us due to the lack of softies and our small numbers in comparison.

My initial comment, if you could get out of your bubble, was aimed at saying that my guild is similar to ringer guilds and we like fights that we can lose. We don't bring allies because that would be stupid overkill and we enjoy competitive play. Many ringer guilds opt to pay off siege allies and completely zerg down nodes, that is not competitive, that is business.

It's unfortunate that there aren't more guilds operating, T3 nodes are a shot in the dark at either getting a siege guild passing the node to an ally or a decent fight that a low tier siege guild might be able to do something with. Many guilds seem to be avoiding conflict on T2s or just try to snipe for the cash and a lot of old T2 guilds have dropped down to T1. I guess most of that is just due to natural attrition. Many guilds we see on T2s we go toe to toe with, very even fights and end up stalemating often. It's hard to encounter such guilds though since many players continue to drop down to more casual statuses, similar to the state of siege guilds. 

Will a reduction in guild timers help competitive play? probably. Do other T2/T1 guilds want to see ringer guilds every day of the week? Probably not, many guilds fight friday/sunday to avoid some of that. Honestly, people should nut up and fight it out. Hit the hardest targets and the ringers wont always win as they have been. FML and my guild managed to do it, I know there have been 2 other opportunities completely squandered to take down ringer guilds on my nodes due to politics or fear. My vote was in favor, but it will never happen.

Lul I don't know what bubble you're talking about and about the poaching I don't really care about it, whether it was intentional or not, those people chose to be part of something else and if they are having fun that's alright. As you know we have been doing T1s/T2s on Maximus during the week to get some fights and even though we're only bringing like 1 or 2 people from our core, most of the time non-siege guilds choose not to fight or just don't try to ally with the other people placed in the node to take us down, I thought the new world was going to be different but it's pretty much the same thing.

I would like the timers to be reduced as well but it's not gonna happen, they won't be increased either most likely so ringer guilds will forever be a thing, the best thing smaller guilds could do is, instead of complaining on the forums, ally together to try and fight them.

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Posted (edited)

Guild drop out cooldown timer shoud actually be increased.

There are way too many players abusing this system to constantly win sieges/nodes with different guilds, maximing their profit. Keep in mind that guilds lose profit for conquering the same nodes/regions every week.

Example:

  • Guild A wins Valencia Territory on Saturday.
  • Guild A distributes the siege war funds between all participants.
  • Guild A members leave the guild and join Guild B.
  • Guild B wins Valencia Territory on Saturday.
  • Guild B distributes the siege war funds between all participants.
  • Guild B players rejoin Guild A again.
  • Repeat for profit.

This system is being constantly abused, making rich players even richer. Also, I won't even talk about the fact you can just drop out from a guild in case of war and karmagrief everyone you want without worrying because you know you'll be able to join again the day after.

Edited by Stellary
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