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About to join the ranks of the others who have left this class....

101 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Let me start by saying....

I Love my Kunoichi so much...but time and time again outgearing other classes and still losing. 
I get it... get good, blah blah... 

Not everyone is Paiz or Yannay or other good Kunos who seem to have amazing computer and amazing internet or follow one similar pattern of attacking.

All I ask is for an even playing field. All I ask is our awaken skills be competitive with other classes. To have more options with our skills

Rank 3 Sah Spree: % 593
Rank 2 Lunar Dash : % 834
Rank 3 Half Moon Slash : % 705
Rank 2 Delighted Blast : % 815 / 905
Rank 2 Lethal Spin : % 591
Rank 2 Wheel of Wrath : % 388
Lunatic Disc : % 894
Ping Pong : % 765
Danse Macabre : % 924
Chakram Rise : % 936



When you compare these to similar ranks of other classes with similar mechanics to ours....Sorc, Ninja, we can even go as far as Ranger and Maehwa

Kuo is the only class where even rank 3 Awaken skills do not go over  % 1000

I am over 200 ap, and struggle against classes like Sorcerer who I outgear by a wide margin.


I am just fed up and about to list all my Kunos items and abandon this sinking ship....


Please give me some hope... tell me something that will make me fall in love again. 

 

crying-face.png

Edited by Visnja

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Posted (edited)

Well I mean first off..... those are the damage %s for a single hit..... most of our skills range between 3 to 12 hits mind you, and average at about 8... other classes kinda cap out at about 7 max, with an average of 3 hits.

The other classes that do have "the big hits" have fewer hits in general. So it's not entirely that our skills are just weaker - it's more really that they kinda take longer to play out for the same damage is all. - though that means lower dps...

What we do have is our stupidly good CCs. 9 hit stun skills, floats, stiffnesses + superarmor+invis. What other class can appear from nowhere and cc chain upwards of 6 people for about 8 seconds - and doesn't have to rely on a grab at all? - though we do have one if we need.


Now I can't convince you that Kunos have the best damage. What I can say though is that it is a solid class that can fight just about anyone. You could go play a warrior and complain that your CCs never work because they're all 1-3 hits, you can go play a Musa and be super fast and a dps wrecking ball but you'll have no grab, you can go play a ninja and have all the best single target damage combo in the game but you'll have no superarmor. You can go play wizard and kill 10 people in a single mighty spell, but you'll have no way to survive afterwards. Or. You can play the Kuno that appears from nowhere, blankets an area with enough CC that anyone that walks close in the next 3 seconds is going to have to suffer the entirety of your 8+ second CC chain - being entirely in superarmor while you do so/also with enough ap, maybe 4 of those 6 will be dead or at least severely maimed hp wise - and can log+grab anyone that poses an issue for an extra second and a bit of iframe and CC, and just tendon cutter ghost step ghost greeting lunar dash danse macabre out and go invis after.

Though. We're not super mobile, in my opinion, having one of the least sustainable movement in the game, but we can zig zag REALLY well and just go invis after it. We do have enough CCs and Superarmors and a good enough iframe with block jump that we can basically annihilate anyone that comes into range though - if they can be cc'd, if not, well then switch out and grab, if grab desyncs...... pray? xD. Pre-awakening was our way to bypass any opponent defence, and awakening is our way to do damage and throw down so much CC and Superarmor that we're basically the immovable object.

Honestly I've never had any issue dealing with Sorcs. Their iframes are short enough that if they stop you'll cc them, if they don't stop they burn out their stamina, remember, 6-8 short dodges and 4-5 long dodges is their limit. Their frontal guard doesn't mean anything if your CC covers yourself and they phase through you and CC themself on your blanket of CC, their superarmor doesn't mean anything if you can just block jump and grab them out of it because it takes them so long to cast, their ranged CC doesn't mean anything if you can just block it with ease.

The one issue I can attest to is Kuno's lack of a sustainable forward moving mobility. Personally I can't manage to keep up with anyone. I can outrun anyone I please with the invis, but with the burst mobility most have, the moment they stop rendering on my screen I'm done.

And maybe the damage is lacking in a game where being cc'd doesn't mean you stop healing. In any proper game, being CC'd should mean you lose the ability to heal or drink pots- in my opinion one of the key reasons why CC classes are classed as "bad" - coming from Vindi and Dark Souls where drinking potions took time and an animation - Vindi even had a minigame to drink faster if you held the button down for the perfect amount of time - a skill called Potion Mastery available to all classed. Imagine if you could be interrupted during potion drinks, having enough ap to out damage pots wouldn't be a thing anymore, you could just cc them every single time and they'd die eventually.

But, I digress.The damage is sub par, but it's not horrible. It's no pre-awaken level where we could be outpotted by someone who had just 30 dp more than our ap - exaggeration. And, someone has to have the worst damage, we have the best close ranged CC and superarmor so why not us?

Personally I love my Kuno. Never had an issue that was too big to bear personally. I also personally love that underestimation I get. Where basically every class will walk into the rotation and think they can fight me, yet don't even know my mechanics.

PS; horrible computer and Aussie so bad net.
PPS: - yes I do get nuked to death from range sometimes before my first skill ends. Yes it is a thing. Raw damage kills us really well. No this is not an issue with our class.

Edited by RosewoodTrickster
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Posted

I am *really* and I mean REALLY close to re-rolling.  I really like my Kuno, like the playstyle and awakening.  What I'm getting tired of, is getting beaten by class carried players who press a few buttons and strip my health off like I'm not wearing any gear.  Sorcs, Wiz/Witch's, Zerkers etc... then type "git gud" while stood over my corpse.  I can time my combo's perfectly, position myself properly chain CC properly and all they do is press one or two abilities and I'm -----ed.

Why should I stick to Kuno? It's ignored by the devs, it definitely won't get  ANY attention now DK is being released.  Pretty sure Kuno's will get pushed further down the pecking order and DK's will be the next FOTM OP class.

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Posted (edited)

You don't have to re-roll, if you aren't enjoying the Kuno, just shelf it until they give it some buff love, and play something else for a little while.  Learning the other classes gives you some insight into abilities and what they are doing when you are up against them in PvP.

Besides, if they do the same as they did in KR, we'll get an extra character slot for 1 loyalty point for the DK.

Edited by Stevoli
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Posted (edited)

You don't have to re-roll, if you aren't enjoying the Kuno, just shelf it until they give it some buff love, and play something else for a little while.  Learning the other classes gives you some insight into abilities and what they are doing when you are up against them in PvP.

Besides, if they do the same as they did in KR, we'll get an extra character slot for 1 loyalty point for the DK.

I like my Kuno I really do, but I don't like getting beat by another class that's simply better rather than the player being more skilled.  Besides, you play something else your Kuno is losing out on SP etc... I just want them to announce SOMETHING about a buff or them even looking at Kuno's and the other classes that are the bottom of the pile.  Or are they expecting people to re-roll to other classes.  All I see when grinding are Sorcs, Zerks, War's and Wiz/Witches.  I mean surely they can see that there are 5 or so classes that aren't being played because they are behind the top 3-4 classes.

I have an awakened Sorc, Witch, Wiz, Ninja, Tamer and Valk.  So there are classes I *could* simply re-gear too but I wan't Kuno to be better than it is.  I don't want to feel like I need to re-roll and wait months for them to even acknowledge that they need to buff the class.  I have played a lot of MMO's and this is by the worse from a balance perspective, there communication is non-existent, they don't acknowledge class problems and they don't talk to the community.

Edited by Cyrus Glitch
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Posted

 I have played a lot of MMO's and this is by the worse from a balance perspective, there communication is non-existent, they don't acknowledge class problems and they don't talk to the community.

Yeah I get what you mean, it's mostly because this is a KR game though.  NA mods report feedback to the KR developers, and then the KR developers get back to NA mods eventually.  People on reddit usually post translated KR patch notes, which are usually 30 days before we get the patch here.

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Posted

You don't have to re-roll, if you aren't enjoying the Kuno, just shelf it until they give it some buff love, and play something else for a little while.  Learning the other classes gives you some insight into abilities and what they are doing when you are up against them in PvP.

Besides, if they do the same as they did in KR, we'll get an extra character slot for 1 loyalty point for the DK.

Like this ?

 

2017-02-21_13962817.JPG

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Posted


Please give me some hope... tell me something that will make me fall in love again. 

Hmmm.  My Kuno is 56.15 with a PRI circle of death, and DUO armor.  My stats are 130 121 250.  I've never PVP'd in Black Desert. 

Yesterday I was jumped twice in the mane/outlaw areas.  The first guy zipped around and had a pokey weapon that could zap me.  We beat on each other for a while and I disengaged when he got mixed  up with some outlaws.  I ran for the hills but he caught up to me pretty fast.  Dammit, this guy is not going to stop.  I decided that if he wanted to fight I would try to beat him, instead of fleeing the area.  It was close, and he hurt me badly several times, but I ended up killing him.  My special affects were so bright I didn't understand that I had won until after all the flashing lights went away and he was laying on the ground, dead.   Huh, what do you know?

The second time was in the manes area.  I've learned to watch my minimap for player squares and sure enough, I saw someone following exactly along my path.  Turned out to be a Beserker wearing a flaming orange and red feather outfit.  I stopped and turned to face him and he attacked.  For a llllloooooooonnnnnnnggggg time we went at it.  He would grab me, slam me, pick me up and carry me then body slam me.  Then he would shoot me with his arms, and sometimes would jack hammer away at me.  I would get up, heal, and attack him with that big light spell and with my disappear and blow up power and hurt him bad.  Then he would heal up.  It went like that over and over.  

Then my "issue" occurred and my screen slid away and I could no longer see my character or affect the game world.  I could hear him attacking though, and eventually I died. 

I have no clue how he was geared, what level he was, or what his score was.  I just know that until my computer messed up I fought him to a draw solo.  I think he was better than me because he kept cursing at me... and I couldn't take my fingers off my keyboard to respond.  But it WAS a draw, until I lost my screen.  I've read over and over that these Berserkers were too powerful, that they had too many grabs, that they were impossible to kill because they healed so well.  

Well Visnja, I had only ONE pvp battle under my belt and I fought him to a draw.  I'm pretty sure when I get my circle of death to TRI, the outcome will be better. 

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Posted (edited)

Hmmm.  My Kuno is 56.15 with a PRI circle of death, and DUO armor.  My stats are 130 121 250.  I've never PVP'd in Black Desert. 

Yesterday I was jumped twice in the mane/outlaw areas.  The first guy zipped around and had a pokey weapon that could zap me.  We beat on each other for a while and I disengaged when he got mixed  up with some outlaws.  I ran for the hills but he caught up to me pretty fast.  Dammit, this guy is not going to stop.  I decided that if he wanted to fight I would try to beat him, instead of fleeing the area.  It was close, and he hurt me badly several times, but I ended up killing him.  My special affects were so bright I didn't understand that I had won until after all the flashing lights went away and he was laying on the ground, dead.   Huh, what do you know?

The second time was in the manes area.  I've learned to watch my minimap for player squares and sure enough, I saw someone following exactly along my path.  Turned out to be a Beserker wearing a flaming orange and red feather outfit.  I stopped and turned to face him and he attacked.  For a llllloooooooonnnnnnnggggg time we went at it.  He would grab me, slam me, pick me up and carry me then body slam me.  Then he would shoot me with his arms, and sometimes would jack hammer away at me.  I would get up, heal, and attack him with that big light spell and with my disappear and blow up power and hurt him bad.  Then he would heal up.  It went like that over and over.  

Then my "issue" occurred and my screen slid away and I could no longer see my character or affect the game world.  I could hear him attacking though, and eventually I died. 

I have no clue how he was geared, what level he was, or what his score was.  I just know that until my computer messed up I fought him to a draw solo.  I think he was better than me because he kept cursing at me... and I couldn't take my fingers off my keyboard to respond.  But it WAS a draw, until I lost my screen.  I've read over and over that these Berserkers were too powerful, that they had too many grabs, that they were impossible to kill because they healed so well.  

Well Visnja, I had only ONE pvp battle under my belt and I fought him to a draw.  I'm pretty sure when I get my circle of death to TRI, the outcome will be better. 

I am worried what will happen to you when you come across someone who's actually geared.  Especially a Zerker.  They will kill you in ONE grab in about 2-4 seconds flat if they have over 180AP Which is low for geared Zerkers.  I've fought lvl 59/60 Zerkers that kill me in under 2 seconds they were both on over 200AP.  If you do manage to do any damage to them, they will just Lava pierce away and heal to full.  Sorcs on 180-210 AP will kill you in one CC and a Violation Chain.  Warriors are able to one-shot you if they have 180AP.  I won't even get into Witches and Wizards.  Basically every class with the exception of Valk are better than us.  Better damage scaling, better awakened flows available at earlier levels.

You need to be level 58 on and geared BETTER than your opponent AND you need to know your class and combo's inside AND out to win vs any moderately geared FOTM character.

Despite the flaws, I'm staying with my Kuno.  It's a fun class, it just needs some help from the Devs.  I had some cracking fights down at Sausans tonight, where the stealthy playstyle helped me attack/harass the poor sods that decided to flag on us.  Some good fights and I didn't feel entirely useless.  I am starting to realise that built properly, geared correctly and played properly it can be really rewarding to smash some of the current FOTM classes like War/Sorc/Zerk/Witch/Wizard etc... :)

Edited by Cyrus Glitch
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Posted

I don't know why you mentioned having a good computer or internet, you're going lag regardless of what class you play. Second, you're only level 58, I'm assuming you're ONLY around 450 AP/DP. If you're queuing RBF and getting destroyed it's because almost everyone in there is level 59-61 with 500+ AP/DP. 

And don't get me wrong, Kuno is a low tier class, but you're quitting for all the wrong reasons. 

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Posted (edited)

Hmmm.  My Kuno is 56.15 with a PRI circle of death, and DUO armor.  My stats are 130 121 250.  I've never PVP'd in Black Desert. 

Yesterday I was jumped twice in the mane/outlaw areas.  The first guy zipped around and had a pokey weapon that could zap me.  We beat on each other for a while and I disengaged when he got mixed  up with some outlaws.  I ran for the hills but he caught up to me pretty fast.  Dammit, this guy is not going to stop.  I decided that if he wanted to fight I would try to beat him, instead of fleeing the area.  It was close, and he hurt me badly several times, but I ended up killing him.  My special affects were so bright I didn't understand that I had won until after all the flashing lights went away and he was laying on the ground, dead.   Huh, what do you know?

The second time was in the manes area.  I've learned to watch my minimap for player squares and sure enough, I saw someone following exactly along my path.  Turned out to be a Beserker wearing a flaming orange and red feather outfit.  I stopped and turned to face him and he attacked.  For a llllloooooooonnnnnnnggggg time we went at it.  He would grab me, slam me, pick me up and carry me then body slam me.  Then he would shoot me with his arms, and sometimes would jack hammer away at me.  I would get up, heal, and attack him with that big light spell and with my disappear and blow up power and hurt him bad.  Then he would heal up.  It went like that over and over.  

Then my "issue" occurred and my screen slid away and I could no longer see my character or affect the game world.  I could hear him attacking though, and eventually I died. 

I have no clue how he was geared, what level he was, or what his score was.  I just know that until my computer messed up I fought him to a draw solo.  I think he was better than me because he kept cursing at me... and I couldn't take my fingers off my keyboard to respond.  But it WAS a draw, until I lost my screen.  I've read over and over that these Berserkers were too powerful, that they had too many grabs, that they were impossible to kill because they healed so well.  

Well Visnja, I had only ONE pvp battle under my belt and I fought him to a draw.  I'm pretty sure when I get my circle of death to TRI, the outcome will be better. 

I applaud you, but it seem both of your attackers at manes were low geared. 

Kuno PvP Really begins at 58 with Ping pong...but by that time, every other class get they 58 skill with will melt your face off. 
:|

I don't know why you mentioned having a good computer or internet, you're going lag regardless of what class you play. Second, you're only level 58, I'm assuming you're ONLY around 450 AP/DP. If you're queuing RBF and getting destroyed it's because almost everyone in there is level 59-61 with 500+ AP/DP. 

And don't get me wrong, Kuno is a low tier class, but you're quitting for all the wrong reasons. 

I do not do RBF. I am over the age of 30. 

Most people in RBF are trash mouth little boys trying to see who hit puberty first 
:/

Edit: I am close to 500 combined.
I am 58 ( almost 59 ) ..after playing Kuno since release...only because If i grind for more than 3 hours, I want to put my head into a microwave.

Selling costumes, buying Artisans Memory and having 7 classes 56+ finishing quest line has allowed me to have decent income to support my Kuno. She is no slouch. 
But dying to 56 Witch and 57 Sorcs who i KNOW i outgear by a wide margin has really got me on my last straw 

Edited by Visnja

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Posted

 

Sorry op, i can't help you with this.

The biggest reason is i am rolling myself to Dark Knight, but i also don't have anything that would make you fall in love once again.

If you look at how PA and kashkow have handled the kuno and ninja since release, i just can't see them fixing those classes anytime soon because if they really wanted to they would have done so by now.

So that's why i have made the choice to make my kuno a boss alt and dark knight my main, so i can still play my kuno once in a blue moon.

I think it's sad that so many kuno and ninja players have asked to look at their classes, but the best you can get is "working as intended" or "we have send your info to PA"  It's strange that if only 2% of the Russian playerbase played kuno it doesn't hit home to the devs that something might be wrong. Then take all the info from the west which would have been send to PA on a regular basis and still nothing. 

I always say that actions always speak louder then words, so if you keep that saying in mind and look at how PA and Kashkow have handled the kuno and ninja classes and their playerbase then you just know that they have given up already. And in their minds it's more than normal for a few classes to burst you in 1 or 2 skills to the ground and other classes to use their entire skill set in order to do the same. Then take into account the potato server's of theirs and there's your answer, even if they would buff kuno if they still require you to do at least a 3 or 4 skills the potato server's would desync you all over the place.

PS: I also never liked the chakram, just gave kuno's kusarigama's and it would have been fine, you can even have somewhat the same skills we had with chakram but more elegant and fitting to the class. And don't get me started on that awakening outfit. 

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

I thought Chakram was a really bad choice also. I would have wanted War Fans, Sai's or something more lore involved

 

Martial Arts[edit]

Kunoichi typically would never resort to combat and rely on seduction if they had the duty to assassinate. They often used small compact weapons to hide in their kimonos. For example, the neko te were "cat claws" that would scratch and would sometimes be dipped in a poison before use. Tessen, folding fans, were also in use as they can be a "weapon hid in plain sight" because tessen were carried around by everyone in the era. Screaming would also allow discomfort to the target and attract attention if a Kunoichi were to get hurt or threatened before running away.

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/user/KimKunoichiOfKorea/videos

Edited by Visnja
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Posted

the neko te were "cat claws" that would scratch and would sometimes be dipped in a poison before use.

Those would have actually fit the awakened costume a lot better lol

But I think then we would have ended up looking like:

latest?cb=20100718232201

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Poisoned claws would've been pretty BA though. I would have liked a bit more mobility in awakening too, personally. They feel rather clunky. I wouldn't expect an assassin to move that slowly. I blame Chakram. xD

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Posted (edited)

When you need a Ghillie suit to be somewhat competitive against an equally geared opponent (minus wizard, just run away lol), you know you might wanna consider re-rolling.

Wanna know what class doesn't need a Ghillie Suit? Wizard.  They don't need it lol.

Edited by LightningFFXIII-4
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You know that you guys are probably NOT giving the OP  hope... right?   hahahah.  Yes, I also suspect that the opponents I fought were badly geared, but I consider myself also badly geared and of low level at only 56.  I was hoping that I was giving him hope.  :)

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Sorry op, i can't help you with this.

The biggest reason is i am rolling myself to Dark Knight, but i also don't have anything that would make you fall in love once again.

If you look at how PA and kashkow have handled the kuno and ninja since release, i just can't see them fixing those classes anytime soon because if they really wanted to they would have done so by now.

So that's why i have made the choice to make my kuno a boss alt and dark knight my main, so i can still play my kuno once in a blue moon.

I think it's sad that so many kuno and ninja players have asked to look at their classes, but the best you can get is "working as intended" or "we have send your info to PA"  It's strange that if only 2% of the Russian playerbase played kuno it doesn't hit home to the devs that something might be wrong. Then take all the info from the west which would have been send to PA on a regular basis and still nothing. 

I always say that actions always speak louder then words, so if you keep that saying in mind and look at how PA and Kashkow have handled the kuno and ninja classes and their playerbase then you just know that they have given up already. And in their minds it's more than normal for a few classes to burst you in 1 or 2 skills to the ground and other classes to use their entire skill set in order to do the same. Then take into account the potato server's of theirs and there's your answer, even if they would buff kuno if they still require you to do at least a 3 or 4 skills the potato server's would desync you all over the place.

PS: I also never liked the chakram, just gave kuno's kusarigama's and it would have been fine, you can even have somewhat the same skills we had with chakram but more elegant and fitting to the class. And don't get me started on that awakening outfit. 

 

 

 

 

Typically in MMO's stealth/assassin classes are the most popular.  Usually fun to play, high damage, high mobility etc...  BDO is the only game that's managed to break that mould, by just ignored Ninja's/Kuno's I'm not even sure they think they are still in the game lol maybe they thought they'd patched them out months ago :P

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Hello everyone :)

The different classes can have advantages and disadvantages but why did they make them so unbalanced? Kunoichi is my main character, I have all my lifeskills on her. When I made the character I didn't know that it was weak. :( And now it's too late. I can't imagine levelling life skills to master level on another character and buying inventory and weight limits. I shouldn't have to. The classes should be balanced. And then who knows, that other character might be nerfed like some have been before.

Which class are you going to switch to?

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Posted (edited)

Hello everyone :)

The different classes can have advantages and disadvantages but why did they make them so unbalanced? Kunoichi is my main character, I have all my lifeskills on her. When I made the character I didn't know that it was weak. :( And now it's too late. I can't imagine levelling life skills to master level on another character and buying inventory and weight limits. I shouldn't have to. The classes should be balanced. And then who knows, that other character might be nerfed like some have been before.

Which class are you going to switch to?

I am playing both my Kuno & Dark Knight equally.....

I have 7 classes level 56, and my Kuno is 59


I have not decided what to do with my Kuno, if anything, yet :(

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My Dark Knight, Tajci

unknown (2).jpg

Edited by Visnja

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I am playing both my Kuno & Dark Knight equally.....
I have 7 classes level 56, and my Kuno is 59


I have not decided what to do with my Kuno, if anything, yet :(

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My Dark Knight, Tajci

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Cool :) Is dark knight stronger than kunoichi?

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Cool :) Is dark knight stronger than kunoichi?

No. People are just unskilled with the ninja/kuno class in general.
Kuno and Ninja are global counters, but require the most skill out of any of the any classes.

Most people simply don't want to learn what they need to to be gods.
Most people simply don't want to put the work in to be gods.
At the end of the day, any class can do it, it's the driver that makes the mitsakes.

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No. People are just unskilled with the ninja/kuno class in general.Kuno and Ninja are global counters, but require the most skill out of any of the any classes.

Most people simply don't want to learn what they need to to be gods.
Most people simply don't want to put the work in to be gods.
At the end of the day, any class can do it, it's the driver that makes the mitsakes.

OF COURSE that HAS to be it right? It's not because the Kuno needs some love, it is because everyone who plays kuno is an unskilled mouth-breather.  Glad you stopped by to give your advice.....

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.
At the end of the day, any class can do it, it's the driver that makes the mitsakes.

9_9

Cool :) Is dark knight stronger than kunoichi?

in KR - yes

in NA - not yet

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No. People are just unskilled with the ninja/kuno class in general.Kuno and Ninja are global counters, but require the most skill out of any of the any classes.

Most people simply don't want to learn what they need to to be gods.
Most people simply don't want to put the work in to be gods.
At the end of the day, any class can do it, it's the driver that makes the mitsakes.

Ofc if most kuno's/ninja's have switched.

Must be that literally every ninja/kuno must be bad.

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