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Seriously though why is the reward vs punishment for PvP/PK so imbalanced?

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Posted

And when are they going to fix it.

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Posted

i agree, still too easy for pk griefers to cause trouble  

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Posted

after you pk 1 preson you lose 60k karma what they should add is a system where you can free kill that same person for the next 10 mins and byt the time to mins is up you should have made some karma back so can grind for longer while spot griefers get dead for not leaveing after you told them spot taken.

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Posted

Why should PK be rewarded?

Yooo I jumped some unsuspecting guy, gimme lolly mom.

No, for serious. Real PvP (guild war/ rbf) gets rewarded, what more do you want. Cept pvp balance maybe :P

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Posted (edited)

If you want to be a killer and take out unflagged players, this is described by the devs as an evil playstyle, which is why they have the karma system. 

They removed the penalties for dying in pvp because some people think it is fun to kill afk fishers and trainers. And because it makes no sense to punish the victims of assault.

Fact is, there are many reasons why the system is set up the way it is. I have yet to see anyone put forward a really good case to switch it back.

Edited by Drustein
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Posted

Why should PK be rewarded?

Yooo I jumped some unsuspecting guy, gimme lolly mom.

No, for serious. Real PvP (guild war/ rbf) gets rewarded, what more do you want. Cept pvp balance maybe :P

Lol at RBF being "real pvp".

The reason why it should be rewarded is obvious.. to promote fun and exciting emergent gameplay.  Any game is more fun with stakes.  There is zero motive for emergent PvP gameplay right now.  At least ArcheAge had tradepacks and fish you could steal.

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Posted

 

Fact is, there are many reasons why the system is set up the way it is. I have yet to see anyone put forward a really good case to switch it back.

Bbbbbbut my spot....my efficiency!

e82c4e26c17935c376d5d4c98deda2e9.jpg

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Posted

Because everybody I

From level 50 to 6, 200gs to 550gs is forced into the same two spots for efficiency/silver.

Can't do anything about the current system until Valencia is massively buffed up

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Posted

Why should PK be rewarded?

Yooo I jumped some unsuspecting guy, gimme lolly mom.

No, for serious. Real PvP (guild war/ rbf) gets rewarded, what more do you want. Cept pvp balance maybe :P

It's an owgame, if you don't pay attention to your environment the likelihood is high that you die

BDO has no fair pvp, it's what it is, hence they invented the v button

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Posted (edited)

its so bad to get punished in bdo for being the stronger player... a weaker player will just grief the shit out of you and the stronger has to leave the channel, while the competitive player mentality is : Ok i lost to this guy. he is stronger, he won the spot... the mentality of our lovely karma system is disgusting, when it should be competitive as gaming titles stand for...

Edited by Draconis
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Posted

Because everybody I

From level 50 to 6, 200gs to 550gs is forced into the same two spots for efficiency/silver.

Can't do anything about the current system until Valencia is massively buffed up

For the current system they just need to fix karma bombers.
 

I want to see them introduce new mechanics though.  Something in which players willingly risk assets to make money, but which can be stolen from by Pk'ers..  (but then people will whine and say everyone should be entitled to do this without pk! and the endless cycle will go on).

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Posted

Lol at RBF being "real pvp".

The reason why it should be rewarded is obvious.. to promote fun and exciting emergent gameplay.  Any game is more fun with stakes.  There is zero motive for emergent PvP gameplay right now.  At least ArcheAge had tradepacks and fish you could steal.

That's why I mentioned PvP balance :P

You can steal fish/ trade packs here too. And not everyone finds it fun to get ganked, especially with that balance and gear impact. And I doubt Kakao will run this as a hardcore low-playerbase PvP niche game -> no players, no gaem, no pvpz for anyone and stuff.

If you want some emergent thrilling etc PvP game, Albion and Crowfall are coming soon.

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Posted

its so bad to get punished in bdo for being the stronger player... a weaker player will just grief the shit out of you and the stronger has to leave the channel, while the competitive player mentality is : Ok i lost to this guy. he is stronger, he won the spot... the mentality of our lovely karma system is disgusting, when it should be competitive as gaming titles stand for...

You can still outgrind most of those scums

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Posted

For the current system they just need to fix karma bombers.
 

I want to see them introduce new mechanics though.  Something in which players willingly risk assets to make money, but which can be stolen from by Pk'ers..  (but then people will whine and say everyone should be entitled to do this without pk! and the endless cycle will go on).

 they can NoT fix the current karma bombers with the current grind spot meta period.

If and when Valencia gets three buffs. Sure, definitely a LOT of things they can do to fix karma grieving

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Posted

That's why I mentioned PvP balance :P

You can steal fish/ trade packs here too. And not everyone finds it fun to get ganked, especially with that balance and gear impact. And I doubt Kakao will run this as a hardcore low-playerbase PvP niche game -> no players, no gaem, no pvpz for anyone and stuff.

If you want some emergent thrilling etc PvP game, Albion and Crowfall are coming soon.

A niche PvP game is one that is mercilessly brutal.  The type of game where you might die and lose everything you have.  Calling for some sort of a system that has risk and reward built in to it is not the same thing.  In the end I want *meaningful* emergent PvP.  They could introduce a ton of new gameplay mechanics to encourage this, completely separate from just random ganking which is what you are referring to.  The problem is all they do is release new classes and new zones.

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Posted

You can steal fish/ trade packs here too.

How? I wish that was the case, make traderuns much more profitable, make fishing in the open seas more profitable as well and let other players steal those goodies. There you'll get reward/punishment. There would be player made caravans with another player protecting those goods, reward both the trader and the bodyguards and do not give the thieves a full reward, just a % of the goods while the trader always keeps another % even if the goods are stolen so they are not discouraged by losing stuff.

Make profession levels matter by increasing profit or reducing costs (or both). Also make wagons stronger so they can be hard to destroy by other players and it takes effort and time to actually steal one. On top of that give the trader the possibility of repairing his wagon on the road and even rebuild it on the spot if it's destroyed so he can get his items back and same for the thief.

There are many more things that could be added on top of that this game has none of them just afk auto-route for money with low level alts with no risk and 0 fun. Same goes for fishing, time consuming, not very profitable and boring. I remember fishing/trading in Archeage or SRO, that shit was exciting. Entire guilds protecting their traders and groups of thieves scouting trade routes everywhere on the map.

Open world game with nothing to do on it, genious.

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Posted (edited)

A niche PvP game is one that is mercilessly brutal.  The type of game where you might die and lose everything you have.  Calling for some sort of a system that has risk and reward built in to it is not the same thing.  In the end I want *meaningful* emergent PvP.  They could introduce a ton of new gameplay mechanics to encourage this, completely separate from just random ganking which is what you are referring to.  The problem is all they do is release new classes and new zones.

True, they should add game mechanics to cater to more kinds of players (like they are trying atm, by adding some actual PvE endgame content - maybe).

A nice thing to add would be dedicated channels. Like some with no karma penalty or perma-flag for the PvP-lovers and some with no PvP at all for the "carebears" who just want to grind without being bothered with PvP.

And ofc, some equalised arena with rankings would be awesome too.

Thing is, they should not just change game mechanics for one playerbase while deterring the other one with that (more like -you can do everything but you don't have to-).

@Zubi: You have a chance to drop trade goods (including fish) when you ger PK'ed.

Edited by Siderite

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Posted

How? I wish that was the case, make traderuns much more profitable, make fishing in the open seas more profitable as well and let other players steal those goodies. There you'll get reward/punishment. There would be player made caravans with another player protecting those goods, reward both the trader and the bodyguards and do not give the thieves a full reward, just a % of the goods while the trader always keeps another % even if the goods are stolen so they are not discouraged by losing stuff.

Make profession levels matter by increasing profit or reducing costs (or both). Also make wagons stronger so they can be hard to destroy by other players and it takes effort and time to actually steal one. On top of that give the trader the possibility of repairing his wagon on the road and even rebuild it on the spot if it's destroyed so he can get his items back and same for the thief.

There are many more things that could be added on top of that this game has none of them just afk auto-route for money with low level alts with no risk and 0 fun. Same goes for fishing, time consuming, not very profitable and boring. I remember fishing/trading in Archeage or SRO, that shit was exciting. Entire guilds protecting their traders and groups of thieves scouting trade routes everywhere on the map.

Open world game with nothing to do on it, genious.

This x 100000000000 The current Karma system would be much easier to swallow if they actually had any type meaningful PvP content outside of mindless PK'ing.

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Posted

The penalty for PKing in BDO is the lowest out of all mmos ive ever played yet its also the game where ppl have cried the most about it.

As long as PKing have such a nonexistant risk attached to it every1 crying about it without bringing any valid suggestions to make it better are just entitled kids in my eyes.

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Posted

The penalty for PKing in BDO is the lowest out of all mmos ive ever played yet its also the game where ppl have cried the most about it.

As long as PKing have such a nonexistant risk attached to it every1 crying about it without bringing any valid suggestions to make it better are just entitled kids in my eyes.

Wait, what?  The penalty for PK'ing someone and then dying with negative karma is extremely harsh.  Have fun watching 20 mil + crystals shatter and hours worth of grinding disappear.  Or if you get extremely unlucky maybe die to a mob and lose your TET weapon lmao.  All of this for killing somebody who then loses literally nothing ever, at most a few minutes of his time running back to the spot.

What MMO's have you played if this is the lowest out of all of them?  I find this hard to believe.  In ArcheAge you can openly PK (incentivized actually) half the population, and the other half you can go red on and lose basically nothing.  Almost no penalty in that game.   Lineage 2 had a similar PK system to this one but the difference is the person getting PK'd also suffered consequences balancing the system.  Games like Darkfall and Eve, PvP interaction is the entire core of the game and heavily incentivized.  So I don't know what world you are living in but it certainly isn't reality.

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Posted

Wait, what?  The penalty for PK'ing someone and then dying with negative karma is extremely harsh.  Have fun watching 20 mil + crystals shatter and hours worth of grinding disappear.  Or if you get extremely unlucky maybe die to a mob and lose your TET weapon lmao.  All of this for killing somebody who then loses literally nothing ever, at most a few minutes of his time running back to the spot.

What MMO's have you played if this is the lowest out of all of them?  I find this hard to believe.  In ArcheAge you can openly PK (incentivized actually) half the population, and the other half you can go red on and lose basically nothing.  Almost no penalty in that game.   Lineage 2 had a similar PK system to this one but the difference is the person getting PK'd also suffered consequences balancing the system.  Games like Darkfall and Eve, PvP interaction is the entire core of the game and heavily incentivized.  So I don't know what world you are living in but it certainly isn't reality.

How long does it take you to earn back the karma lost for 1 PK? Probably dont have to mention that you regain karma by doing exactly the thing you where gonna do anyway making it almost a free resource.

And you compare Lineage 2 where 1 PK put you on negative karma and you had a high chance of droping gear pieces uppon death on top of the guaranteed exp loss...

BDO is ez-mode for both the PKer and the victim. Thats also a kind of balance.

 

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Posted (edited)

For the current system they just need to fix karma bombers.
 

I want to see them introduce new mechanics though.  Something in which players willingly risk assets to make money, but which can be stolen from by Pk'ers..  (but then people will whine and say everyone should be entitled to do this without pk! and the endless cycle will go on).

You know nothing man... Current system we have arent best, but its lesser evil, cause its minimal punishment for both Pk and victim (griefer)!! Previous system was ok, cause it was with max +15 enchants and it wasnt that easy to gank and pk someone... Right now with current one shot pvp 1% exp loos on death would be disaster!! it doesnt matter if you are lvl 60-61 with 7/7 TET or full tri, if someone with decent gear gank on you from back when you are busy with mobs he have free CC on you and in most cases you are dead from one combo!! Yes ofc you can  come back and take revenge on him in proper 1vs1, but damage would be done already (1% loss)!! And imagine it happen 10-20 times per day...  Exp loss on death cant come back with current one shot system!, it would be disaster for game!! 
 

You have enough tools to  deal with griefer in game and seriously it happen only at one spot in game- sausan... Ppl should learn that for lvl 59-60 Sausan is not best silver per hour spot in game anymore!! If you are too retarded to leave sausan for new players and too lazy to check gahaz to discover how much better money wise and exp wise it is compared to sausan then its your own fault that some new players grief you... Learn to play first pls before crying on forum...And its not possible to grief at gahaz, cause there is simply too many mobs on one route and elites are not possible to kill by griefer...

Edited by Dorsai
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Posted

If you want to be a killer and take out unflagged players, this is described by the devs as an evil playstyle, which is why they have the karma system. 

They removed the penalties for dying in pvp because some people think it is fun to kill afk fishers and trainers. And because it makes no sense to punish the victims of assault.

Fact is, there are many reasons why the system is set up the way it is. I have yet to see anyone put forward a really good case to switch it back.

Lets also take into account that people who are in the 60s could easily be griefed with a system where people lose xp causing tears to not just be a convenience.

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Posted

It's like that to discourage pk'ing. DURRRR

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Posted

How? I wish that was the case, make traderuns much more profitable, make fishing in the open seas more profitable as well and let other players steal those goodies. There you'll get reward/punishment. There would be player made caravans with another player protecting those goods, reward both the trader and the bodyguards and do not give the thieves a full reward, just a % of the goods while the trader always keeps another % even if the goods are stolen so they are not discouraged by losing stuff.

Make profession levels matter by increasing profit or reducing costs (or both). Also make wagons stronger so they can be hard to destroy by other players and it takes effort and time to actually steal one. On top of that give the trader the possibility of repairing his wagon on the road and even rebuild it on the spot if it's destroyed so he can get his items back and same for the thief.

There are many more things that could be added on top of that this game has none of them just afk auto-route for money with low level alts with no risk and 0 fun. Same goes for fishing, time consuming, not very profitable and boring. I remember fishing/trading in Archeage or SRO, that shit was exciting. Entire guilds protecting their traders and groups of thieves scouting trade routes everywhere on the map.

Open world game with nothing to do on it, genious.

I would love that silkroad-style player trading/thieving.

I also keep hearing that we already have this in game, im just not sure if it really works the way it should. Stealing crates for example, i know you can lose crates when you get PKed but will the "thief" get anything or its just for griefing? There is smuggling which marks you for pvp when you trade special goods at night, but is it actually worth doing and can other people steal the goods?

In the Margoria announcement they mentioned "guild-versus-guild naval combat―the best way to establish dominance on the new trade routes". Im not that experienced with the whole Margoria additions yet, but are there really any reasons for guilds having a sea fight against each other? Personally I dont know why i should care about other people's trade routes XD.

Maybe im missing something but to me it seems like BDO has a lot of potential for such player driven content but doesnt give us any incentive to participate in it.

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