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Seriously though why is the reward vs punishment for PvP/PK so imbalanced?

254 posts in this topic

Posted

If you kill unflagged players,  you're responsible or your karma loss. If you get forceably killed unflagged,  how are you responsible? I think your logic is a bit skewed, mate...because your saying people should take responsibility for their actions in a thread that seems to be all about ditching responsibility. 

my point being, if you play a game with pvp involved. you have to expect to fight. So you need to be responsible for yourself in that you need to be ready to fight at anytime, an not demand the devs protect you.

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Posted

If they allowed anyone to kill anyone aNY time they wanted with no penalty this game would have died along time ago. a couple guilds with high gear scores and high levels could literally stop the other 95% of players from being able to progress 

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Posted

If they allowed anyone to kill anyone aNY time they wanted with no penalty this game would have died along time ago. a couple guilds with high gear scores and high levels could literally stop the other 95% of players from being able to progress 

And that is thx to removal of exp lost on death in PvP. No freedom in PvP, no reward and no risk = no policy and no real wars.

Old school games work so well because everything is balanced. Lvl means advantage, but also risk because death at high lvl is far more painful than on low lvl.

 

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Posted (edited)

If they allowed anyone to kill anyone aNY time they wanted with no penalty this game would have died along time ago. a couple guilds with high gear scores and high levels could literally stop the other 95% of players from being able to progress 

Nobody ever asked for that system so I don't know what the point of your comment is.  (I also don't see a guild taking the time just to gank people 24/7 to stop them from progressing.. that would get awfully boring real fast.)

Edited by Dreamagain

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Posted

my point being, if you play a game with pvp involved. you have to expect to fight. So you need to be responsible for yourself in that you need to be ready to fight at anytime, an not demand the devs protect you.

Then you should be okay with playing a game with a karma system and working within those mechanics,  taking responsibility for your lost karma in that you should be prepared to loose that karma and not demand the devs protect you from losing it. 

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Posted (edited)

 Our avatar is a representation of ourselves in the game: we are not separate from it.

People are not separate from their avatars.  As I pointed out above our avatars are our representation in the game.  We don't become machines the moment we log into the game and take control of our avatar.

Then you are just schizophrenic.

You can't tell the difference between fiction and reality.
And every comedian or role player who ever played a vilain character should be send to jail following this logic ...

Play less, take more time to see more real people. The ones that are not made of pixels in a screen.

Edited by Capitaine Courage
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Posted

there is nothing to fix as the system is how it was designed for this game.

If you want to play games with drops on players' death or a punishing death for the losing player in PvP there is a wide array to chose from, why then don't you go play those games instead of asking the devs to change their game? Says much about the logic you adopt. Besides BDO would lose a consistent slice of players out of a change like the one requested and gain nothing, since hardcore pvpers would not be attracted by such a change and will not play this game in any case, as evidenced from the fact that most PKer wannabes of this game are crying rivers from months now about supposed "karma bombers griefers". These players (that infest this thread too) are clueless to the point that they invented from the ground up a new term in an active form to describe the passive behaviour of any player that somehow gets in their way and is punished by swift death from a surprise attack, and then repeat this stupid mantra of karma bombing over and over like little children in the hopes that the devs pay attention to their whining.

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Posted

 

Then you are just schizophrenic.

You can't tell the difference between fiction and reality.
And every comedian or role player who ever played a vilain character should be send to jail following this logic ...

Play less, take more time to see more real people. The ones that are not made of pixels in a screen.

You think that you somehow become someone else the moment you sit down at the keyboard?  That you are no longer in control of your thoughts or actions.  And you want to call me schizophrenic.  Are you someone else when you type on forums as well.  Who are you right now and does the real you even know about these other you's?

So, let me get this straight.  When someone is being a jerk in a game it's not really them being a jerk because they have been taken over and aren't in control of their own actions or behavior anymore?  Does that about sum it up?

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Posted (edited)

And when are they going to fix it.

Probably never tbh. The game's been out well over 2 years at this point in Korea and they have barely touched it. They'll fix it when the game is already beyond the point of no return, if ever. They actually made it even less balanced back in the day. It used to be that when you killed someone, you lost your regulat 63k karma, but atleast the person who died lost 1% xp, but not they even removed that, because of all the carebears crying about it.

Edited by Wrath

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Posted

Karma bombing only exist in the minds of those making the claim.  It doesn't really exist at all.  What they are really talking about is the fact that in BDO if you murder another player you loose karma.  It enrages them if they keep loosing karma for murdering people over and over.  They just use the phrase Karma Bombing to play on peoples emotions because their argument can't stand on it's own merit. 

Anyone that looses karma for murdering another player did it to themselves.  Perhaps we should call it karmakaze because it is their own actions that result in a loss of karma. 

You have taken this topic to a whole new level.  Borderline scary.  Not only are you claiming something doesn't exist simply because you have never experienced it or even open to any idea that isn't your own, but now also can't make the distinction between reality and what are digital characters. Your characters are not you. You are not Doom Guy when you play Doom. You are not Mario when you play a Mario game. You are not actually the character you are playing. You are not bound by real life ethics and rules within games, just like the rules of physics from real life don't always apply within games.  Rules within games are set by developers and are not representative of real life. 

This became frightening or a trolling effort to try to make your own point the only valid one since you are not open to anything else.  I sincerely hope its the latter. 

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Posted

And that is thx to removal of exp lost on death in PvP. No freedom in PvP, no reward and no risk = no policy and no real wars.

Old school games work so well because everything is balanced. Lvl means advantage, but also risk because death at high lvl is far more painful than on low lvl.

 

old school games WORKED so well because they WERE played by old school players, which would never whine about "karma bombing" on a forum and actually consider the use of this term a laughable and ludicrous practice.

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Posted

You have taken this topic to a whole new level.  Borderline scary.  Not only are you claiming something doesn't exist simply because you have never experienced it or even open to any idea that isn't your own, but now also can't make the distinction between reality and what are digital characters. Your characters are not you. You are not Doom Guy when you play Doom. You are not Mario when you play a Mario game. You are not actually the character you are playing. You are not bound by real life ethics and rules within games, just like the rules of physics from real life don't always apply within games.  Rules within games are set by developers and are not representative of real life. 

This became frightening or a trolling effort to try to make your own point the only valid one since you are not open to anything else.  I sincerely hope its the latter. 

Well, actually I'm just speaking above your ability to comprehend what I'm saying.

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Posted (edited)

You think that you somehow become someone else the moment you sit down at the keyboard?  That you are no longer in control of your thoughts or actions.  And you want to call me schizophrenic.  Are you someone else when you type on forums as well.  Who are you right now and does the real you even know about these other you's?

So, let me get this straight.  When someone is being a jerk in a game it's not really them being a jerk because they have been taken over and aren't in control of their own actions or behavior anymore?  Does that about sum it up?

That's what the role in RPG is all about.

Playing a role, aka not you as a person. And if the role is a vilain one, they act accordingly in game. In fiction. You seem to have difficulties to grasp the notion.

When children play a "cops and robbers" tag game, should the ones who play the robbers be sent to youth detention centers ? Because you know, they embody bad characters for the time the game is being played.

Edited by Capitaine Courage
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Posted

old school games WORKED so well because they WERE played by old school players, which would never whine about "karma bombing" on a forum and actually consider the use of this term a laughable and ludicrous practice.

For example in Lineage 2 you could karma bombing someone, but you would lost 4% exp per death. Also everyone had 5 first PK free from drop items and after that make sin eater quest (L2 classic just spam scroll) to remove PK points and PK without risk. While you would lost 20% exp, included possibility of delevel without achieve nothing. And that is is about - common sense. In BDO any kind of common sense does not exist.

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Posted

That's what the role in RPG is all about.

Playing a role, aka not you as a person. And if the role is a vilain one, they act accordingly in game. In fiction. You seem to have difficulties to grasp the notion.

When children play "cops and robbers", should the ones who play the robbers be sent to youth detention centers ? Because you know, they embody bad characters for the time the game is being played.

Why wasting time by trying to lift the average conversation level heh?

Things won't change anytime soon.

There is already too many ppl throwing themselves into this game (yet you should see some of the LoL players.... my my my...) till they burnout. (no reason to do so but their own "personal" grudge against whatever the fk you wan't. May it be RNG/PvP/Epeen/Rage etc etc..)

Nowadays kids are not better at changing this. (And guess what? The best part is when you see 30ish + ppl acting like that)

Honestly MMO's players changed too much in the last 10 years, respect/fair play/dedication are missing now.

Now we got Epeen/Cash shop/Trashtalkers, say hi to our new de-generated generation.

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Posted

That's what the role in RPG is all about.

Playing a role, aka not you as a person. And if the role is a vilain one, they act accordingly in game. In fiction. You seem to have difficulties to grasp the notion.

When children play a "cops and robbers" tag game, should the ones who play the robbers be sent to youth detention centers ? Because you know, they embody bad characters for the time the game is being played.

If those kids are playing Cops and Robbers Online, and they want to get into it in a thorough and immersive way, then hell yeah. Put the little bastards in a cell, call a lawyer, and give em a hearing. If they're down with RNGebus and haven't done too much damage to their karma they'll make bail. 

 

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Posted (edited)

The level of retardism some ppl in this thread must have to consider killing in a game the same with killing in reality.

"You mofo pricks, u dare kill another fox in bdo and i'll call -----ing peta on you."  is basically what your saying, when you say that pk-ers should suffer penalties that are "immersive" and look-alike to reality. 

What kind of a sad person do you have to be to cry about being killed in a game, where you lose nothing? 

 

And the karma bomobers probably have mental issues. Why am i saying this? Because they cry that pk-ing is an act of evil done against innocent players like them, yet they go and get killed all--over again... the definition of insanity. Masochists, love to suffer i suppose...

Talking about immersion... stay -----ing dead, if u want me to suffer penalties like in reality in a game! See, it works both ways!?

----------------------------

There are many solutions for fixing open world pvp in bdo, but none will happen because players described by what i wrote above exists, and kakao doesn't want to let go of them.

 

Edited by Chun-Chun
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Posted

There are many solutions for fixing open world pvp in bdo, but none will happen because players described by what i wrote above exists, and kakao doesn't want to let go of them.

Addicted dumb fk Customer = Good Money.

- Beginner trading Lvl 1 -

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Posted

For example in Lineage 2 you could karma bombing someone, but you would lost 4% exp per death. Also everyone had 5 first PK free from drop items and after that make sin eater quest (L2 classic just spam scroll) to remove PK points and PK without risk. While you would lost 20% exp, included possibility of delevel without achieve nothing. And that is is about - common sense. In BDO any kind of common sense does not exist.

Maybe thats why noone wanted to play L2 outside of Korea.

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Posted

Then you should be okay with playing a game with a karma system and working within those mechanics,  taking responsibility for your lost karma in that you should be prepared to loose that karma and not demand the devs protect you from losing it. 

LOL I play EVE Online for 90 years now, Ic an assure you loss is irrelevant to me

old school games WORKED so well because they WERE played by old school players, which would never whine about "karma bombing" on a forum and actually consider the use of this term a laughable and ludicrous practice.

Could not agree more, I played UO as a PK,a n the PK v Anti wars kept me amused for a long time.

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Posted

That's what the role in RPG is all about.

Playing a role, aka not you as a person. And if the role is a vilain one, they act accordingly in game. In fiction. You seem to have difficulties to grasp the notion.

When children play a "cops and robbers" tag game, should the ones who play the robbers be sent to youth detention centers ? Because you know, they embody bad characters for the time the game is being played.

And you don't seem to grasp the notion that you are still you when you play a game.  You don't suddenly loose your personality, your morality, ethics, etc.  It might be a game but it's played by real people not machines as you seem to  believe.

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Posted (edited)

And you don't seem to grasp the notion that you are still you when you play a game.  You don't suddenly loose your personality, your morality, ethics, etc.  It might be a game but it's played by real people not machines as you seem to  believe.

Playing a role is not being a machine.

Comedians are not machines.

Players who embody bad characters in RPG (MMO, LARPG, Tabletop) are not machines.

But if people really can't bear the fact that their pixel character has been defeated for whatever reason in a fictional diegetic universe and directly compare it to what occurs real life, with real persons, where real people can be really harmed (and there, it's not fiction), then they are emotionally unstable and show signs of losing tracks with reality, hence exhibiting schizophrenic behaviour. Sane people can tell the difference.

Edited by Capitaine Courage
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Posted

Maybe thats why noone wanted to play L2 outside of Korea.

L2 is one of the most successful MMO ever. Only few survived as long as L2. And could survived long more if no casualisation post Interlude,.

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Posted

LOL I play EVE Online for 90 years now, Ic an assure you loss is irrelevant to me

Yeah i remember how you used to wait for the tape to turn 1000 times and load a new sector of...WAIT A SECOND. Something is fishy with this sentence :P . I think you exaggarated a bit.

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Posted

Playing a role is not being a machine.

Comedians are not machines.

Players who embody bad characters in RPG (MMO, LARPG, Tabletop) are not machines.

But if people really can't bear the fact that their pixel character has been defeated for whatever reason in a fictional diegetic universe and compare it to real life, then they are emotionally unstable and show signs of losing tracks with reality.

But, here is the problem, you are saying that the game isn't real life as if the people playing the game aren't real people.  It doesn't matter if you are role playing or not  every avatar in the game is a representation of a real person with real emotions, ethics, morality etc.  None of that goes away just  because you are role playing in the game.  Real life cannot be separated from the person just because they are playing a game.  We are not machines.  We are the puppet masters controlling our avatars. What we do in the game has real life consequences for real life people.

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