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Valkyrie propaganda debunked.


244 posts in this topic

Posted

Disclaimer: I am aware of the block situation, however that has not been confirmed to be a bug or a ninja nerf at this moment in time, and does not discredit the information provided below.

This post has no connection to the Block issue, and is a general response to the valkyrie player base for its relentless attempts at getting the class unwarranted buffs.

 

Since the release of valkyrie's awakening in November 2016, the class has been subject to a lot of harsh remarks from it's mostly casual player base, donning nicknames such as "Lifeskill class" or "Sheep gathering class"

The class requires high APM and good mechanical skill to be properly executed, but instead of playing the class as it was designed, the playerbase has been kicking up a storm to have their life made easier for them, when in fact they have already had it way easier than the majority of the classes in Black Desert, aside from a few obvious exceptions which still need tweaking.

Before we get to damage, which I will be talking about later (way too much) let's talk about utility.

Valkyrie's intended role in BDO was as a tanky support/utility role. Which was unique and made the class stand out from the crowd.
With abilities like Breath of Ellion allowing you to heal friends, Ellions blessing allowing you to give party mates 100% resistance from all crowd control for 6 seconds and last but not least, heaven's echo giving a party-wide accuracy buff of a staggering 12% for a whopping 60 seconds.

However, over time, valkyrie slowly became a beast in itself, becoming known to the playerbase as one of, if not the best 1v1 class in the game pre-awakening.

With awakening however, people who were used to this lifestyle expected the same thing, tankiness, utility, mobility and damage
And that is exactly what they got, however many of them are too lazy to achieve the levels required that give the class all of the above and want it handed to them on a platter instead.

Utility
Utility was provided by Wave of Light, a unique skill which pulls players and monsters together, allowing for well coordinated setups to be executed with other classes such as the sorceresses black hole ability.

Purificatione also has hidden utility, hidden behind the veil of terrible google translated skill descriptions, when an enemy is hit by the spell, allies around you will be healed.

footage: https://my.mixtape.moe/akphid.webm

Tankiness
This came with the upgraded block, blocking about 75% more damage than shield and sword, lance and shield is an intimidating force to be reckoned with on the battlefield, which is amplified by lingering super armour, which valkyries and warriors get after using their block ability, this means that if a valkyrie blocks, then stops blocking they are IMMUNE to crowd control, this means that the valkyrie is completely safe to cast any skill it wants, many valks on the forum will pretend that this is a trait exclusive to warrior, but here is footage to debunk that.
https://my.mixtape.moe/unvkic.webm
https://my.mixtape.moe/ivzrnu.webm
https://my.mixtape.moe/gidngw.webm

As you can see in the links above, the valkyrie is not bound, however in the clip below, she gets bound.
https://my.mixtape.moe/osdavx.webm

Valkyrie's Super armour block is also 360 degrees, meaning that while a valkyrie is blocking you can go behind them and attack them as much as you want, but you cannot CC them, making them incredibly overpowered when fighting against a class without a grab, proof of this can be found here: https://my.mixtape.moe/rrkbkf.webm

Mobility

Another one of valkyries (many)  strong points, is that in the hands of a capable user, valkyrie can be as fast as the more nimble "assassin" type classes in black desert, which in reality is pretty ridiculous as mobility and damage is the selling points of these classes,why would anyone play these when valkyrie provides that with extra tankiness and utility? Proof here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoHWIjyRTp4

Damage


This is what seemed to be most underwhelming for the casual player base, their damage.  when people play an awakened class they expect something like wizard, a class where they can press 1,2,3 and see flashy effects and BIG DAMAGE with little effort or execution required.

With abilities like Sanctitas de Enslar amplifying your own damage while Purificatione decreases your opponent's defensive capabilities, a valkyrie with good mechanical skill can exploit her kit beyond most players expectations, allowing for incredible burst potential, more than most "DPS" classes in Black Desert's roster, as you can see in the following clips, a valkyrie with very average gear (181/183) is destroying a warrior, a class that is innately tanky and takes less damage than every other class

https://my.mixtape.moe/pavles.webm
https://my.mixtape.moe/qjkcpt.webm
https://my.mixtape.moe/xduavk.webm

Valkyrie's gear:  http://i.imgur.com/U3Dd9iS.jpg

It's not merely coincidence that 2 of the highest leveled characters on both EU and NA are valkyries, the class is a beast at not only PVP, but PVE too, with it's excellent mobility and self buffs/utility, combined with its amazing damage the class is regarded as one of the best in high end PVE spots, her only drawback being lack of 360 aoe, meaning some mobs may get behind you and you will either have to waste time killing stragglers or move to the next pack.

Footage of high level valkyrie PVE: https://clips.twitch.tv/CovertMushyOwlNotATK

the only drawback is, that valkyrie shines when she hits level 60, which the majority of the playerbase has yet to reach, and may make users feel like the class is lacking in departments where she is more than adequately equipped, the Valkyrie has become a frankenstein, a jack of all trades that is not just good at everything, but excellent, with the buffs EU/Na has still not recieved from korea coming soon, the class is going to become an unstoppable juggernaut, pushing out classes who were only designed to do damage out of the picture.

 

TLDR:Valkyrie is borderline OP currently and with buffs just around the corner, she may very well become OP.

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Posted

finally all the valkyre peasants spamming propaganda and bs on the forum can see for themselves how broken this class is with the videos provided there

 

also all the valks that were flaming me when i said your class has lingering SA - here's your proof 

 

sovereign leader renown valkyre saying his class doesn't have lingering sa

 

http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/137935-valks-degraded-to-life-skill-class-for-real-this-time/&do=findComment&comment=1910989 

 

random valkyre typing in super confident manner saying he has no lingering sa when it literally takes 1 minute to prove it in game 

@nyn idc @Luminosity

 

so lets get this straight

 

valkyre is one of the fastest classes in bdo - it's definitely faster than my tamer and i can't catch valkyres when im 5 speed tamer

valkyre does 2 times more damage than tamer - proven on the video and it also has much faster attack animations than tamer does

valkyre is 3 times tankier than tamer - common sense

valkyre has unique mechanics that defy the physics of the game (the pull works even against superarmor and it kds people that are blocking as it hits them in back, lol) 

valkyre has lingering SA which means it can protect ANY of its skills on demand and that it's also barely affected by desync unlike other classes (if you think desync is bad and you're a valk /warrior with lingering sa then imagine how incredibly horrible it is for other classes in bdo)

valkyre's ultimate does 3 times more damage than warrior one and is probably the highest damage ult in the entire game (even higher than wizard) 

 

so let me get this straight, a class that does more damage than me while being tankier and moving faster and having better unique mechanics and being desync proof is nonstop crying on the forum that their class is weak and a life-skiller class and at the same time saying that tamer is op - haha - hahah next level insane hypocrisy all debunked right here in this thread, so much for your propaganda

 

what a sad game we live in, a game in which a tank class does more/faster damage than an assassin class and then has the audacity to go on the forum and say they're weak and demand buffs while some other poor classes are being neglected and ignored for months since the game was released and are forced to endure never ending pain in game and then when you go on the forum instead of finding hope that people are crusading against this injustice and trying to wake up the community - you end up finding that people say your class is op and the actually op classes are weak and they want even more power to them instead of learning how to play

 

oh and before any valkyre wants to argue with me, first get 20k rbf score to prove your experience in the pvp scene of the game and to show 

if your rbf score is below 20k then the chances are that you havent even remotely come close to mastering your class and that means you're not qualified to talk about balance and if your class needs buffs or not

(it actually needs nerfs) 

 

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Posted

prob worse than warrior 5s SA on block

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Posted

finally someone says the truth, not like all those valkyries trying to excuse themselves about being bad...

 

 

btw hi lemon 

megu (2) - copia.png

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Posted

VALKYRIE LEGIT AF YA'LL SALTY WE BETTA

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Posted

Valk is the greatest kept secret in the game 

 

however, it does require some amount of skill to do then things unlike the warrior and wiz where you just mash hot bar keys until you win

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Posted

finally all the valkyre peasants spamming propaganda and bs on the forum can see for themselves how broken this class is with the videos provided there

 

also all the valks that were flaming me when i said your class has lingering SA - here's your proof 

 

sovereign leader renown valkyre saying his class doesn't have lingering sa

 

http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/137935-valks-degraded-to-life-skill-class-for-real-this-time/&do=findComment&comment=1910989 

 

random valkyre typing in super confident manner saying he has no lingering sa when it literally takes 1 minute to prove it in game 

@nyn idc @Luminosity

 

so lets get this straight

 

valkyre is one of the fastest classes in bdo - it's definitely faster than my tamer and i can't catch valkyres when im 5 speed tamer

valkyre does 2 times more damage than tamer - proven on the video and it also has much faster attack animations than tamer does

valkyre is 3 times tankier than tamer - common sense

valkyre has unique mechanics that defy the physics of the game (the pull works even against superarmor and it kds people that are blocking as it hits them in back, lol) 

valkyre has lingering SA which means it can protect ANY of its skills on demand and that it's also barely affected by desync unlike other classes (if you think desync is bad and you're a valk /warrior with lingering sa then imagine how incredibly horrible it is for other classes in bdo)

valkyre's ultimate does 3 times more damage than warrior one and is probably the highest damage ult in the entire game (even higher than wizard) 

 

so let me get this straight, a class that does more damage than me while being tankier and moving faster and having better unique mechanics and being desync proof is nonstop crying on the forum that their class is weak and a life-skiller class and at the same time saying that tamer is op - haha - hahah next level insane hypocrisy all debunked right here in this thread, so much for your propaganda

 

(it actually needs nerf-

 

Ah shush . You think everyone but tamer is OP.

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Posted

Returning player ever since before Valencia; would be interested if could take some "lessons" on using the ultimate ect. Thanks for the info btw, I was debating to change class or yeah...

In-game character name: Pandora_Finder

 

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Posted

Having been full TET boss gear for a while now I've run into players of all classes that hurt like hell... From what I can see they can perma block almost as well as a warrior and that pulling ult annoys the piss out of me. 

 

Im sure they do have a higher gear and skill requirement for them to be feasible as compared to say a Wizard. 

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Posted

Returning player ever since before Valencia; would be interested if could take some "lessons" on using the ultimate ect. Thanks for the info btw, I was debating to change class or yeah...

In-game character name: Pandora_Finder

 

You need to be 60 (or higher) for anything remotely viable valk play, and even then the spells are still too slow to do much on an actual moving target.

It's nowhere near as rosy as this post is trying to paint.

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Posted

Looks like Lemon got triggered by a valk in rbf again today. The fact that he thinks that your rbf score means anything regarding pvp experience in the game is just ridiculous.

Our lingering superarmor (which btw has basically 0 damage reduction, it's cc immunity) gets cancelled as soon as you use a skill, which renders it borderline useless. Add our long, clunky attacks to that mix and it's really not a factor.

The ulti does deal decent damage, but ask any somewhat decent valk out there and they will tell you that it gets you killed more often than not (with 8 out of 13 classes having a grab) and that they'd rather lock it. It's still one of the better ultimates out there but calling it OP when there's things like wizard ultis is just wrong.

I'm not gonna say that valk is in a bad place though, there's a thing or two that could get fixed to make things better, but we're actually doing alright in the end game - a big part of which is thanks to vangertz and the evasion meta.

And until you reach that end game sorta area, Valk will always feel like you need to put in more effort and have more gear than most other classes out there to be competitive.

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Posted (edited)

Someone actually taking the time to analyse a Valkyrie and its not about lifeskilling? Now this deserves some praise.

Let's leave the shield-bug aside for now and discuss the statements you gave. 

 

As a valk main, I have to agree with many points you give, I think she could use a few adjustments, though. (Many classes need this, yes.)

I never thought Valk was a weak class, just that people weren't using it to its full potential because it takes too long to reach there.
There are a few things I have to point out though.

Cooldowns is one thing. 

Wave of light - 25 seconds cooldown. 
PvP wise - This isn't a very easy ability to use skillfully, if used correctly you can spin the target 10m in front of you, but this is pretty hard to pull (heh) off. 
PvE wise I doubt anyone would complain about this ability, 

So why would you use this ability in the first place? 

Warriors.
Usually warriors don't sit in non-block mode, spinning them & going for dmg is one thing, or forcing them (the pull can't be blocked) in your area to grab them is one viable way of kicking them out of SA. (I'll adress the worst grapple eu later.) 

Solution: Reducing the CD on wave of light to 15 seconds.


Damage. 
Demonstrating video's to further improve your argument is an excellent way to show the people how it really is. 
That is, if the enemy stands still and takes your full combo. 

Thus this leaves the debate to skill, Purification is easy to hit but Sanctitas De Enslar is harder to pull off.

Accuraccy.
Valks need accuraccy really -----ing bad they decided it was a good time to let them enjoy their 12% accu buff for themselves. 
While your AP may be low, a TET vangertz & tri RcE are a huge amount of Accu and certainly compensates for 20AP. 

 

Grapple.
Yes, we do need it, and it's bad, it's the worst grab (Warrior & Wizard have more range)

Solution: Increase the range of grapple.
 

 

So what's my point? [TL;DR]

While Valkyrie isn't underpowered, it's a fact that other classes have an easier learning curve to use succesfully. 
And if we may believe in your words, we have to endure this untill level 60 for it to be more rewarding. 
Is that really how it should be? 


Don't forget that the elite players are not the whole playerbase of this game, for the casual player a Valkyrie is underwhelming, and that must change. 




 

Edited by Spherii
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Posted

Our lingering superarmor (which btw has basically 0 damage reduction, it's cc immunity) gets cancelled as soon as you use a skill, which renders it borderline useless. Add our long, clunky attacks to that mix and it's really not a factor.

This isnt even true lmao. It doesn't stop after you cast a skill, it stops after a fixed amount of time, no matter what do you.

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Posted

This isnt even true lmao. It doesn't stop after you cast a skill, it stops after a fixed amount of time, no matter what do you.

valkyre not knowing their class ? nothing new 

it's all over the forum 

 

that's why i said get 20k rbf score then talk 

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Posted

that's why i said get 20k rbf score then talk 

9_9

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Posted

*popcorn*

This 'gon be gud!

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Posted

I main valk and the 2 primary complains I have are only the grabs and how long it bloody takes to cast the 100%. There are some other small minor things I would like to see changed by these 2 are my main concerns.

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Posted

I main valk and the 2 primary complains I have are only the grabs and how long it bloody takes to cast the 100%. There are some other small minor things I would like to see changed by these 2 are my main concerns.

The latter is being changed (cast speed buff in Korea that we're yet to see), first one, probably never going to happen sadly.

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Posted

i like this

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Posted

Valk mobility gives me bad tera flashbacks.

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Posted

Valk main counter arguments:

1. Wave of light:
No argument with this, Wave of light is the single thing that sets valk apart and makes them wanted. Wave of Light is the whole purpose of valk in large scale pretty much.

2.Purificatione 
This is a nice, but small, heal. When you can manage to get it off that is. The range is very short, and it goes in 1 line in front of the valk. i would say it misses friendly  target 75% of the time when accounting for fighting, movement, and iframes.

3. Lingering super armor
this only lasts for 1 second after dropping block if you don't use any skills. The moment you press a skill the SA is gone. No one just drops block to move around for a second. For all intents and purposes this is a useless feature and isn't as good as warrior's lingering SA because it doesn't last through skills like warriors.

4. 360* CC immunity in block
True, if you don't move. If you're moving while blocking, you can be CC'd.  I don't know if this is intentional or a bug, but valks block isn't true CC immunity. Most valks don't just stand still in block while you pound on them.

5. Mobility
For a short burst, valk can move a rather large distance very quickly, but it leaves you with 0 stamina and low mana. Valk base movement is one of the slowest in the game. 
Valk is overall not very mobile because the short burst of speed leaves you very vulnerable. In an arena setting valk mobility is perfect. in OW it's extremely lacking. 

6. Damage
Your videos are an evasion warrior getting 1 combo'd by a full ACC build valk. They cancel each other out. Of course the warrior got 1 combo'd. Any class with the same build would 1 combo that warrior. Your examples are bad. 
With that said, single target valk damage isn't bad once you hit level 60 and are around 210+ap.
All other awaken classes do the same or better damage. 

7. PVE
Calling valk a beast in pve is just plainly a lie. It is one of the slowest pve classes. I've leveled every class to 56 at least, most above that though (i like alts, sue me) and valk is the slowest grinding class out of all of them. This is a big problem seeing how valk needs to be level 60 to be effectively used. The video you shown of valk "high end pve" is also a bad example give without any comparison. Valk's only pve saving grace is wave of light, but on a 25 second cooldown it ends up with you clearing a decent amount of mobs once every 25 seconds, then the rest of the time being in pve hell. 

8. "Valk is Boarderline OP"
Valk is overall balanced, surrounded by classes that are not balanced. Valk isn't OP. They have a reasonable amount of tools for most situations, rather than only have the BEST OP tools for 1 situation. The only thing valk has that another class doesn't is Wave of Light. Everything else that a valk does, another class can do better. 


Thanks for reading.

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Posted

Remember the Kill/Death Ratio chart from the event? Valks were 3rd or 4th from the bottom.

Tamers were 5th from the top. Nerf Tamers

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Posted

Its gonna get even better when the animation speedup buffs for our v + RMB and shift + RMB get added to the game but the huge nerf to our block is retarded when wizards/witches and rangers were able to take em down with no problem before

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Posted

Valk main counter arguments:

1. Wave of light:
No argument with this, Wave of light is the single thing that sets valk apart and makes them wanted. Wave of Light is the whole purpose of valk in large scale pretty much.

so its op

 

2.Purificatione 
This is a nice, but small, heal. When you can manage to get it off that is. The range is very short, and it goes in 1 line in front of the valk. i would say it misses friendly  target 75% of the time when accounting for fighting, movement, and iframes.

the heal is just a bonus function of a normal/good skill and in mass pvp you'll definitely land it on allies

3. Lingering super armor
this only lasts for 1 second after dropping block if you don't use any skills. The moment you press a skill the SA is gone. No one just drops block to move around for a second. For all intents and purposes this is a useless feature and isn't as good as warrior's lingering SA because it doesn't last through skills like warriors.

false

you can make non-protected skills be protected with your lingering SA, such as celestial spear and SoJ even pre-awaken era which i noticed myself more than 8 months ago before awakening weapon was even released

4. 360* CC immunity in block
True, if you don't move. If you're moving while blocking, you can be CC'd.  I don't know if this is intentional or a bug, but valks block isn't true CC immunity. Most valks don't just stand still in block while you pound on them.

you have SA when you block

5. Mobility
For a short burst, valk can move a rather large distance very quickly, but it leaves you with 0 stamina and low mana. Valk base movement is one of the slowest in the game. 
Valk is overall not very mobile because the short burst of speed leaves you very vulnerable. In an arena setting valk mobility is perfect. in OW it's extremely lacking. 

valk can outrun half of the classes in the game

in "arena setting"? rbf is arena and the way node war/siege pvp is structured the current battlefield is even smaller than rbf, walls being your zerg/teammates to which you can always get 

6. Damage
Your videos are an evasion warrior getting 1 combo'd by a full ACC build valk. They cancel each other out. Of course the warrior got 1 combo'd. Any class with the same build would 1 combo that warrior. Your examples are bad. 
With that said, single target valk damage isn't bad once you hit level 60 and are around 210+ap.
All other awaken classes do the same or better damage. 

they don't cancel each other out that's first

second, vangertz gives more DR than say nouver would so you can still argue that the warrior is defensive cause most warrs just go full glass canno

3rd, tamer with the same gear as valkyre literally does two times less damage and is also slower. A tamer with tri gear won't 1combo the warrior without grab (cause the valk didn't use grab which is literally extending ur combo so basically tri valk kills with HALF A COMBO. LMAO.) Tri geared tamer wont 1combo warrior unless he does super extended stun combo which is possible but it's literally 10 sec long if you go that route and the standard combo wont be enough to kill without grab

pre-grab = 50% combo

post grab = 100% combo

so valk kills with 50% combo while most classes (ninja,tamer,etc actual assassins) need to grab with the same gear and the only way they kill without grab is when they're buff stacked with tet or more gear 

 

7. PVE
Calling valk a beast in pve is just plainly a lie. It is one of the slowest pve classes. 

yes we saw the video how slow valk is

only he 2shots pila ku mobs like it's nothing, lol

8. "Valk is Boarderline OP"
Valk is overall balanced, surrounded by classes that are not balanced. Valk isn't OP. They have a reasonable amount of tools for most situations, rather than only have the BEST OP tools for 1 situation. The only thing valk has that another class doesn't is Wave of Light. Everything else that a valk does, another class can do better. 

it's better than more than half of the classes in the game 

 

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