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*Updated* Musa accuracy bugged

278 posts in this topic

Posted

The further I play this class the less il buying into the accuracy thing , sometimes I just wanna go full ap and play around that maybe 4 out of 10 hits land and just obliterate people . No matter how much acc you specc you won't be able to fully counter your opponents evasion... Alright then you went full full accuracy I'm talking ring of seeds tier and such what in the aftuak ----- are you going to do to the high dp players? How i see it the most optimal way or the only way of hearing a musa consists of having 2 sets . One full ap and one heavily accuracy stacked we just don't have the luxury of one build to rule them all. And I see some musas already giving up on the damaging role and going for the dp/ evasion build sicils and centaurs 

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The further I play this class the less il buying into the accuracy thing , sometimes I just wanna go full ap and play around that maybe 4 out of 10 hits land and just obliterate people . No matter how much acc you specc you won't be able to fully counter your opponents evasion... Alright then you went full full accuracy I'm talking ring of seeds tier and such what in the aftuak ----- are you going to do to the high dp players? How i see it the most optimal way or the only way of hearing a musa consists of having 2 sets . One full ap and one heavily accuracy stacked we just don't have the luxury of one build to rule them all. And I see some musas already giving up on the damaging role and going for the dp/ evasion build sicils and centaurs 

Sometimes I meet other musas from high lvl guilds while running my evasion build and they kill me in one combo and I'm like.. what the ----- just happened? Last night I was running 291 DP with evasion and 190 AP was doing more than fine in a friendly GvG vs RainingHostias and suddenly Oldskool shows up with 20 people one of them a Musa that came first, I thought he was weaker so I attempted to trade dmg with him and got one shot xD I seriously don't have a clue how he's got so much damage.. I don't know if he had awakened buff, khalk/perfume or something but for an evasion build I got melted by my own class. 

Same thing happened to me 2-3 weeks ago against another musa from another guild, also wearing evasion offhand. Yet I clearly see how ninjas/sorceress/kunos/ranger miss their oneshot combo 2/3 times.. one of those was incredibly ridiculous, like standing CCed for 5 seconds with 30% hp and he missed every skill in that rotation. So how can I even think of going full AP when I see this? Maybe those musas I faced are just very high geared with more TETs and top tier accesories.

So what's the -----ing trick? Thing that bothers me most is Musa discord is not entirely reliable because NA community differs from EU and many maehwas comment there as well, so where to ask? I don't have a clue.. 

I also wanna try the AP build sometimes but getting x4 earrings is a pain in the ass since you spend double amount of money just to have "2 builds that are okay" with either duo tungrades or TRI witches that's already 800M - 1B plus at least 400 M to try out TET AP offhand or 500 for Nouver.. It's a lot of investment when my goal could simply be "go from tri MoS to try Crescents or go TET armor".. instead I have to play around billions of gear investment just to have "3 okay builds".

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Posted (edited)

Sometimes I meet other musas from high lvl guilds while running my evasion build and they kill me in one combo and I'm like.. what the ----- just happened? Last night I was running 291 DP with evasion and 190 AP was doing more than fine in a friendly GvG vs RainingHostias and suddenly Oldskool shows up with 20 people one of them a Musa that came first, I thought he was weaker so I attempted to trade dmg with him and got one shot xD I seriously don't have a clue how he's got so much damage.. I don't know if he had awakened buff, khalk/perfume or something but for an evasion build I got melted by my own class. 

Same thing happened to me 2-3 weeks ago against another musa from another guild, also wearing evasion offhand. Yet I clearly see how ninjas/sorceress/kunos/ranger miss their oneshot combo 2/3 times.. one of those was incredibly ridiculous, like standing CCed for 5 seconds with 30% hp and he missed every skill in that rotation. So how can I even think of going full AP when I see this? Maybe those musas I faced are just very high geared with more TETs and top tier accesories.

So what's the -----ing trick? Thing that bothers me most is Musa discord is not entirely reliable because NA community differs from EU and many maehwas comment there as well, so where to ask? I don't have a clue.. 

I also wanna try the AP build sometimes but getting x4 earrings is a pain in the ass since you spend double amount of money just to have "2 builds that are okay" with either duo tungrades or TRI witches that's already 800M - 1B plus at least 400 M to try out TET AP offhand or 500 for Nouver.. It's a lot of investment when my goal could simply be "go from tri MoS to try Crescents or go TET armor".. instead I have to play around billions of gear investment just to have "3 okay builds".

Our evasion is thrash, i can't one combo with brad and butter a 59 tamer, guildie, that has i think 294 dp, not eva offhand, kutum and a few DP accesories, tri boss gear. BUT i could one combo Phaxe, a 300 (tet boss+tet kutum) dp musa with bread and butter, so yeah. i think musa's evasion is also thrash, hence why he could oneshot you.

Edited by SinisterSaints

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Posted (edited)

the funny thing about that is that we get melee evasion passive and tamers don't

evasion musa is actually  the first build that i tried, and its pretty bad..

i have tried evasion, ap with pri ogre ring around (210 ap) and accuracy with stuffs like necklace of good deeds and tree spirit belt

and so far i think the accuracy build is superior

to the point where i think wearing 3x taritas + bheg will gives us the most dps increase..but i don't want to drop my boss gears

Edited by lavexis

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Posted

lol im always using evasion offhand, be that playing warrior, ninja or musa. simply because i don't wanna get one shot by some gear/class carried guy's ultimate skill.

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Posted

TL:DR? Seems a bit odd, that Black Horn doesn't outshine Kutum, i deifnetly tried kutum and black horn vs lv61 eva witch (305 dp) ande black horn dmg was WAY higher. I can understand Nouver being similar sometimes, cause if it doesn't miss the high ap will shred. Hard to understand what the numbers on the offhand table means.

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Posted

I guess BHB will start outperforming everything when you throw a Sicil or Centaur in the mix

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Posted

Real combat is RNG, it's what I wanted to see

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Posted

I guess BHB will start outperforming everything when you throw a Sicil or Centaur in the mix

She was just tet gear + offhand, so no centaur or sicil

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Posted (edited)

I don't think there is any hit rate to speak of in that situation, probably drops to neglectable levels considering Exe's tests. I will sum up my post in here: If things are the way they seem even FULL accuracy( Gems + Roaring + 2x Deeds ring + 2x RCE + Three belt +  Neck of Good deeds + Alch Stone + buff + addon) is not able to get you back to a decent hit rate in the situation OP is presenting. Musa is most likely a unfinished project.

I made some observation while looking into this,however my position was a bit different :my TRI Liverto being unable to land hits against TRI Grunil, no accuracy on my end or evasion on my target. Most people I asked for advice told me that Bhegs gloves will solve most accuracy issues I am facing in BDO. So I started gathering as much information I could on evasion/accuracy and attempted to obtain my hitrate by getting the Bheg's accuracy trough the accesories. Now, long story short, I realized I was -----ed while still doing the research. 

So in order to counter the default evasion of a person with full TRI boss gear one needs to counter the 121 evasion with 90.75 accuracy if the 0.75 to 1 ratio is indeed true. However once I started my quest for accuracy I faceplanted into the fact I simply cannot stack enough. So obviously I tried manually adding in Bheg's level of accuracy,I believed to be around 15, added the it with the help of accesories and I still noticed missing consistently. I tried to find out how much accuracy to stack on top of Bhegs & I found out the answer is: none or anywhere from 26-30.Now this might be exaggerating but... this thread shows you are left butt naked with no way to counter a evasion build.It almost feels as if we require a partial Acc build to counter the default evasion from other classes, hence no room left to stack more acc for a actual evasion build. That means that the starting point for Musa hit rate is somewhere from 40-50% hitrate, along with some bad implementation of the skill kit.

The main observations linked were:

Musa has very high skill dmg (% multilier & nr of hits)

Base accuracy is insufficient to keep up with default evasion

The overall feel I've been getting while playing Musa is a Counter based CQC fighter, but having no counter mechanics implemented & handicapped skills.

Now I won't even touch on the fact that in the current state of the game part of the kit is not usable in most PVP conditions, and yet again some of us are still enjoying the class even as it is. Most people however, do not like losing, especially not because of a invisible handicap.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Woofgang

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Posted (edited)

@DaiCazzo

funny how everyone made fun of you at first, but now they listened and everyone starting to use that black horn bow 

this goes to show that even high level players have no idea what they doing and had to listen to middle score gs player for advice lol

i am not gonna lie though, it is pretty screwd for everyone to dismiss the idea before testing, good thing Zubi understand this and test the idea.

sometimes it really just take simple  rock paper scissor common sense

 

@Woofgang

pretty straight forward really

bheg is a must have to counter their muskan

you need x2 rce or 3x taritas to counter the 2 evasion gem they use on their helm

black horn bow to counter their evasion off hand

tree spirit to counteract the sicil

Edited by lavexis

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Posted

@DaiCazzo

funny how everyone made fun of you at first, but now they listened and everyone starting to use that black horn bow 

this goes to show that even high level players have no idea what they doing and had to listen to middle score gs player for advice lol

i am not gonna lie though, it is pretty screwd for everyone to dismiss the idea before testing, good thing Zubi understand this and test the idea.

sometimes it really just take simple  rock paper scissor common sense

 

@Woofgang

pretty straight forward really

bheg is a must have to counter their muskan

you need x2 rce or 3x taritas to counter the 2 evasion gem they use on their helm

black horn bow to counter their evasion off hand

tree spirit to counteract the sicil

seems like you didnt read out posts, our beef wasnt with using an acc offhand, but with HAVING to use an acc offhand, show 1 other class which does to even hit players not stacking high evasion.

hes using 2x tri rce duo tree, acc offhand tet zarka tri bhegs, but the sorc is only using tet boss pieces 2 agility gems and an eva offhand, and it seems like a 50% hit rate, so what are you gonna do with someone who uses tri sicil and tri centaur?

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Posted (edited)

i understand what you saying, but this is assuming that other classes can hit other evasion stackers

i know that the fact that we have to wear black horn bow ( an item that gives the lowest gs ) to do damage kinda sucs, however you have to look at other classes as well

some classes that i can think of that can hit eva stackers and still doesn't need accuracy off hand would be

warrior = they have dp debuff which reduces evasion

tamer = pet has 100% accuracy

witch/wizard = apparently magic attack has higher accuracy than melee attack ( hence there are melee ap and magic ap gem )

berserker = grabs does not get affected by accuracy.

 

the reason why musa need accuracy the most is because we do not have any of those options above, but we make up for it with having high damage if we hit our attacks.

 

but again you are assuming that other evasion stackers can hit other evasion stackers without accuracy offhand.. i am 100% sure that without accuracy those eva stackers can't hit other eva stackers.

 

and back to the video..

only way i can think of for the musa to hit her is to wear necklace of good deeds and ring of good deeds

now i know its totally unfair for the musa, but does it matter though ?

if he does able to hit her and kill her even with 20 - 30 lower gs then that should good enough..

someone should probably test 3x taritas + bheg to see if they do more damage compared to 4x boss gears

Edited by lavexis

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Posted

someone should probably test 3x taritas + bheg to see if they do more damage compared to 4x boss gears

Of course they will do more damage. None of the other boss pieces give offensive stats, just defensive ones (more dp, +300 hp, evasion). So adding 5 accuracy will add more damage but you're losing out on an assload of defensive stats, plus the gem slots

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Posted

i understand what you saying, but this is assuming that other classes can hit other evasion stackers

i know that the fact that we have to wear black horn bow ( an item that gives the lowest gs ) to do damage kinda sucs, however you have to look at other classes as well

some classes that i can think of that can hit eva stackers and still doesn't need accuracy off hand would be

warrior = they have dp debuff which reduces evasion

tamer = pet has 100% accuracy

witch/wizard = apparently magic attack has higher accuracy than melee attack ( hence there are melee ap and magic ap gem )

berserker = grabs does not get affected by accuracy.

 

the reason why musa need accuracy the most is because we do not have any of those options above, but we make up for it with having high damage if we hit our attacks.

 

but again you are assuming that other evasion stackers can hit other evasion stackers without accuracy offhand.. i am 100% sure that without accuracy those eva stackers can't hit other eva stackers.

 

and back to the video..

only way i can think of for the musa to hit her is to wear necklace of good deeds and ring of good deeds

now i know its totally unfair for the musa, but does it matter though ?

if he does able to hit her and kill her even with 20 - 30 lower gs then that should good enough..

someone should probably test 3x taritas + bheg to see if they do more damage compared to 4x boss gears

dont forget some classes like valkyrie warrior zerker and dk can use their acc offhand which coincidentally is their eva offhand......

wiz/witch also get high % acc modifiers on their skills and % acc increase on their awakening buff.

ninja and kuno do have high base acc (had a eva ninja in my guild who was being killed by another eva ninja simply because he was using 2x tri rce and tri tree belt with tadd shuriken along with kzarka and bhegs etc)

that kinda makes us draw the shortest straw in the bunch, with no acc on our eva offhand, no buffs/high acc % on skills and very low base acc..... 

you also have to take into acc, even if you stack acc to counter ppl evasion, the moment they go full dr build (wars/valks/zerkers) your acc is a waste and your ap wont be high enough to kill anyone. basically you really need around 200 ap with full acc build to reliably dmg anyone and kill them.

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Posted (edited)

@DaiCazzo

funny how everyone made fun of you at first, but now they listened and everyone starting to use that black horn bow 

this goes to show that even high level players have no idea what they doing and had to listen to middle score gs player for advice lol

i am not gonna lie though, it is pretty screwd for everyone to dismiss the idea before testing, good thing Zubi understand this and test the idea.

sometimes it really just take simple  rock paper scissor common sense

 

I know ppl wont listen untill they see with theirs eyes thats why i always do my tests on my own.

About "  this goes to show that even high level players have no idea what they doing and had to listen to middle score gs player for advice lol " well dunno if u refeering to me but my GS is almost 500 with nouver cuz i have a -----ing bad rng with accessory like crescents and ogres spending over 7B to end up with only 1 trii crescent and 0 Duo ogre. Anyway level says nothing about players nowadays a nerd who only grind can get 60 in a month and half but does this make him better then a lvl 58 with 2 months of pvp experience on arena ?

dont forget some classes like valkyrie warrior zerker and dk can use their acc offhand which coincidentally is their eva offhand......

wiz/witch also get high % acc modifiers on their skills and % acc increase on their awakening buff.

ninja and kuno do have high base acc (had a eva ninja in my guild who was being killed by another eva ninja simply because he was using 2x tri rce and tri tree belt with tadd shuriken along with kzarka and bhegs etc)

that kinda makes us draw the shortest straw in the bunch, with no acc on our eva offhand, no buffs/high acc % on skills and very low base acc..... 

you also have to take into acc, even if you stack acc to counter ppl evasion, the moment they go full dr build (wars/valks/zerkers) your acc is a waste and your ap wont be high enough to kill anyone. basically you really need around 200 ap with full acc build to reliably dmg anyone and kill them.

The problem u are saying is that musa/maewha are right now in the bottom tier of pvp in any scenario... the main reason isnt accuracy but its the grab we dont have in order to keep dealing damage.. So in the end our classes are like " kill him in 1 cc aka 2 seconds or never kill" meanwhile a DK nuke the ground, A witch/wiz nukes the entire area, a ninja can double grab someone who got cced, a zerker can chain cc grab combo, a sorc can just jump around and do their spin to win or grim reaper to delete ppl, a tamer can jump on you do 30 combos in 1 second ( ask lemon for macro/scripts he is a pro in that ) and ofc he can grab u to do more combos, do i forget something ? oh yeah warrior can be permanent super armor while grabbing your ass , a valk can just put u down and spam a skill to burst u down and if they cant u know what ? they can grab too sometimes, a ranger who stiff you + grab = instant death... Then ppl cry cuz they cant instant kill a running musa/maewha

Edited by DaiCazzo

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Posted

I know ppl wont listen untill they see with theirs eyes thats why i always do my tests on my own.

About "  this goes to show that even high level players have no idea what they doing and had to listen to middle score gs player for advice lol " well dunno if u refeering to me but my GS is almost 500 with nouver cuz i have a -----ing bad rng with accessory like crescents and ogres spending over 7B to end up with only 1 trii crescent and 0 Duo ogre. Anyway level says nothing about players nowadays a nerd who only grind can get 60 in a month and half but does this make him better then a lvl 58 with 2 months of pvp experience on arena ?

The problem u are saying is that musa/maewha are right now in the bottom tier of pvp in any scenario... the main reason isnt accuracy but its the grab we dont have in order to keep dealing damage.. So in the end our classes are like " kill him in 1 cc aka 2 seconds or never kill" meanwhile a DK nuke the ground, A witch/wiz nukes the entire area, a ninja can double grab someone who got cced, a zerker can chain cc grab combo, a sorc can just jump around and do their spin to win or grim reaper to delete ppl, a tamer can jump on you do 30 combos in 1 second ( ask lemon for macro/scripts he is a pro in that ) and ofc he can grab u to do more combos, do i forget something ? oh yeah warrior can be permanent super armor while grabbing your ass , a valk can just put u down and spam a skill to burst u down and if they cant u know what ? they can grab too sometimes, a ranger who stiff you + grab = instant death... Then ppl cry cuz they cant instant kill a running musa/maewha

Have to disagree somewhat.  Our 1v1 pvp is decent, with our only hard counter being warrior.  Our group pvp used to be good before mages got their awakening, but now it sucks because of them.  Maehwa is in a similar state, but better at 1v1s and slightly worse at group pvp aside from their 100% bsr.  A grab will not change much for us in group pvp, which is really where we need the most changes.  I would be content with a grab to make our 1v1 more dynamic, but it's pointless to think about.

The main issue with musa is that it just doesn't shine in any form of pvp, being mediocre in 1v1 and on the lower end in group pvp.  This would be fine if there weren't classes that were great at everything, but alas, that's just the way it is right now.  Nothing will change, as evidenced in the KR version, for a long time.  Maybe we can see something positive when they do the base skill revamping, but right now there's nothing we can actually do about it.  We just have to acknowledge our class as it is and have fun with it.  If you are not having fun, I do suggest you reroll because we won't see changes for at least half a year(I think longer).

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Posted

ninja and kuno do have high base acc (had a eva ninja in my guild who was being killed by another eva ninja simply because he was using 2x tri rce and tri tree belt with tadd shuriken along with kzarka and bhegs etc)

Ninja fails as much as we do if they don't stack accuracy, the only way for me to survive a ninja 1v1 is using whwb but if they don't have acc offhand they miss a lot because their awakened grab doesn't have 100% acc and trust me they need the accuracy. Thing is they can dump down their AP to 180-190 and still deal much more damage than us.

Tamer on the other hand.. holy -----, they don't even need RCE to destroy an evasion stacker 1v1.

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I know ppl wont listen untill they see with theirs eyes thats why i always do my tests on my own.

About "  this goes to show that even high level players have no idea what they doing and had to listen to middle score gs player for advice lol " well dunno if u refeering to me but my GS is almost 500 with nouver cuz i have a -----ing bad rng with accessory like crescents and ogres spending over 7B to end up with only 1 trii crescent and 0 Duo ogre. Anyway level says nothing about players nowadays a nerd who only grind can get 60 in a month and half but does this make him better then a lvl 58 with 2 months of pvp experience on arena ?

The problem u are saying is that musa/maewha are right now in the bottom tier of pvp in any scenario... the main reason isnt accuracy but its the grab we dont have in order to keep dealing damage.. So in the end our classes are like " kill him in 1 cc aka 2 seconds or never kill" meanwhile a DK nuke the ground, A witch/wiz nukes the entire area, a ninja can double grab someone who got cced, a zerker can chain cc grab combo, a sorc can just jump around and do their spin to win or grim reaper to delete ppl, a tamer can jump on you do 30 combos in 1 second ( ask lemon for macro/scripts he is a pro in that ) and ofc he can grab u to do more combos, do i forget something ? oh yeah warrior can be permanent super armor while grabbing your ass , a valk can just put u down and spam a skill to burst u down and if they cant u know what ? they can grab too sometimes, a ranger who stiff you + grab = instant death... Then ppl cry cuz they cant instant kill a running musa/maewha

actually dont mind not having a grab, grab is only ever useful in very small skirmishes or 1v1, im talking about our inability to stack anything other than acc to do dmg, like literally no other class with a bad acc offhand goes acc build, wars,zerkers,valks and dk only go vangertz/saiyer because it literally gives every single stat, ap,eva,acc........

if we had grab and perma super armour that would be just plain OP, you can just spam dash til you can grab again....

Ninja fails as much as we do if they don't stack accuracy, the only way for me to survive a ninja 1v1 is using whwb but if they don't have acc offhand they miss a lot because their awakened grab doesn't have 100% acc and trust me they need the accuracy. Thing is they can dump down their AP to 180-190 and still deal much more damage than us.

Tamer on the other hand.. holy -----, they don't even need RCE to destroy an evasion stacker 1v1.

thats true, but ninjas do get passives on acc as well, and i heard somewhere that if you're cced your evasion is useless, so if a ninja can land a grab, its gg.

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Have to disagree somewhat.  Our 1v1 pvp is decent, with our only hard counter being warrior.  Our group pvp used to be good before mages got their awakening, but now it sucks because of them.  Maehwa is in a similar state, but better at 1v1s and slightly worse at group pvp aside from their 100% bsr.  A grab will not change much for us in group pvp, which is really where we need the most changes.  I would be content with a grab to make our 1v1 more dynamic, but it's pointless to think about.

The main issue with musa is that it just doesn't shine in any form of pvp, being mediocre in 1v1 and on the lower end in group pvp.  This would be fine if there weren't classes that were great at everything, but alas, that's just the way it is right now.  Nothing will change, as evidenced in the KR version, for a long time.  Maybe we can see something positive when they do the base skill revamping, but right now there's nothing we can actually do about it.  We just have to acknowledge our class as it is and have fun with it.  If you are not having fun, I do suggest you reroll because we won't see changes for at least half a year(I think longer).

I was not talking about groups fights since its seems clear to me that jump in a group as maewha is wrong. We have to bait and pick up little skirmish and leave the big groups to zerker,warrior,valk,wiz,witch. Our role is to go in the back line and finish off eventualy enemys that are trying to run away or are far from the main enemy group OR go search and destroy cannons .
Sure i agree with you musa/maewha are in the bottom tier of pvp in any form but i enjoy the class even if im  ready to reroll.
And i have to disagree with you about grab for us been OP which its not just like rangers are not op with grab or tamer are not op with grab or ninja is not op with grab... oh wait maybe they are all better then us in pvp? i wonder why ?? 

actually dont mind not having a grab, grab is only ever useful in very small skirmishes or 1v1, im talking about our inability to stack anything other than acc to do dmg, like literally no other class with a bad acc offhand goes acc build, wars,zerkers,valks and dk only go vangertz/saiyer because it literally gives every single stat, ap,eva,acc........

if we had grab and perma super armour that would be just plain OP, you can just spam dash til you can grab again....

thats true, but ninjas do get passives on acc as well, and i heard somewhere that if you're cced your evasion is useless, so if a ninja can land a grab, its gg.

i have to disagree with you about grab for us been OP which its not just like rangers are not op with grab or tamer are not op with grab or ninja is not op with grab... oh wait maybe they are all better then us in pvp? i wonder why ?? 

 

Our accuracy off sucks compared to other classes ( vang and sayer ) this is one of the reason why pvp is so unbalanced. Those weapons were balanced and made for a pre awekening wiew of pvp. with awekening they forget about this and -----ed up the pvp in any way possible. Do u even wonder how good would be a musa/maewha with full evasion build with a sayer/vang as off hand? This would be fair and maybe one day they will put such offhand also for us but still without a grab we will never be on the same lvl of any class with a grab and the reason is simple that the grab is too good in smal skirmish and 1 v 1 scenario where our classes should matter more... leave the large scale pvp to witch/wiz/Dk cuz thats why they are made.

 

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i have to disagree with you about grab for us been OP which its not just like rangers are not op with grab or tamer are not op with grab or ninja is not op with grab... oh wait maybe they are all better then us in pvp? i wonder why ?? 

 

Our accuracy off sucks compared to other classes ( vang and sayer ) this is one of the reason why pvp is so unbalanced. Those weapons were balanced and made for a pre awekening wiew of pvp. with awekening they forget about this and -----ed up the pvp in any way possible. Do u even wonder how good would be a musa/maewha with full evasion build with a sayer/vang as off hand? This would be fair and maybe one day they will put such offhand also for us but still without a grab we will never be on the same lvl of any class with a grab and the reason is simple that the grab is too good in smal skirmish and 1 v 1 scenario where our classes should matter more... leave the large scale pvp to witch/wiz/Dk cuz thats why they are made.

ofc small skirmishes grab is really really useful, but using grab in big wars is a way to get killed, only zerkers wiz and ninja get super armour on their grab, if you try to grab with any other class, other ppl can easily cc you, so even if we get grab it'd be useless in big wars, but small skirmishes and 1v1s really good.

a way to solve that acc offhand problem is very very easy, give kutum the same acc scaling as other acc offhands, problem solved. (never gonna happen)

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ofc small skirmishes grab is really really useful, but using grab in big wars is a way to get killed, only zerkers wiz and ninja get super armour on their grab, if you try to grab with any other class, other ppl can easily cc you, so even if we get grab it'd be useless in big wars, but small skirmishes and 1v1s really good.

a way to solve that acc offhand problem is very very easy, give kutum the same acc scaling as other acc offhands, problem solved. (never gonna happen)

I gave up on large scale pvp long time ago.. i will give it another try once i get a 7700k.. 

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thats true, but ninjas do get passives on acc as well, and i heard somewhere that if you're cced your evasion is useless, so if a ninja can land a grab, its gg.

No that is not true, a ninja from my guild with 210 AP can nearly oneshot me when I'm not running whwb (eva offhand), but when I wear it... Hilarious, I saw him knock me down, miss a skill, use a grab (with 100% acc) and miss 2 more hits then i stand up and leave .. And this happened like 2-3 times in the same duel he'd simply miss a lot. 

Don't try this vs tamers though, their pet alone with deal 500-1000 dmg in 1-2 hits + Tamer's dmg and their combo of full frontal hits.. Just don't try to trade damage with them, they're like melee wizards. They're not so hard to catch in owPvP tho, but in duels you can't get CCed or you'll die. 

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