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Kutum Vs. Nouver.

12 posts in this topic

Posted

Current stats are 190/225, playing Witch. Kutum looks tempting because of the hidden PvE damage and extra DP, but still we're talking about a 14 AP difference, how much would this hurt on PvP? My logic is that you can't deal any damage if you are dead which is why Kutum looks more appealing than Nouver, but then again I get the feeling that being under 200 AP is kind of too bad, so even if I go a TRI Dand and upgraded my accessories, by running Kutum I'd have about 195 AP vs 209 with Nouver.

 

Opinions?

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Posted

with that gear score you shouldnt worry about that too much , imo a wtich/wiz are the 2 classes that can deal the most dmg with the lowest ap , you should stick with kutum since you still need to pve a lot more to improve your gear. I think nouver is overkill on witch, i think the best way to build a witch when you have high end gear is with evasion offhand sicil neck with 2 evasion gem in helm and one red coral earring (yes accuracy is still important even tho everyone say witch/wiz don't need it ) you still have good enough dmg but really high survivability.

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Posted

Statswise u r not there yet to worry bout such trivial things. Its really the same, no offhand covers all aspects perfectly, tho kotom does offer more overall stats

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Posted

Just run Kutum  It will give you a bit extra DP and a pretty big increase in your pve.

Nouver is literally just a stat stick.  And really doesn't matter at your current gear score.

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Posted (edited)

is someone on NA? then I can test it out I got both on pri.

 

Edited by Beirut

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Posted (edited)

2017-04-27_1032753490.thumb.JPG.5e614ba2kutum doesn't have hidden monster dmg, it has accuracy which makes higher number of your skill procs  hit, making you do more dmg.

------

and real defense offhand isn't kutum, it's parry dagger...sicil is a hybrid neck, which is good. but to be completely honest, it is not cheap, I would rather make something like duo ogre and tri bensho instead....but sicil is a viable hybrid option no debate.

Edited by Priscilla

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Posted (edited)

kutum doesn't have hidden monster dmg, it has accuracy which makes higher number of your skill procs to hit, making you do more dmg.

 

I thought the samething till someone showed me a clear test were this is proven.

Basicly in short what he did is took a kutum used the magic arrow which hit only once. Every hit which was missed on the mob would be abandonded in his test. compare the hp of the mob with the nouver and looked at the overall dmg. 

So in this test it is clearly seen that accuracy doesn't played a factor in his test against a nouver also the 10% ignore resist is also abandoned in his test which only leaves the ap dmg.

The ap dmg is clearly lower then the nouver but the nouver hit less so he concluded it has a hidden factor which does more dmg to mobs.

The actual test is here:

http://m.inven.co.kr/board/powerbbs.php?come_idx=3584&l=29937

I was first also confused about that particular test till someone explained to me how he did it. I wanted to test the samething with the nouver and kutum against players in pvp.

Edited by Beirut

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Posted (edited)

I have both. I personally dislike Nouver in nearly every situation nowadays. Raw AP is honestly next to useless for us IMHO.

Kutum does blatantly more damage in PvE over Nouver. Test it out and you'll be able to notice pretty quickly just in a few quick tests that Kutum is better. Take a look at what what @Beirut listed. There are also other tests out there that have shown how much better Kutum is in PvE.

For PvP, Nouver I feel is also extremely lackluster. At 60 neither Witch nor Wiz needs much more than 200 AP to absolutely wreak havoc on a battlefield. As @The_Lord said, Witch/Wiz don't need high AP to be useful in PvP, it's the complete opposite. What good are you going in and dying even though you have 250 AP? We're a melee squishy class, you've got to play into that role in PvP.

Get yourself a Parrying Dagger, throw Evasion gems in your helm (or better yet, get Rocaba Helm/Gloves), and go to town. What @Lemonz said is 100% correct.

Just run Kutum  It will give you a bit extra DP and a pretty big increase in your pve.

Nouver is literally just a stat stick.  And really doesn't matter at your current gear score.

Nouver just looks good on paper. Don't fall for the trap of it.

Edited by Afrodwarf

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Posted

I knew what this thread would be about...

but...

I also held out hope that it would be a video of Nouver and Kutum having a brawl, trashing Valencia or something.  tch...

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Posted

I have both. I personally dislike Nouver in nearly every situation nowadays. Raw AP is honestly next to useless for us IMHO.

Kutum does blatantly more damage in PvE over Nouver. Test it out and you'll be able to notice pretty quickly just in a few quick tests that Kutum is better. Take a look at what what @Beirut listed. There are also other tests out there that have shown how much better Kutum is in PvE.

For PvP, Nouver I feel is also extremely lackluster. At 60 neither Witch nor Wiz needs much more than 200 AP to absolutely wreak havoc on a battlefield. As @The_Lord said, Witch/Wiz don't need high AP to be useful in PvP, it's the complete opposite. What good are you going in and dying even though you have 250 AP? We're a melee squishy class, you've got to play into that role in PvP.

Get yourself a Parrying Dagger, throw Evasion gems in your helm (or better yet, get Rocaba Helm/Gloves), and go to town. What @Lemonz said is 100% correct.

Nouver just looks good on paper. Don't fall for the trap of it.

I cant help but to disagree. There is no offhand in game suited best for every situation, though if we were to only use one I'd stick with kutum as its a strong allrounder with sligthly more overall stats. However, tet kutum vs tet nouver does about the same damage in pila ku on 237 ap vs 253 ap on wizard, and if there is a damage difference it is so small that it's really hard to tell the difference, meaning you could go with whichever. "Kutum does blatantly more damage" is a massive inaccurate statement, and my results in pila ku are recent and no test will sway that experience (but of course believe what you like). Furthermore, if you are able to play flawless, by either being able to land your hits first in a 1v1 or group, before getting focused on in this damage race (when using at least tet armor which is 283), having the 253 AP is in many cases enough to score kill vs equally geared opponent. I fought a zerker that had 250+ AP and without nouver and 253 AP I wouldn't have been able to kill him in time, while if I were to fight a ninja on my nouver with lackluster DP (283) I'd surely lose. So again, no this or that, nothing is bad or "lackluster", you need to account what situation you are in and what other stats you have, such as a nouver of course most likely being bad on a user with lower DP such as 263 or less (but then you're already considered undergeared).

 

For group PvP you are right that parrying dagger is solid, and people should always use 2x 5 evasion gems in helmet.

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Posted

I cant help but to disagree. There is no offhand in game suited best for every situation, though if we were to only use one I'd stick with kutum as its a strong allrounder with sligthly more overall stats. However, tet kutum vs tet nouver does about the same damage in pila ku on 237 ap vs 253 ap on wizard, and if there is a damage difference it is so small that it's really hard to tell the difference, meaning you could go with whichever. "Kutum does blatantly more damage" is a massive inaccurate statement, and my results in pila ku are recent and no test will sway that experience (but of course believe what you like). Furthermore, if you are able to play flawless, by either being able to land your hits first in a 1v1 or group, before getting focused on in this damage race (when using at least tet armor which is 283), having the 253 AP is in many cases enough to score kill vs equally geared opponent. I fought a zerker that had 250+ AP and without nouver and 253 AP I wouldn't have been able to kill him in time, while if I were to fight a ninja on my nouver with lackluster DP (283) I'd surely lose. So again, no this or that, nothing is bad or "lackluster", you need to account what situation you are in and what other stats you have, such as a nouver of course most likely being bad on a user with lower DP such as 263 or less (but then you're already considered undergeared).

 

For group PvP you are right that parrying dagger is solid, and people should always use 2x 5 evasion gems in helmet.

My results were testing Kutum vs Nouver at 208 AP vs 224 in Pila Ku. I believe you have such similar results with Kutum and Nouver because you're already above a threshold on how much damage you need to do to essentially 1 shot everything in Pila Ku. It's the same with Pirates, once you're at ~200AP it doesn't matter how much more you have over that or what offhands because you're still going to 1 shot those mobs. For me 208 Ap with Kutum made it so I can reliably 2 shot everything there instead of 2-3 shotting with my nouver. If I were able to 1 shot them with either offhand, much like I'm sure you do, I'd still use Kutum because it just gives me more stats in the way of DP when more AP simply wont help at all at that point anyways.

 

As far as PvP, I don't 1v1, so Nouver may be better there. For siege PvP or group I'd rather take survivability any day over that extra AP simply because there are too many variables to account for and I can't rely on myself or the servers to "play flawless" and will never rely on that just in the pursuit of a higher gear score. I'd much rather know that I've got the damage at ~200 AP and survivability at 300+ DP with stacked evasion to get in with my frontline and support them by throwing CC and damage down, healing, and being able to reposition because the added defenses. What good is my 224AP with Nouver if I'm getting 2-3 shot or CC locked into oblivion when I'm suppose to be in pushing with my group? I play, and am expected to play, my class extremely aggressively and to be right next to my Warriors, Valks, and Zerkers throughout fights and Nouver will never allow me that luxury.  Perhaps it's because I'm "undergeared" and in a mix of tri/tet boss gear, I'm not sure.

 

As you said though, it's situational and your gear should be suited to your playstyle and situations in which you put yourself in. If you're able to do work full AP, go for it.

 

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Posted (edited)

I sold my Kutum and stay with Nouver only... maybe some day ill do Parring... but even with kutum on node war vs ppl on similar gear... uhh will not help one CC and u are dead, but lower AP make a big difrence, when whole players running witch bufs etc. lower ap = much less dmg so u can't kill on combo so overall you don't  do what you should do.

 

Currently im stay at 253 AP and 283DP..

 

Till they don't change DP system ill go full AP and DP only from Armors...

Edited by Dreed

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