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What little PvE content IS there?


67 posts in this topic

Posted

New WoW content isn't only released with expansions. We have a LFR hero talking about how easy PvE is even though he has no PvE accomplishments. Congratulations on being able to "master" PvE content after it has been nerfed for the casual masses at its lowest difficulty. It takes the worlds best guilds weeks to clear new raids on hard mode and more often then not they end up getting rebalanced for the masses (nerfed) once it's been cleared. Tell us about how much experience you have clearing bleeding edge content in a game like World of Warcraft. Nobody cares about how bored you are of clearing old irrelevant content that's been nerfed to the ground or about how good your LFR gear is.
There are just as many terrible no skilled PvP players as there are PvE players. It's hilarious to me the amount of PvP "gladiator" players that failed miserably at basic mechanics when it comes to what you call "easy predictable AI". Reading the few posts you've made in this thread makes me think you would fail miserably being put in a real PvE competitive environment because you clearly have no experience or knowledge about any of it.

and I never cared about World of warcraft at all.

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Posted (edited)

and I never cared about World of warcraft at all.

Cool story, tell us more about how PvE requires no skill.

17bfe0bd0e051802def7035ba2253280.jpg

Edited by Hatebringer
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Posted

Cool story, tell us more about how PvE requires no skill.
17bfe0bd0e051802def7035ba2253280.jpg

28016-Searching-For-A-Fuck-To-Give.jpg

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Posted

if community wana more pve , then we get this sh***

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Posted

I think a lot of people have many misconceptions about reality here.

What is PvE? Is it everything that is not PvP? Is it only the killing of mobs? The acquiring of gear? Certainly walking around a lush parkland can't be considered as "versus" anything. Maybe PvE means making lots of money, but since everyone is doing that wouldn't it be a PvP challenge to have the most? The concept PvE is different to everyone, and there will never be any agreement about what the game needs to satisfy a complaint of "not enough PvE content".

Let us also consider the PvP content. PvP for grinding mobs seems completely pointless in the videos I have reviewed. The areas where they are is populated by hundreds of mobs waiting for players to slaughter them. Mobs also don't seem to drop much in the way of valuable gear, so there doesn't seem to be any reason to fight over who gets a specific mob. There is no public score board that says X has killed 1249 players or Y has died 32409 times, so not much in the way of bragging rights and no point to individual combat.

Killing mobs should have to have some challenge. Click, click, click, suck potion, repeat; that is not PvE, it is grinding. I have played games where thousands of hours would be spent grinding just to gain a few levels and be able to take on a quest boss. It was kind of boring. I had more fun writing computer programs to play the game for me for those thousands of hours of grinding. In fact someone had fond enough memories of the same that they made Progress Quest.

If you have to walk 20 minutes to find a mob worth killing then the game probably needs more mobs or more cities near higher level mobs. If players complain about lack of interaction with other players then the world might be too big; conversely if players are climbing all over each other then the world is either too small, a specific area doesn't match the rest of the world balance, or more areas tuned to that specific player level are needed.

If many people are looking for specific gear then the drop rates and spawn rates that lead to that gear might need to be adjusted; there is nothing worse than a gear being wanted by everyone when it is dropped 0.001% of the time only by a boss that spawns once a week and requires 30 people to team kill or has a 0.02% chance of appearing at shop Z at 14:27GMT of the 3rd Tuesday each month. That is not PvE or PvP, it is player versus developer when the dev can tell the Random Number God what to do and the player has to sacrifice their first born in the hopes of having a prayer heard by the RNG.

Another whole set of misconceptions is that a RPG games are somehow winnable. What is the win condition? Did you beat all the other players, boot them off the server, and own everything (Core Wars)? If there was a score board and it says you are top person then you won...at least until you stop playing for 2 days and then someone else is top person and they are the winner...until...ad infinitum. Achieving the max level, is that winning? What if the max level gets changed, your win was suddenly stolen by new content? The game is no more winnable then you can win at life. The max level, in as much as there is one, should be viewed more as a finish line. Do you keep running a race after having crossed the finish line?

There are only 2 things that the game must do. First be interesting and challenging enough that players want to continue playing until some sort of finish line. Second take long enough to achieve that finish line that players feel the money they spent on the game was a reasonable entertainment value. Some people think a 2 hour movie with a $15 ticket price is reasonable but then ----- about a game they payed absolutely nothing to play for 200 hours; clearly not in touch with reality.

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Posted

Mhm, the game is quite new - I wont judge the content till Ive played tru it.

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Posted

Mhm, the game is quite new - I wont judge the content till Ive played tru it.

It's been out for over a year in KR and it's still a mess. You can play through all of it solo in roughly 100hours, assuming level cap is 55. Much lower if 50, if you want to try it out for yourself. 

I wish more people would, before making assumptions about the game.

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Posted

BDO PVE is very weak.

Most quests are mailman quests. (Talk to NPC, kill x mobs, loot y items, return to NPC, initiate dialog, choose reward. Rinse rub, repeat.)

Monster AI is laughable. They may as well stand still since their behavior coding is so self destructive and unchallenging. The only challenge is attacking higher level mobs because they require more hits to bring down due to higher HP.

The Player's story is... I'm not even sure if there is one.

However, the non-combat side of PVE is very diverse. Trade routes, crafting, NPC hirelings, Fishing, Guilds, Sailing, mounts, pets, farming, there's a lot to do in terms of timesinks without a goal. Maybe BDO will add some sort of overarching purpose to these systems in an expansion. Like build an empire and have your NPC's battle another enemy player's NPC's over a trade route a castle or something. owever currently, they are all just timesinks designed to generate silver to buy gear to kill mindless monsters in order to get to lvl 50 and fight other players. (PVP also has no purpose)

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Posted (edited)

TERA had some preety challenging world bosses back before the massive nerfs. Shandra Manaya was long considered the most difficult and it's still nothing compared to certain FFIV and WoW raids, at least back in it's glorious days. BDO has little to almost no PvE content aside from a couple of bosses and open dungeons... and it's fine, because that's how a sandbox game should work. Devs expect guilds to engage in fights for those bosses, because the game is mainly pvp oriented. In a lot of it's core mechanics, BDO is reminiscent of L2's world.

I'd be nice if you'd stop calling fishing, crafting, housing or horse taming and other rudimentary content PvE. It is not. PvE content only includes mobs, bosses and raids and everything that has to do with players fighting AI controlled entities to either progress, or gain.

Rest of the content can be done and enjoyed regardless whether you're pve or pvp-oriented and often incorporates elements of both to work appropriately.

Edited by Narcosis

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Posted

It's been out for over a year in KR and it's still a mess. You can play through all of it solo in roughly 100hours, assuming level cap is 55. Much lower if 50, if you want to try it out for yourself. 

I wish more people would, before making assumptions about the game.

Yeah I figured as much , however 1 year isnt that much.
I remember waiting almost 2 years in Runes of Magic for new level cap and content - however the longer they take for new content the better it gets, hopefully :)

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Posted

TERA had some preety challenging world bosses back before the massive nerfs. Shandra Manaya was long considered the most difficult and it's still nothing compared to certain FFIV and WoW raids, at least back in it's glorious days. BDO has little to almost no PvE content aside from a couple of bosses and open dungeons... and it's fine, because that's how a sandbox game should work. Devs expect guilds to engage in fights for those bosses, because the game is mainly pvp oriented. In a lot of it's core mechanics, BDO is reminiscent of L2's world.

I'd be nice if you'd stop calling fishing, crafting, housing or horse taming and other rudimentary content PvE. It is not. PvE content only includes mobs, bosses and raids and everything that has to do with players fighting AI controlled entities to either progress, or gain.

Rest of the content can be done and enjoyed regardless whether you're pve or pvp-oriented and often incorporates elements of both to work appropriately.

I enjoyed the raids in Tera,  is people still raiding often there?

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Posted (edited)

I enjoyed the raids in Tera,  is people still raiding often there?

I don't know, I retired from TERA years ago, just before they introduced the new dungeons after Alliance/Wonderholme update. I decided to keep the fondest memories, before BH and Gameforge turned everything into a complete "grind for nothing, instance after instance" experience toppled with cash shop hilarity. I've never seen such an ambitious game to fall so low.

BDO actually made me check out TERA again a couple days ago, thinking I could at least see some of the new pve content and lore in the meanwhile; 2 minutes of achievements and tons of new, confusing windows along with new useless geargrind made me reconsider it in an instant, though. I uninstalled a couple minutes later and I'm not going back to that game ever again. Hilarious, considering that half an hour of game time cost me more than two days of constant attempts to install the client, with countless 40GB redownloads. Up to this day, EU TERA has one of the worst patchers I've ever seen in my entire life, along with game's abysmal performance.

I can only hope they learned from their mistakes and maybe, perhaps, their new project EXA will be more or less what BDO is currently trying to achieve.

Edited by Narcosis

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Posted (edited)

PvE is simple, it's "adventuring". It is when the environment in this case a synthetic world is actively having you as a participant in a story.

Quests, challenges, exploring, raiding, events, scenarios are all "PvE".

Oppose to PvP which is player interaction or "drama".

To boil it down, one is a scripted by the "world" and another is scripted by the "community".

Thus:

All PvE has to come from the developers because until we have synthetic AI(far far in the future), a human hand must create new PvE scripts.

The only thing in between is perhaps player created content (aka payer created dungeons, guild castles, etc) which is quasi PvE, but far far from true PvE as our Programming hasn't advance to the level where developers do not need to intervene in creating content.

 

In a perfect world of PvPvE theory, I think you can look at novels such as "Legendary Moonlight Sculptor" which is probably the most true-istic vision of a Sandbox MMO. The Hero spends half his time doing PvP interactions, while on a non-stop chain of PvE chain quest adventuring, that is spontaneously created based on his and AI actions.

While no MMO can do that, the PvE part of can be substituted by developer hands, instead of this idea of a "sentient AI black box GM".

Or even more basic discription. in a Dungeon and Dragon's table top scenario. The DM is PvE, the player are PvP

Edited by Kuu

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Posted

Well for those into PVE there are guild quests you can do which is basically aoe down 1000 or 1500 of these brainless mobs. Like a tribe or orcs or goblins for example, it's just grinding.  

The harder stuff will be the cyclops and ogres which are difficult to deal with if you aren't geared properly but can be soloed by skilled players, these two mobs are the ones that actually have mechanics. But they drop good loot and will be camped by PVPers, you're not going to go 100 feet near these without fighting.

There are guild quest bosses and world bosses with a few mechanics but are not difficult what-so-ever, they'll get zerged down.  

There are weekly/daily?/puzzle-piece boss scrolls you can do, all soloable/zergable but they are right below ogres/cyclops difficulty. 

__

It may sound like a lot of PVE but it really isn't, everyday or other day you'll summon up the boss scroll or go to the world boss, proceed to curbstomp it while ignoring all of the mechanics then go back to grinding/crafting to progress for PVP.

It's very different from challenging and active PVE like in a raid or a dungeon in a typical MMORPG where every action you make matters for the success of the group and how your team needs depends you to perform.  

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Posted

Not a lot of PvE content? This game has more content at launch than any other MMO I know of. From the posts in this topic, I simply don't know what people realistically expect from a game to have.


As main features
You have an infinite level & skill points cap, accompanied by an intricate equipment & enchanting system. These end-goals are something you'll keep progressing even after years of playing. There are also several different classes with different abilities to try out.

As side features
Questing, housing, player customization, mounts, racing, music, fishing, gathering, breeding pets/mounts, cooking, gardening, hunting, alchemy, a knowledge system, processing, parkour, trading, nodes, and worker management (sorry if I forgot something). Some of these even have afk features. It's a sandbox MMO, in the sense of being an Open World non-linear experience without loading screens, offering freedom for you to decide what you want to do.

If it's not enough, you have dailies & community driven content, such as World bosses, guild contracts + quests + hangouts, & other community activities that you can arrange.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What seems to be the problem: repetitive grinding, no party play, & game difficulty.

You are basing assumptions on current localizations of the game, don't expect it to be the same for EU/NA has some values are being adjusted. Even if they aren't, and a vast majority of the playerbase wants to change it, we can suggest the devs to make changes after testing. Just don't forget that, in the end, it's still their game and fruit of their labor with a specific vision & concept in mind.

There is an abundant amount of enemies and the game is constantly being expanded (from characters, to entire new zones & bosses). Being in a party is getting incentives, enemies/ bosses are getting improved AI, health pools, etc. Who knows what lies ahead.

On another note, this game is PvX, so PvP and PvE are interconnected. There is an open World PvP system with rogues (pk'ers), bounty hunters, and more organized PvP content with arenas, GvG, and sieges. The guild is viewed as a community that affects how your player experience with this game will be (for both sides of the content).


Summarizing my pov
If you compare it to something like WoW (launched in 2004), then yes there is less depth to this game. However, being a 2015/16 release has its own benefits. The amount and quality of content at EU/NA launch is enough, IMO, to justify playing it over other MMOs. 
If you prefer instanced party combat or raids, there is a vast list of other MMO's with different criterias, where at this point BDO isn't capable of offering (new features will come in the future though).

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Posted

is this another... "theres no PVE because this isn't another WoW clone" thread?

PvE Content

Exploration

Housing

Gathering

Node Managment

Fishing

Crafting

Taming

Horse Breeding

Open World Bosses (yah theres 3 of them) oh wait we don't have desert make that 2.

Questing

Whale Hunts

----------------------

PvP and PvPvE content

Exploration

Gathering

Fishing (outside of town)

Whale Hunting

Open World Bosses

Horse Taming

Node Wars

Castle Sieges

Rare incidents of random acts of PvP

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Posted (edited)

I will admit I had my fun back in the day playing Lineage 2. Reminds me a  lot of prison rules. To survive you got to get in with a gang so no one messes with you, or you find the biggest MoFo you can and beat the crap out of him. However the 2nd one doesn't work well if you are a lvl 20 going up against a lvl 60. 

Biggest down fall to that game was the gold farmings, farm trains and killed economy upon launch. I really didn't mind the grind, just sucks when you drop your duel S-grade swords from being killed by a random mob and then someone picks them up and runs away before you have the chance to recover them. :S  

 

Odd as you couldn't drop main hand weps. 

 

Edited by Drago

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