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111 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

I ask that DAUM and Pearl Abyss consider reinstating the localized markets and remove global auction and the fixed prices from Black Desert.

One of the major draws this game had for me was this concept of a market where I had to make an active effort to go out into the world and search for the best price, to bring my goods I gathered, crafted, or bought from another player and risk my skin and carriage against the threat of another player attacking as I ride across the region to make that extra 300 silver per sale in an economy driven entirely by supply and demand governed by the players. Travelling with a group of friends or hired mercenary players, slowly climbing my way to the top and purchasing bigger and better modes of transport. The connections made through trade, discussion and hiring of services. The healthy economics of commerce and supplying others with what they desire. The drive to push on through the risk of losing it all by the hand of another player. Being that player who risks his life and karma standing to steal a large haul from another. To have a real impact on the game world and how other players progress and play. In my mind this is the greatest part of Black Desert.

None of this can be done in the current state of Black Desert. Global auction completely eradicates the enjoyment of travelling to other areas to find a better deal, replacing it with an uninteresting system of arbitrary prices set by NPCs. There is no fun in participating in a system that should be built around the interaction between players if it isn't actually built upon it. 

I can only ask that DAUM and PA please consider bringing back the system that was featured in early stages of this game. I hold deep concern that this game will lose out on a fascinating aspect of itself as it has in Korea, Russia and Japan should the decision be made not to change this system.

Edited by Malkraz
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Posted

Yeah this game has no real player driven economy. I doubt they will change the system too much for our version, since this would be so major update.

So to say it bluntly: you are out of luck and this game might not be what you are looking for if you dont find yourself enjoying singleplayer mechanics.

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Posted

Yeah this game has no real player driven economy. I doubt they will change the system too much for our version, since this would be so major update.

So to say it bluntly: you are out of luck and this game might not be what you are looking for if you dont find yourself enjoying singleplayer mechanics.

That is certainly what it seems judging by other versions of the game. However, they have stated they are testing out more lenient player-player trading rules, and have said they can't comment on in-game economy currently because it's a "work in progress". I can only hope this means they are reconsidering the system they had in place during kCBT.

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Posted (edited)

Its not just about single player mechanics, Korea CBT had different systems to this and they changed it to prevent gold selling. If you didnt have fixed prices in the auction house then you could trade junk items for millions of gold. I really dont think theres anything wrong with the system they have now and it's implemented in such a way to allow things like guild contracts. I think you should wait until the game is out in NA and you're in a guild before you judge this mechanic.

 

Because atm they added in a ton of other features and ways to make money to make up for the locked economy system, and if you were to unlock it, then it would just be stupid and broken.

Edited by Yule
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Posted

Yeah I'm okay with fixed prices honestly. I really dislike inflation when certain players start controlling the market because they're rich in game. I give those people props though, they're very smart. 

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Posted

Well i have not played the other versions of this game but i play a game that has an economy that has a blend of both NPC and player control by that i mean there is a set price for items in game if you where to go to the NPCs for buying buying goods you would run into single priced items of fair price while also having the option of trading with players for the same item or items either at the same price or maybe a lower price or maybe even a good of equal value. if this is not understandable let me know and i can try to re word it best i can.

 

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Posted

Korea CBT had different systems to this and they changed it to prevent gold selling.

This is why I think it should be changed back to how it was. I do not see gold sellers as a big enough issue to warrant the complete destruction of a core aspect of what Black Desert was supposed to be. Originally, Black Desert was a player-driven sandbox MMO. The main aspects of this were the economics and the PvP, both of which largely played into eachother to make a fascinating and fun system. Grinding and progression were mostly just a means to access this content. Unfortunately, after DAUM took over they decided that gold sellers would be taking money away from them and shut down an important part of what made Black Desert such an interesting concept.

If they are really so worried about gold sellers, there are other methods to try and at the very least lower their number rather than just ban trading outright. There is already a thread about player-player trading specifically, so I don't want this thread to turn into that. I simply want to argue the benefits and importance of this system over the one currently in place. I feel the pros of this outweigh the cons of gold sellers existing, because otherwise Black Desert is not even half of the game it is supposed to be.

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Posted (edited)

This is why I think it should be changed back to how it was. I do not see gold sellers as a big enough issue to warrant the complete destruction of a core aspect of what Black Desert was supposed to be. Originally, Black Desert was a player-driven sandbox MMO. The main aspects of this were the economics and the PvP, both of which largely played into eachother to make a fascinating and fun system. Grinding and progression were mostly just a means to access this content. Unfortunately, after DAUM took over they decided that gold sellers would be taking money away from them and shut down an important part of what made Black Desert such an interesting concept.

If they are really so worried about gold sellers, there are other methods to try and at the very least lower their number rather than just ban trading outright. There is already a thread about player-player trading specifically, so I don't want this thread to turn into that. I simply want to argue the benefits and importance of this system over the one currently in place. I feel the pros of this outweigh the cons of gold sellers existing, because otherwise Black Desert is not even half of the game it is supposed to be.

The game is entirely gear based. The only reason you don't see gold sellers in the KR version is because trading is disabled, ergo disabling common methods of gold selling.

OT: No I don't want free economy. The only good MMO economy I've seen is EVE Online and that's because they have a dedicated economist to help keep the system in check. I'm glad prices are controlled by the game. You have no idea how stupid it is in WoW when my friend made nearly 30k gold selling Silk Cloth because he bought it all and set the market price. Stuff like that breaks games and it should not be in this game. Originally there was only supposed to be limited player housing and BDO was supposed to have a voting system and a bunch of other stuff and an economy. It doesn't have that anymore and to be honest I'm quite glad that it doesn't.

Daum and PA will not remove price fixing. And honestly if they're going to do a bunch of extra work I'd rather it be on something that matters like fixing the trading issues, better PVP (flagging, karma, guild wars). If they're going to rework something at least make it something worthwhile. The AH game is something very few people play and its more of an annoyance more than anything else. It takes a great amount of skill to control a market and that's fun for those people. Its not fun for the players that don't control the market and usually very few people do. Its a great niche and its not something a majority of players will miss.

EDIT: Also its another way for people to sell gold. So even if we completely disable trading you could still technically buy gold using the auction house. Gold Selling isn't as detrimental to games that have a gear treadmill but trust me its a really bad thing for BDO.

Edited by Smokinya
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Posted (edited)

I made an account just to make this post. I've played in the KRCBT, gold sellers were  all over the place and caused a huge divide in the community. After looking at the Original poster's post, I can see they have never played many mmos before, his lack of understanding the core mechanics of DUAM have implemented helps regulate the fine tining of the game. Having trading will only cause the game to stagnate and be a shadow of the great mmo it can be. The harassment from these sellers and scammer make the market a hard place to excel within the community. You sound like Donald Trump, uninformed and completely wrong. Duam has a great thing going and my friends and I will work to no ends to preserve their change to the market. If you don't like it, don't play it. End of story. 

Edited by SasukeChidori2001
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Posted

I made an account just to make this post. I've played in the KRCBT, gold sellers were  all over the place and caused a huge divide in the community. After looking at the Original poster's post, I can see they have never played many mmos before, his lack of understanding the core mechanics of DUAM have implemented helps regulate the fine tining of the game. Having trading will only cause the game to stagnate and be a shadow of the great mmo it can be. The harassment from these sellers and scammer make the market a hard place to excel within the community. You sound like Donald Trump, uninformed and completely wrong. Duam has a great thing going and my friends and I will work to no ends to preserve their change to the market. If you don't like it, don't play it. End of story. 

Maybe you shouldn't coat it in pink next time. Unless you're just trying to troll.

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Posted

RIP my economic dreams...

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Posted

I made an account just to make this post. I've played in the KRCBT, gold sellers were  all over the place and caused a huge divide in the community. After looking at the Original poster's post, I can see they have never played many mmos before, his lack of understanding the core mechanics of DUAM have implemented helps regulate the fine tining of the game. Having trading will only cause the game to stagnate and be a shadow of the great mmo it can be. The harassment from these sellers and scammer make the market a hard place to excel within the community. You sound like Donald Trump, uninformed and completely wrong. Duam has a great thing going and my friends and I will work to no ends to preserve their change to the market. If you don't like it, don't play it. End of story. 

cant read this shit so not gonna try

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Posted (edited)

 

Sorry, it's a force of habit when I see something that really urks me. Op should really open his mind to the ideas of a Dev controlled market. They make it fair, and also allow a change for the better.

 

Edited by SasukeChidori2001
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Posted

What do you consider "great MMO", Chidori?

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Posted (edited)

 

Its not a problem. Also when you quote somebody talk underneath them like this. Their comment is supposed to go in the above box ^ :)

Edited by Smokinya

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Posted

What do you consider "great MMO", Chidori?

An mmo where a buyer can't be scammed due to high market puedo-inflation, there should be some way to banish the mentality of destroying a market that endorses a player to purchase all of a single commodity and inflate its cost being an unfair and thus "stagnating" progression and damaging the playbility of the game. Making it not fun for anyone, trust me this is for the best. You understand how this is illegal in the real world and not how really demand and supply work, we have failsaves to protect the buyer.

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Posted

An mmo where a buyer can't be scammed due to high market puedo-inflation, there should be some way to banish the mentality of destroying a market that endorses a player to purchase all of a single commodity and inflate its cost being an unfair and thus "stagnating" progression and damaging the playbility of the game. Making it not fun for anyone, trust me this is for the best. You understand how this is illegal in the real world and not how really demand and supply work, we have failsaves to protect the buyer.

I see. Personally I don't have an issue with having an economy that players can do things like that, I think it's a fascinating thing and if I were a developer I'd love to see how it plays out. The way I see it the game is already stagnated when a major part of it's original design is just removed to favor those who don't feel safe in a system like that. Progression and grind should not be the core of the game, they should only be the way to access the rest of the player-driven content. This is not something we see in MMOs anymore and I was hoping from early releases that BDO would attempt to travel that path.

I think to say it damages the playability is a bit of an exaggeration, and it only applies to a certain outlook on how the game is to be played. If progression and "designed content" are the focus, then it of course would be a hindrance. This is not, however, how BDO was originally intended, and I do not think it should be changed to cater to those who want what most other MMOs already do. The comparison to real life doesn't work when you consider it comes down to a distinction between convenience and necessity. Not everybody in the real world can mine or refine ore. This is obviously not the case in the game. A market will eventually fix itself when players are dedicated enough to a system, but to achieve this dedication the system needs to hold interest. I do not see what is interesting in this new system that is almost exclusively used for progression rather than being an entire game in itself. Even if price-fixing were to remain, I don't see any reason other than catering to convenience to keep the AH globalized.

I do understand concerns that are held by others and I don't think most of them to be invalid, but I personally prefer that the developers stick to what was originally planned before DAUM came in and wanted to protect their bottom line by attempting to keep the most players around as they could. I do not think that popular demand necessarily indicates quality, and it's unfortunate that this is a difficult mentality to hold in this industry.

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Posted (edited)

I see. Personally I don't have an issue with having an economy that players can do things like that, I think it's a fascinating thing and if I were a developer I'd love to see how it plays out. The way I see it the game is already stagnated when a major part of it's original design is just removed to favor those who don't feel safe in a system like that. Progression and grind should not be the core of the game, they should only be the way to access the rest of the player-driven content. This is not something we see in MMOs anymore and I was hoping from early releases that BDO would attempt to travel that path.

I think to say it damages the playability is a bit of an exaggeration, and it only applies to a certain outlook on how the game is to be played. If progression and "designed content" are the focus, then it of course would be a hindrance. This is not, however, how BDO was originally intended, and I do not think it should be changed to cater to those who want what most other MMOs already do. The comparison to real life doesn't work when you consider it comes down to a distinction between convenience and necessity. Not everybody in the real world can mine or refine ore. This is obviously not the case in the game. A market will eventually fix itself when players are dedicated enough to a system, but to achieve this dedication the system needs to hold interest. I do not see what is interesting in this new system that is almost exclusively used for progression rather than being an entire game in itself. Even if price-fixing were to remain, I don't see any reason other than catering to convenience to keep the AH globalized.

I do understand concerns that are held by others and I don't think most of them to be invalid, but I personally prefer that the developers stick to what was originally planned before DAUM came in and wanted to protect their bottom line by attempting to keep the most players around as they could. I do not think that popular demand necessarily indicates quality, and it's unfortunate that this is a difficult mentality to hold in this industry.

Sorry but I wish to correct you if you may, DUAM always wanted to create a DEV controlled market, their reasoning is to allow a steady flow with price fixing so no one can ramp up billions of funds and hog all the commodities, that STAGNATES and creates a toxic marketship that will be the end of the game. I and my friends will seriously ask for my money back from DUAM if they change it to a libertarian market that you wish. No one really likes that idea and no one wants to play a game where two tycoons hold the whole share.

Edited by SasukeChidori2001
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Posted

That's unfortunate.

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Posted

That's unfortunate.

It's unfortunate that you think this way.

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Posted

As long as bots cant ruin prices on things I dont care

 

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Posted

I agree!

I don't understand why they would make a global auction when they're been trying to make the game realistic, dare I say horses? Dare I say no teleport? 

Please, be a gem among the rocks.

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Posted (edited)

I agree!

I don't understand why they would make a global auction when they're been trying to make the game realistic, dare I say horses? Dare I say no teleport? 

Please, be a gem among the rocks.

The world is full of real assholes, scammers , bullies and criminals too, I doubt you would want many of them in your game, you may express Indifference or say otherwise but as soon they start ruining your experience you will either protest or leave the game.

ultimately this is a game , a fantasy, a virtual world. If people only wanted what's is completely real , there is no point in playing games.

Those mechanics you speak of are only set to make this virtual world more "palatable" , it makes the fantasy more engaging without it having to suck.

Edited by Beeso

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Posted

The world is full of real assholes, scammers , bullies and criminals too, I doubt you would want many of them in your game, you may express Indifference or say otherwise but as soon they start ruining your experience you will either protest or leave the game.

ultimately this is a game , a fantasy, a virtual world. If people only wanted what's is completely real , there is no point in playing games.

Those mechanics you speak of are only set to make this virtual world more "palletable" , it makes the fantasy more engaging without it having to suck.

This whole whole heartedly. OP i hope you read this for the games sake.

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Posted (edited)

This whole whole heartedly. OP i hope you read this for the games sake.

I have heard this argument many times, and I don't understand the issue of players acting badly. There would be no PK system were this not something to be allowed. I think it is a wonderful thing to have internal politics and strife in a game, many people have fond memories of other players whom were infamous from old MMOs for one reason or another.

There are solutions to combating these people that do not rely on the devs to ban them. An MMO is not about your personal convenience nor do I think it should be. There are more interesting scenarios to play out in a world with jerks and thieves than there are in ones with only grinding partners. 

I'm not sure what "assholes, scammers , bullies and criminals" have to do with localizing the markets, anyway.

Edited by Malkraz
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