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Agerian VS Tartias Armor

114 posts in this topic

Posted

This isn't really helping your argument tbh, 12 damage on 3rd hit SoJ seems minuscule at best, whereas 20% more cast speed effects your whole combo, allowing you faster, safer, and better combos.

Except you can cap cast speed with Taritas anyway? Why is everyone acting like cast speed is hard to get?

And it's not just a 12 damage difference when you recognize that Final Smash hits multiple times and is affected by damage modifiers like down and back.

It's not a small damage difference at all, and I can easily drop my Zereth boots for a Heve helm if I really cared enough about cast speed.

At this point, you do you man. I don't think I could say anything else than I already have.

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Posted

Cast speed just seems too important, especially for pvp if you want to burst in CC windows. Doing 3rd SoJ combos with low cast speed vs cap , is a very noticeable difference.

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Posted

Below is a pvp progression gear chart released by Team Legacy (Praetorian) for first characters:

valkgear.thumb.jpg.775fba9f8fe13db9552fa

The recommended armor set is full agerian for first characters for a few reasons.  Agerian is extremely easy to get for a first time character and agerian will never be 'useless' because it is the best armor sets for alts to level with since all classes benefit from the stats.  @Gac, cast speed is extremely important for valk and it is pretty much required to max.  If you're not getting cast speed from your armor, you will be spending alot of gem slots for cast speed over other gems.  Your first point is mostly invalid because you can grind just as efficiently without tartias by timing blocks, etc correctly.  Points 2/3 can be argued to be more playstyle and personal preference than absolute reason.

if you actually played the game you'd know not having accuracy means you have to stay in one area longer instead of leaving 1-2 levels early to the next area.

 

You'd also know anyone with evasion -----S anyone without tartas in pvp.

 

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Posted

 

So we actually get Accuracy from 4 pieces of gear: The Yuria Weapon, Vangertz Shield, Kalis Belt, Kalis Necklace (I appear to have left this off the original post.)

I can't explain all the math behind the accuracy number but somewhere between 15-17 there is a point where it has a diminishing influence on PvP calculations. This was something we learned from the Korean community and will likely be proven again on the NA/EU client. The Kalis Necklace and Belt both at enchant level II give a total of 12 Accuracy, the rest is more then made up for by the two weapons slots. I'm not familiar with the actual Accuracy granted by the weapons but know that its enough. Additionally when we get the Yuria to +15 and can upgrade it to the ultimate version we get a level of Cast Speed off of it.

Hold on a moment...

I was told that when an item, like say a Yuria Weapon, says enhancement increases: AP, Accuracy, Additional Damage to Humans that meant that for each +1 enhancement you get an additional +1 AP, +1 Accuracy, and +1 Additional Damage to Humans.

From what you're saying it sounds like that is not the case.  Can you confirm I'm reading you correctly?  Also, if I am, is there a place to go (based on KR/RU data maybe?) that quantifies how much those things increase with each level of enhancement?

Thanks for the info!

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Posted (edited)

Very curious to know how much each enchant on yuria weapon adds to accuracy/ap/human dmg as well.  Seems like if the data was more clear, we'd  have a much easier time figuring it all out.

Why not go with 2 piece heve + 2 piece taritas?

Individually, the full sets look like:

AgerianTaritasHeve
150 hp20 hp300 hp
3 cast120 mp 
3 attack7 accuracy 
1 moveevasion 
stun + stiffnessknockback + floating 
4 sockets4 sockets8 sockets

If you wear the taritas gloves + boots, heve helm + chest:

2 set:
250 hp
200 mp
2accuracy
evasion
2 cast

With the extra 2 sockets from heve, you could add one +2 cast speed and one +100 mp or hp gems.  You'll still be able to maintain your 5 cast speed with two +2 cast speed gems in the helm + 1 cast in the weapon, and you'll get a ton of hp + mp.

You do give up +4 dp rating, knockback resist, and +5 accuracy.  With vangertz shield, yuria sword, and good deeds neck, you should be able to hit, or come extremely close to the 17 accuracy soft cap.

Edited by Blackstag

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Posted

great info here!

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Posted

Your post is quite interesting. Can you explain more about the 17 accuracy threshold and why you think more than that isn't too important?

I was planning on going Agerian at launch but pretty much everyone I know that played competitively on KR argued that a +15 Vangertz isn't enough on its own.

so +15-17 accuracy on gear doesn't include the hidden values for enhancing the Yuria and vangertz. So with just the laps necklace and belt at TRI tier you get 15, with the right jewelry or crystals 17 is pretty easy then on top of that you would have the additional accuracy from enhanced weapon slots. It just turns our to be a good target for the accuracy you can accurately account for. Additionally understand that this pre the awakening weapons that are now being released in Korea which are having major impacts on those servers. 

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Posted

i wonder why everyone says 3 pieces of agerian for cast speed. the cast speed is the 4set bonus. the 3set bonus is +100lp

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Posted (edited)

so based on what I've read so far, there are two viable options for Valkyrie gear:

1) Taritas 3/4 with Agerian gloves - socket helm with cast spd, gems for other pieces....dp/movement spd?

2) Agerian 3/4 with Talis or Zereth boots - again, socket helm with cast spd, can skip movement spd gem and go for something else...?

for accessories...is there a huge ap difference between equipping a Kalis necklace vs a Bares necklace? (I ain't getting a Heroic Deed necklace...that's going for upwards of 18+ mil silver on market...). I do have a Yuria wep and the Vangertz (sp?) shield...tho I need to enhance them to +15 at one point. Earrings can be Bares earrings and ring of deeds right? until I can acquire the blue witch earrings and stuff?

if i go with option 2, what will this put my accuracy at? I'm guessing way lower than the recommended 17...as I can see a bunch of "IMMUNE" msg pop up when doing shield throw on mobs

I'm currently using 3/4 Agerian set with Zereth chest piece for that extra 50 weight increase...but this thread is srsly making me reconsider either Agerian chest piece or go all out and replace my set with 3/4 Taritas + Agerian gloves...I do make use of Sword of Judgment alot...like, that's the 3rd skill I spam after CS and ST...

any recommendations? I like a good balance of movement spd and damage tbh...and I rarely block unless I'm fighting an elite or a boss...

Edited by elynia_sunless

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Posted

i wonder why everyone says 3 pieces of agerian for cast speed. the cast speed is the 4set bonus. the 3set bonus is +100lp

Agerian has no 4 set bonus

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Posted

Zanza - you need to take a closer look at the set bonuses...

Really it's an end game tweaking issue that comes down to personal preference. All my math suggests the Agerian set gives more ability to customize the smaller details since we don't have to worry about making up for the cast speed. I'm still trying to figure out all the foods and which crystals we actually have access to at this point. I'll share all the numbers when I am confident I've included most of the available information. 

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Posted

Agerian has no 4 set bonus

no set has 4-pc set bonus iirc, the sets used to have that prior to a patch that changed the number of pieces needed for full set bonus from 4 to 3 to encourage more gear mix-and-matching.

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Posted

ok so then the german translation must be wrong?

if you look on my screenshot 

"Effekt des dreiteiligen Sets" means "Effect of the 3 piece set" gives +100LP.

"Effekt des vierteiligen Sets" means "Effect of the 4 piece set" gives +2 attack and cast speed.

2016-03-10_10534982.JPG

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Posted

Yeah it is wrong. Agerian 2 piece gives 100 hp and 3 pieces give cast/attack speed + 2

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Posted

wow thats sad. they didnt fix such important information at release.

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Posted

In valkyrie vs valkyrie scenario: both with same + gear Taritas have adventage over Agerian. Reasons- more armor, more divine power. And can still gem that 3 c speed. You will be able to do longer burst series and cc chains with less downtime and need to regen. Agerian give some hp but I don't think this hp will neutralise that extra burst. 

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Posted

I did some editing to my gear and took off the attack speed and noticed no difference (update from my previous post) so i can play around with more gems now. I'm still liking the 3 piece taritas with Agerian gloves. If you manage to have a +2 cast speed gem in your helmet with Agerian gloves and yuria with cast speed in those then you should be set. Also note that upgrading your yuria to blue (highly suggested you only do it at +15 because of enchantment issues and cost) gives you an additional +1 crit, +1 attack speed and +1 cast speed. So your yuria comes with an extra cast speed. So while you have the taritas 3 piece set with and the armor giving you additional mp and an additional +mp gem in your chest (for now), you sit at a nice mana pool. Then grab the awakening with your celestial spear that gives you the 3% of your mp as dmg . Honestly looking at both sets of gear, you can tweak both to fit your playstyle. Also note that since the Taritas has a little bit more DP, you can add AP accessories and you'll have a little bit more dp than an agerian set. I personally am shooting for duo and tri ring of good deeds for the accuracy bonus in them. So far i have two duos. I'll be then upgrading to coral accessories after mediah. Just please be sure to make your decision on gear before getting your armor higher than 5 or you'll have wasted blackstones. Try out both sets and see how they are, and find out which one you like. Remember that your yuria can give you the additional stats i mentioned by making it a "Yuria sword of temptation" so include that into your formula for maxing cast speed. I like this topic and hope I can hear more experiences with what gear set people use. 

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Posted

What about have both sets? Just puting on specific pieces and combine them for best of actual situation. It is viable in bd?  I am asking  bcs other mmos i was used to have atleast two sets usualy totaly different from each other (full attack vs max def set) just switching them by actual situation :)

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Posted

No one stops you from putting in the extra effort, but you will use up a whole lot of blackstones in the process... I don't think it's worth it when the mediah update is only a few weeks away.

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Posted

the mediah update is only a few weeks away.

only weeks? damn, then I need hurry up my leveling :D  And when Mediah update hits, we are rolling to Grunil, is that right?

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Posted

wow thats sad. they didnt fix such important information at release.

that's weird cause NA version has the correct english translation...

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Posted

I personally think anyone seriously considering PvP needs to use Taritas 3-set with Zereth boots. I also think anyone seriously considering hitting level 56 and unlocking our awakening when it drops need to consider that too.

Cast Speed and Attack Speed are nice, but it doesn't matter if you're not hitting people in the first place. There are a lot of weapons and armor in this game that add to your evasion; the Vangertz Shield, for example, improves your evasion the more you enhance it. So the stronger it gets, the more evasion you get. The other thing to keep in mind is that between the Taritas chest armor and the set bonus you will increase your Divine Power pool by over 120. At level 50 my Divine Power is slightly over 400. That means if I wasn't running Taritas I'd have literally 30% less Divine Power. That's a lot for a few reasons:

1. Grinding as a valkyrie pretty much means spamming Shield Throw and Celestial Spear. Both of these skills eat up a ton of Divine Power, but when you max them out your damage output skyrockets and allows you to do things like killing Catfish at 42 with ease. I got to 50 pretty quickly, spending a lot of that time by myself, literally just running between packs comboing CS+ST together and only having to use Breath of Elion and the occasional Forward Slash. If I was standing around having to Vow of Trust after every other mob pack I would have leveled significantly slower. This is only going to matter more as you go beyond level 50 and the time it takes to grind gets more and more ridiculous. Efficiency is everything.

2. Valkyrie's biggest downside in PvP is its lack of gap closers. Shield Chase I/II/III is one of the few that we have, and it actually spends Divine Power using it, not stamina. Therefore, the more Divine Power you have, the less expensive using SC will be (and the more aggressive you can be in using it). So in effect increasing your Divine Power is arguably enhancing your mobility. 

3. Sword of Judgment is one of the top three damage skills we have, next to Celestial Spear and Shield Throw. Not only is it very effective when you max out Celestial Spear for the double tap, allowing you to shortcut straight to SoJ's hardest hitting third hit for a really nice burst attack, but its damage is increased based on your maximum Divine Power value. So the more Divine Power you stack, the better the damage will be.

The truth of the matter is that we have very few opportunities to stack our Divine Power without sacrificing AP. Elisha earrings, for example, aren't anywhere near as good as Witch/Bares Earrings. You're better off going straight for the AP there over increasing your Divine Power. But Taritas offers us the ability to stack up Divine Power, increasing our mobility and damage output in PvP, while additionally giving us additional accuracy through the gloves and the set bonus. That's so huge and it's crazy that people are even considering passing that up. Until Grunil comes out I can't imagine anything being remotely competitive.

As for the Zereth boots, I like them because there are very few off-pieces you can equip for item effects that do more for you than an additional +200 stamina. In total I have 1700 stamina right now, which is totally awesome. 

Well said! you are my hero, please keep this up!!! i wouldn't mind more info around Valk in any way as you defs sound like you know what you're talking about! Great job!

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Posted

In valkyrie vs valkyrie scenario: both with same + gear Taritas have adventage over Agerian. Reasons- more armor, more divine power. And can still gem that 3 c speed. You will be able to do longer burst series and cc chains with less downtime and need to regen. Agerian give some hp but I don't think this hp will neutralise that extra burst. 

So you are wanting to base your gear choices off of how you feel a 1v1 would go versus a SINGLE class?

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Posted (edited)

If you don't have to gem for cast speed (agerian), doesn't that mean you can then gem for other even more valuable things?  Such as grab resist or minus enemy resist?  Which you won't be able to gem for with Taritas?

Anyways, for fans of Taritas, where do you find the Taritas chest piece?  It's the only piece I'm using, due to its looks, but currently my Valk just looks like she has had some unfortunate encounter in a back alley, because I haven't been able to repair the max durability which is currently at 20.  It's never available on the marketplace and you can't even use the crafted version to repair it.

Edited by Climhazzard

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Posted

If you don't have to gem for cast speed (agerian), doesn't that mean you can then gem for other even more valuable things?  Such as grab resist or minus enemy resist?  Which you won't be able to gem for with Taritas?

Anyways, for fans of Taritas, where do you find the Taritas chest piece?  It's the only piece I'm using, due to its looks, but currently my Valk just looks like she has had some unfortunate encounter in a back alley, because I haven't been able to repair the max durability which is currently at 20.  It's never available on the marketplace and you can't even use the crafted version to repair it.

Lol I need the Taritas chest piece too, I've heard that you can get it Caphras Cave but I have yet to find anything. I'm just waiting patiently until someone puts it up on the marketplace

No one stops you from putting in the extra effort, but you will use up a whole lot of blackstones in the process... I don't think it's worth it when the mediah update is only a few weeks away.

omg really? I need to hurry and level up, I need to stop fishing and afk-ing. I need that Grunil real bad lol

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