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Please give us a normal looking male character...


18 posts in this topic

Posted

I would like it if I could create an average looking male character for the male-locked classes.  After reading how wonderful character creation was in BDO I was excited thinking about how this game could let me come closer to my visions for these characters than any games before it.   But then I got in and found that not only are there only 3 classes that can even have male characters, but none of those classes support even a close to normal, average looking human male.  I can be some kind of giant ogre beserker, some ridiculous looking square-jawed beefy man beefcake McMuscles, or Gandalf.

I've spent hours fiddling with these 3 possibilities, and the closest to an actual human being I can build is from the wizard.  If you mask the wrinkly face under facial hair & eyeliner you can kind of get to a 50 year old average looking guy.  Well, maybe closer to 60.

I understand why they would give 4 female classes that can all be tweaked into attractive young women, I like playing as the pretty ladies sometimes myself.  These guys know their market.  But for those of us males that want to have a main that is our own gender we are severely limited.

If they really believe that their game is more fun to play because of their restrictions, I guess there is nothing to be done.  But if they are willing to give a little leeway, I'd like to see the ability to make a warrior and/or beserker with an average male body shape, and wizards that can be any age down to young adult (in their 20s).

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Posted

I've seen plenty of warriors who look middle age. You can create it if you put the time to it

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Posted

Do you consider this guy:

blader.thumb.jpg.b04d451abb30b71ff313970

or this guy to be normal looking?

ninja_male.thumb.jpg.5e18725dec30133ce75

Cause these classes have already been released in Korea, it's just a matter of time before they make it over to the west.

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Posted

Check out http://www.bdotemplates.com/.  Plenty of variation in warrior and wizard if the effort is put into it.

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Posted

By normal looking I think he means lean. Since called the warrior beefcakes I'm pretty sure he wants someone who is default lean.  All the make classes look like they play football and swim for a living. 

I say why not?  More options= happy customers

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Posted

arent they suppost to be beefcakes tho? They're fighting/moving 24/7.

BUT. seeing more character creation options is always nice.

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Posted

By normal looking I think he means lean. Since called the warrior beefcakes I'm pretty sure he wants someone who is default lean.  All the make classes look like they play football and swim for a living. 

I say why not?  More options= happy customers

His complaint was age and square jaw.  Both are addressed on BDOTemplates.  Muscles can be hidden and dealt with too.  Take a look and spend some time in the CC.

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Posted

I too feel the BDO Character creator needs to be improved quite a bit. 

One of the biggest Problems is the accessibility/Learning curve of the creator. 

You need only to look at the forums to see the many requests for "Artists" to create a character for them.  There's usually several on each page.  Also the fact that there are "BDO Template" websites is a big indicator that the character creator is a bit too complex for most people. 

Its not that you CAN'T create an interesting looking character... it's that it takes a LONG time and a lot of work to significantly change a character in the CC. 

From My experience the character creator suffers from these main problems:

1) Lack of good Macro Editing tools -  While there are a lot of fine tuning tools (particularly for the face)  there are not many good macro editing tools and the body sliders have a fairly limited range. (For instance you can't create a thin, lean warrior character and you can't create a fat, muscular or even average build wizard.)   What the CC needs are macro editing tools like what Elder Scrolls Online has in their character creator.   So far that's been hands down the best character creator I've seen to date.  Their body sculpting controls actually beat out BDO's by quite a bit and even though their facial editing sliders are not as complex and have as many nodes as BDOs, you find MUCH more variation in character appearances in ESO than I've seen in BDO.  I've seen soo many character clones of the base presets in BDO that it's almost laughable. 

What's a Macro editing tool you say?  well the best and most powerful ones in ESO are their entire face and entire body editing tools.  These come in the form of triangles with a draggable Node in the middle.  Each point of the triangle represents an extreme.   For body the left bottom point was fatness/smoothness,  bottom right corner = thin/gaunt, top corner = muscle tone.   By draging the node in between these various extremes you got just about any body combination you could think of and gives you a really good base starting point to work with.  From there you can drag the individual sliders to fine tune.  For the face the 3 triangle points were Bottom left = smoothness/roundness, bottom left = thin/angular and the top point = pronounced bone structure (square jaw, pronounced cheekbones etc)  Again from here you could create a HUGE variety of base starting points for a unique looking face.   Also there was an "age" slider as well as a general height slider.   

These macro editing tools really help you create a unique looking base body and face for your character creation efforts to start from in less than a minute. 


2) Lack of distinct head mesh presets, nose or mouth types - the various different "presets" in the face editor are basically the starting preset with some very minor tweaks.  These should be DRASTICALLY different looking with completely different facial structure.   If you look at even just vanilla skyrim they have a very limited pallet of options to change or sculpt the face yet their presets vary tremendously from each other in comparison to BDO's.   For instance in skyrim 1 preset looks young and attractive, the next is very old and grizzly, the next looks like a dirty sad pauper,  the next looks like a fierce strong jawed warrior, the one after that a shady tattoed bandit etc.  

BDO doesn't even necessarily need to have additional meshes for the nose and eyes and mouth because their facial tweaking nodes are so powerful and could potentially get away with just different node settings, but I would highly recommend 8 or so completely different head meshes with drastically different bone structures and then various presets for the rest of the nodes.  However if you TRULY wanted to be the most amazing and expansive Character Creator out there.  Having like 5-10 drastically different mouth, nose and eye meshes to pair with the various head meshes would make the system that much more expansive (this could be handled load/processing wise if BDO used unified body meshes... see point 3).  1 way to handle it is have "racial and age presets"  I.E.  Black/African American/ Caucasion anglo-saxon/ hispanic/ Native American and Asian.  Perhaps having a completely different head mesh for "elderly" characters in each of those race categories with deep wrinkles in the mesh like how it is with the "wizard" class.

From there you could have a macro slider system for face roundness, Pronounced bone structure (square jawline pronounced cheekbones, thinness/angular and age. 

3) Needs unified body meshes -  One of the BIG limiting factors is the fact that each class has a separate body mesh.  This is both extremely limiting and very inefficient.  If all classes with the same or similar race used the same body mesh but with much greater flexibility you would not only exponentially increase the potential and posibilities of your character creator but also optimize the game because you'd be loading only 3 meshes  (Human/Elf Male,  Human/Elf Female, Giant) vs 12 different meshes (Berserker, Blader, Kunoichi, Ninja, Plum, Ranger, Sorceress, Tamer, Valkyrie, Warrior, witch, Wizard).   Also at first glance it looks like you have a tremendous amount of control over the body mesh even down to the fingers, but because of the separate meshes it was very limited and the range of theses sliders were also quite limiting.   I actually found that I had more (or I should say more effective) nodes/sliders I could edit in ESO than I do in BDO.    Sure you can edit all the way down to the individual fingers in BDO but no one really cares about that.  However in ESO you could adjust both the upper and lower thigh thus allowing you to create various types of legs both muscular and thin or fat.   In BDO when you edit the thigh it only has one node and if you make it bigger your leg just ends up looking fat.  You can't make a muscular body builder style leg because the lower thigh is always thinner than the upper thigh and the knee fattens up when you scale up the thigh and the calf.   That's just one example I can think of.   At the end of the Day while ESO might have had less sliders, they were more effective. 

If BDO had unified meshes with much greater min/max slider values for the various nodes and maybe a few additional sliders for some of the nodes to make them more effective  you would not only open up a whole new world of customization for players (young wizards, lean grizzled veteran warriors, old hag witches and tall non-loli tamers!) but also reduce the processing load on your servers by having 9 fewer body meshes in the game. 

4) Unlock hairtypes for all classes and add a few more hairstyles - Unlocking the hairstyles for all non Giant male or female character classes would be such a small change that would make such a big difference without adding any additional polygons to the game.  Hairstyles effect the general look of your character so drastically that by expanding the number of hairstyles available to each class by unlocking them and adding 10-20 more (even if its through the cash shop) would make such a HUGE difference in customization.  That alone would make the players in the game actually look different from each other. 

5) Add Scars and body marks to both the face and body similar to tattoos and unlock and expand the tattoos for all classes.  Many people really like having scars and body marks to separate themselves from the crowd.  It's a small detail but doing these little things would also make a big difference to a lot of people.  I also recommend checking out the way Archeage and ESO handle scar placement/editing as you can resize, rotate and place scars in a very customizable way in both games.  


These 5 suggestions would take the BDO character creator from a somewhat Limited character creator with a high learning curve and a lot of unlocked potential to the most amazing character creator the gaming community has ever seen.  

I too feel the BDO Character creator needs to be improved quite a bit. 

One of the biggest Problems is the accessibility/Learning curve of the creator. 

You need only to look at the forums to see the many requests for "Artists" to create a character for them.  There's usually several on each page.  Also the fact that there are "BDO Template" websites is a big indicator that the character creator is a bit too complex for most people. 

Its not that you CAN'T create an interesting looking character... it's that it takes a LONG time and a lot of work to significantly change a character in the CC. 

From My experience the character creator suffers from these main problems:

1) Lack of good Macro Editing tools -  While there are a lot of fine tuning tools (particularly for the face)  there are not many good macro editing tools and the body sliders have a fairly limited range. (For instance you can't create a thin, lean warrior character and you can't create a fat, muscular or even average build wizard.)   What the CC needs are macro editing tools like what Elder Scrolls Online has in their character creator.   So far that's been hands down the best character creator I've seen to date.  Their body sculpting controls actually beat out BDO's by quite a bit and even though their facial editing sliders are not as complex and have as many nodes as BDOs, you find MUCH more variation in character appearances in ESO than I've seen in BDO.  I've seen soo many character clones of the base presets in BDO that it's almost laughable. 

What's a Macro editing tool you say?  well the best and most powerful ones in ESO are their entire face and entire body editing tools.  These come in the form of triangles with a draggable Node in the middle.  Each point of the triangle represents an extreme.   For body the left bottom point was fatness/smoothness,  bottom right corner = thin/gaunt, top corner = muscle tone.   By draging the node in between these various extremes you got just about any body combination you could think of and gives you a really good base starting point to work with.  From there you can drag the individual sliders to fine tune.  For the face the 3 triangle points were Bottom left = smoothness/roundness, bottom left = thin/angular and the top point = pronounced bone structure (square jaw, pronounced cheekbones etc)  Again from here you could create a HUGE variety of base starting points for a unique looking face.   Also there was an "age" slider as well as a general height slider.   

These macro editing tools really help you create a unique looking base body and face for your character creation efforts to start from in less than a minute. 


2) Lack of distinct head mesh presets, nose or mouth types - the various different "presets" in the face editor are basically the starting preset with some very minor tweaks.  These should be DRASTICALLY different looking with completely different facial structure.   If you look at even just vanilla skyrim they have a very limited pallet of options to change or sculpt the face yet their presets vary tremendously from each other in comparison to BDO's.   For instance in skyrim 1 preset looks young and attractive, the next is very old and grizzly, the next looks like a dirty sad pauper,  the next looks like a fierce strong jawed warrior, the one after that a shady tattoed bandit etc.  

BDO doesn't even necessarily need to have additional meshes for the nose and eyes and mouth because their facial tweaking nodes are so powerful and could potentially get away with just different node settings, but I would highly recommend 8 or so completely different head meshes with drastically different bone structures and then various presets for the rest of the nodes.  However if you TRULY wanted to be the most amazing and expansive Character Creator out there.  Having like 5-10 drastically different mouth, nose and eye meshes to pair with the various head meshes would make the system that much more expansive (this could be handled load/processing wise if BDO used unified body meshes... see point 3).  1 way to handle it is have "racial and age presets"  I.E.  Black/African American/ Caucasion anglo-saxon/ hispanic/ Native American and Asian.  Perhaps having a completely different head mesh for "elderly" characters in each of those race categories with deep wrinkles in the mesh like how it is with the "wizard" class.

From there you could have a macro slider system for face roundness, Pronounced bone structure (square jawline pronounced cheekbones, thinness/angular and age. 

3) Needs unified body meshes -  One of the BIG limiting factors is the fact that each class has a separate body mesh.  This is both extremely limiting and very inefficient.  If all classes with the same or similar race used the same body mesh but with much greater flexibility you would not only exponentially increase the potential and posibilities of your character creator but also optimize the game because you'd be loading only 3 meshes  (Human/Elf Male,  Human/Elf Female, Giant) vs 12 different meshes (Berserker, Blader, Kunoichi, Ninja, Plum, Ranger, Sorceress, Tamer, Valkyrie, Warrior, witch, Wizard).   Also at first glance it looks like you have a tremendous amount of control over the body mesh even down to the fingers, but because of the separate meshes it was very limited and the range of theses sliders were also quite limiting.   I actually found that I had more (or I should say more effective) nodes/sliders I could edit in ESO than I do in BDO.    Sure you can edit all the way down to the individual fingers in BDO but no one really cares about that.  However in ESO you could adjust both the upper and lower thigh thus allowing you to create various types of legs both muscular and thin or fat.   In BDO when you edit the thigh it only has one node and if you make it bigger your leg just ends up looking fat.  You can't make a muscular body builder style leg because the lower thigh is always thinner than the upper thigh and the knee fattens up when you scale up the thigh and the calf.   That's just one example I can think of.   At the end of the Day while ESO might have had less sliders, they were more effective. 

If BDO had unified meshes with much greater min/max slider values for the various nodes and maybe a few additional sliders for some of the nodes to make them more effective  you would not only open up a whole new world of customization for players (young wizards, lean grizzled veteran warriors, old hag witches and tall non-loli tamers!) but also reduce the processing load on your servers by having 9 fewer body meshes in the game. 

4) Unlock hairtypes for all classes and add a few more hairstyles - Unlocking the hairstyles for all non Giant male or female character classes would be such a small change that would make such a big difference without adding any additional polygons to the game.  Hairstyles effect the general look of your character so drastically that by expanding the number of hairstyles available to each class by unlocking them and adding 10-20 more (even if its through the cash shop) would make such a HUGE difference in customization.  That alone would make the players in the game actually look different from each other. 

5) Add Scars and body marks to both the face and body similar to tattoos and unlock and expand the tattoos for all classes.  Many people really like having scars and body marks to separate themselves from the crowd.  It's a small detail but doing these little things would also make a big difference to a lot of people.  I also recommend checking out the way Archeage and ESO handle scar placement/editing as you can resize, rotate and place scars in a very customizable way in both games.  


These 5 suggestions would take the BDO character creator from a somewhat Limited character creator with a high learning curve and a lot of unlocked potential to the most amazing character creator the gaming community has ever seen.  

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Posted

I do agree with Khurgen. I'm from the guy who don't really like to play bimbos neither brainless giant or old man.

It just feel like another class is missing as a male ranger. And also for the Wizard, normal or younger male. Why do i have to play gandalt if i wanna go magic? I can understand for the Giant at least.

I agree to a lot of choices on BDO but not this lock gender and appearence... Making a so complete customization character to just put limits is a waste.

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Posted

I would like it if I could create an average looking male character for the male-locked classes.  After reading how wonderful character creation was in BDO I was excited thinking about how this game could let me come closer to my visions for these characters than any games before it.   But then I got in and found that not only are there only 3 classes that can even have male characters, but none of those classes support even a close to normal, average looking human male.  I can be some kind of giant ogre beserker, some ridiculous looking square-jawed beefy man beefcake McMuscles, or Gandalf.

I've spent hours fiddling with these 3 possibilities, and the closest to an actual human being I can build is from the wizard.  If you mask the wrinkly face under facial hair & eyeliner you can kind of get to a 50 year old average looking guy.  Well, maybe closer to 60.

I understand why they would give 4 female classes that can all be tweaked into attractive young women, I like playing as the pretty ladies sometimes myself.  These guys know their market.  But for those of us males that want to have a main that is our own gender we are severely limited.

If they really believe that their game is more fun to play because of their restrictions, I guess there is nothing to be done.  But if they are willing to give a little leeway, I'd like to see the ability to make a warrior and/or beserker with an average male body shape, and wizards that can be any age down to young adult (in their 20s).

Damn, this is going to suck. I knew there would be something bad to BDO. I was so hoping for the best game ever, from the youtube's I've been watching. It already sucked to have gender lock in the first place, only f2p players don't care about what gender they play because they are not vested in a game, people who pay to play a game like to have more control over the basics. I mean come on! 3 male classes that sucks, and of those they are old men and a beefcake. This sucks.

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Posted

His complaint was age and square jaw.  Both are addressed on BDOTemplates.  Muscles can be hidden and dealt with too.  Take a look and spend some time in the CC.

I have in fact been to your website and looked through all the interesting templates yet there hasn't been one that looks like an average young adult male for warriors while still maintaining a natural appearance.  Yes the details are amazing in the CC I myself have spent hours on it since testing phases, but they are still limited and leave the character looking squished or formed oddly.

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Posted

My warrior looks like 50 years old... Though i was sad, male characters cant customize their hair the way females can... :( Other than that, there is quite a lot to choose from...

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Posted

I'm glad there are more people talking about this.
I played around a bit with the character creator while it was available, and I thought it was phenomenal...at least while I was making female characters. I was surprised how you could even drag around the hair, it was something I had never seen before on character customization. But then I went to the male characters...and I became very disappointed...the warriors really all look the same, no matter how much you try to change their faces, they still look like the generic macho man with a square jaw. And then I became even more disappointed when it came to hairstyles, I don't remember exactly how many there were, but I believe it was around 5/6? And you couldn't shorten it or drag it or anything really that you could do with the females...why? I see this on almost every MMO I've played, developers give more attention to female characters and don't bother to optimize the male ones. It really makes me upset because I prefer to play with male characters, and I feel like with this lack of options all the warriors in the game will end up looking all the same, with their square jaws and macho-ness. I'm really interested in this game, but the lack of male customization really puts me off...

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Posted

^this +1 to the post

 

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Posted

Damn, this is going to suck. I knew there would be something bad to BDO. I was so hoping for the best game ever, from the youtube's I've been watching. It already sucked to have gender lock in the first place, only f2p players don't care about what gender they play because they are not vested in a game, people who pay to play a game like to have more control over the basics. I mean come on! 3 male classes that sucks, and of those they are old men and a beefcake. This sucks.

ill tell you a story. When i launched Tom Clancy's The Division and started creating my character i wanted to make a sexy girl agent so id have something nice to look at while playing. But every female id make ended up looking like ellen degeneres. a butch lesbian. SOOOOOOOOOO, i said screw it and i made a black guy. So lesson of the story is; when in doubt make a black guy.

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Posted (edited)

um...

Edited by userOnline

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Posted

Well, I am also very pleased that people are talking about this on the forums; so +1 :)

I totally agree with Khurgen about it being difficult to generate an "average" male character and SkullMonkey definitely has a good point about the whole character generator- 

(Still hoping for a mage-like achetype class that's young/er and male  ^_^)

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Posted

Do you consider this guy:

blader.thumb.jpg.b04d451abb30b71ff313970

or this guy to be normal looking?

ninja_male.thumb.jpg.5e18725dec30133ce75

Cause these classes have already been released in Korea, it's just a matter of time before they make it over to the west.

Yeah in fact I am waiting for these 2 classes to release.
Meanwhile I will stick with my Warrior, though I really wanted to play a Ranger, but I don't play Female characters or old geezers in games.
If I want to see a pair of tits I check Youporn, much easier and more satisfying.


 

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