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BDO is NOT a PvP game...


51 posts in this topic

Posted

The problem is, without a system like this, the PvE people end up complaining about PvP people. If the system remains in place, the PvP people dislike it and the PvE people are fine with it... urg. An endless cycle.

which is why you add benefits to being good at being a criminal. In this game there seems to be a huge emphasis as though life is completely over when you kill that guy. In real life, being good at criminality has it's own risks and benefits, just like being good at fair play.

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Posted

which is why you add benefits to being good at being a criminal. In this game there seems to be a huge emphasis as though life is completely over when you kill that guy. In real life, being good at criminality has it's own risks and benefits, just like being good at fair play.

That's what I'm saying though. Even if you do that, PvE people begin to cry out, saying that they are encouraging people to PK them. It's ridiculous.

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Posted

Damn this is boring. K.

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Posted

That's what I'm saying though. Even if you do that, PvE people begin to cry out, saying that they are encouraging people to PK them. It's ridiculous.

It's the internet.

Do plan A people complain
Do plan B people complain
Do nothing people complain

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Posted

It's the internet.
Do plan A people complain
Do plan B people complain
Do nothing people complain

Yes, it's why I've told a certain person that I speak to, that it's impossible to please everyone.

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Posted

Yes, it's why I've told a certain person that I speak to, that it's impossible to please everyone.

"You can't please all of the people all of the time.
Last night, all of the people were at my show." -Mitch Hedburg

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Posted

This flagging nonsense nearly copy-pasted from L2 (in the most primitive form imaginable), and that game had the very same issues.
 ITOW forget about using PvP to defend/fight for anything PvE related. Don't expect any fix either.

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Posted

That's what I'm saying though. Even if you do that, PvE people begin to cry out, saying that they are encouraging people to PK them. It's ridiculous.

the thing is I would agree with how things are, if this game wasn't advertised as that PvPvE sandbox game. At this point right now, PvP is really being punished, and this game has little to no PvE content worth talking about, even in the future. If the PvP is taboo, and the PvE is weak, what's there to really look for, except this monolithic Guild grind, where your only form of entertainment is rewarding PvP through seige and node/guild wars

Like if you PvP, sure you may pick up a few items, but you also lose/affect the core functions of the game(enchanting, buying, trading, safety in the city) for being a criminal. That's realistic. But then you don't gain a system where you have your own facilities (illegal trades, strong black market, gang life, control over the city). That's unrealistic.

You should also get that benefit of catching criminals, which isn't really rewarded(unless stealing from a dead person is considered saintly), much like the bounty system with pending implementation. 

Right now the game is just a game where you can't really PvP, and PvE is very very weak.

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Posted

This game was unfortunately half thought out, the abysmally bad PvE tagging system lets rotten selfish casters to run past you drop a bomb on your mobs and steal all your kills. Who's genius idea was it to allow this shit? Allowing KS like that is insanity. 

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Posted

savage.

inb4 that's him

Lol!

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Posted (edited)

I feel yeah man. I experimented with going prone and sneaking up on people and killed them. They respawned back and rushed me, I'm only at -320k and it's a big pain. Really think they should cap it at like 300k to -200k, allowing you to pvp but not too much. And without the extended, extended downtime afterwards. A little PvP never hurt anyone ;)

Also, I'm pretty sure negative karma messes with your PvP permissions. If I have negative, I can't seem to attack anyone else, even with PvP toggled. They're invincible to me while I'm negative karma. Or maybe they need to attack me first? Dunno. Also, can't seem to understand which mobs drop karma best.

Died to elite mobs just a minute ago and my boots went from rank 9 to rank 8 :/  hahaha wow yeah, its a bit much.

Edited by oZZie

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Posted

This is mostly a copy of my post back in the bounty thread in that I felt it was a more meaningful system.

 

So weighing in a bit (with only playing a bit of CBT1, and videos), from my understanding from a design point, the biggest issue is that we want to reward meaningful objective based PVP and discourage griefing primarily.  However we also want to ensure that money stays a closed loop.  So the question becomes what can be a suitable reward in lieu of silver.  

 

My current proposition is Territory itself, basically what I mean is some kind of item or a long cooldown ability, would allow you to declare a spot for you and your group, and all monsters within the area become untaggable (can't be used on bosses/minions etc) for anyone outside of your group.  However you yourself become flagged for pvp and if killed ownership transfers (maybe with a penalty as harsh as you can't attemp to reclaim the territory until xx minutes has passed).  If you keep it long maybe a possibility of increasing the borders like Civ 5.

 

I feel this is a good concept though would need added tech and systems.  Since it highlights one of the biggest reasons besides griefing and that is to get people out of your farm spot.  This changes the concept from fighting as an act of aggression, to one of defending of territory small scale.

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Posted

Is the only option to find an area and grind for days to lose the karma now? It's not possible to find an area to grind that is empty afaik.

Guild mate has the same thing happen to him, he ground for over 8 hours on skeletons and is still red..... he did a good thing though, people tried to kill him and he would tell them they had to flag to fight him, some did and he wiped them out lol.

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Posted (edited)

You decided to genocide a group of people and your Karma went negative.

And then they say I don't know how this game works...

 

 

If you Genocide...

...you're gonna have a bad time.

 

537274165_preview_Sans.PNG

Edited by Grevier
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Posted

This is mostly a copy of my post back in the bounty thread in that I felt it was a more meaningful system.

 

So weighing in a bit (with only playing a bit of CBT1, and videos), from my understanding from a design point, the biggest issue is that we want to reward meaningful objective based PVP and discourage griefing primarily.  However we also want to ensure that money stays a closed loop.  So the question becomes what can be a suitable reward in lieu of silver.  

 

My current proposition is Territory itself, basically what I mean is some kind of item or a long cooldown ability, would allow you to declare a spot for you and your group, and all monsters within the area become untaggable (can't be used on bosses/minions etc) for anyone outside of your group.  However you yourself become flagged for pvp and if killed ownership transfers (maybe with a penalty as harsh as you can't attemp to reclaim the territory until xx minutes has passed).  If you keep it long maybe a possibility of increasing the borders like Civ 5.

 

I feel this is a good concept though would need added tech and systems.  Since it highlights one of the biggest reasons besides griefing and that is to get people out of your farm spot.  This changes the concept from fighting as an act of aggression, to one of defending of territory small scale.

The current system needs a degrade timer, so much of the negative degrades over a long period of time.  As it is now it is really steap for someone that isnt a flaming pker.

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Posted

Well this was a thread. 

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Posted

Why do people make such childish comments when someone's voicing a negative aspect of the game.

You seriously can't say what he described happen promotes good PvP, it's obvious the only "successful" way to PvP is GvG without major punishment and that's a flaw right there.

It does promote good PvP. The OP is complaining because what he wanted to do came with penalties. He PK'ed others and it has consequences. It's his own fault for being ignorant of the rules. Tell me why so many people think they should be allowed to PK freely without restriction, because that is not PvP. If the players he killed wanted PvP, they'd have been flagged and he could have battled them safely. The OP attacked players who weren't flagged and suffered the consequences. 

All the OP had to do was declare a war on the group, instead he PKed them. The game has rules and systems in place to allow what the OPer wanted, apparently that's too complicated for some.

The only real hole in the system is players without guilds, but hopefully that gets addressed as more of a bug at some point.

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Posted (edited)

Just because you can kill someone doesn't make the game a PVP intensive game. It's a sandbox game, you can do whatever you want, some things have repercussions, such as OW PvP. Hence KR does not have PKers, because you lose more than what you could gain, you can still do it though. Your choice.

Edited by Yamiino

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Posted (edited)

Too many carebears and pve'rs in the game, go get strong get good and u can kill anyone u want anytime. ;)

Edited by Kakkoii

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Posted

PVP is a 'PART' of this game, it is NOT a PVP game....do your research before playing any games

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Posted

First off this is just a factual account of events of how "PvP" works in BDO and it is a horrible system, here is why.

I am a level 51 Wizard and I was grinding catfish in my own little spot sharing if needed as long as other people wouldn't intentionally KS me. Well today a group decides they want to take over the spot and after maybe 15 minutes of this I get tired of it and wipe them out. I lose 250,000+ karma for doing this. They immediately respawn at the node, call for help from their guild and instead of being 5v1 it is now 9v1 and 4 have ghillie suits. I continue to fight and here's where it starts to get bad. I am not flagged for PvP but they flag to attack me so I have to turn it on to fight back, for some reason it will not allow you to fight back unless you also flag, so I die a few times and they die a few times and I realize my karma is now -300,000+ and I have lost ALL of the gems in my equipment and about 20% of my current experience gained. I decide this is futile and move to the Mediah Castle. On my way I get attacked by guards everywhere so I can't really use any shops easily. I get to the castle to grind and there is another person from the guild I was fighting and they attack me, they die. They keep zerging and keep dying. Every time I killed them I lost karma and I am now at -800,000 karma. Every time I died I lost 2% of my current experience total and ALL of the new gems I put in my gear. So where is the PvP if the penalties are so steep that you can not actually PvP unless it is a guild war? You can not defend a grind spot you're in and the only way to truly PvP is if you're attacked by someone then you can flag and fight back? This is by far the worst system I have ever seen and for this I think the game will die quickly which is unfortunate because I thought it was a fantastic game.

Just wait until Valencia desert is out.. thats like a Pkers haven and nobody loses exp to pkers in the desert (though your gems will still break)

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Posted

Alright, I gotta throw this out there. The past 3 days have been full of really good PvP for me and this seems like a good enough place to put it.

First things first, I'd like to mention the Arena system, in which brawls and duels can happen freely without restriction. They seem rather popular (at least on Orwen) and I was able to spend many hours with my guildies and random strangers dueling, discussing skill combos and more right outside the main city.

Second, I had an experience just like the OP's with a key main difference: I stopped when my Karma had only hit -9000. So I was farming in a certain area, and some other guy was annoyed that I was there. There where only 2-4 of us there, and before he came along we where all sharing mobs just fine, with plenty for all. So he started attempting to take my mobs whenever I went for a group. Gave him a couple warnings. He kept at it. I decided, fine, you're dead. He died. PvP'd him a couple times until he got some other guy that was farming in a party to kill me with him. 2v1 and I screwed up my skills >.>; Anyway, my guildie was farming nearby. I hit him up and we 2v2'd for a while (pretty much dominated them after that. He was very-undergeared and we where the same class.) I was keeping track of my karma, and once I hit negative (barely) and decided "no-more." Talked to the guy I was PvP'ing and even though we where pissed at each other at the start we ended up having a TON of fun by the end. I took off all my gear and was talking to some friends in the small town nearby. Got killed a few times, but my gear and important drops where in my cart and I didn't mind the EXP loss. Made a few friends in town as a red player LOL. Anyway, I went back to farming the spot and the guy I PvP'd let me get back to Positive after I talked with him in town. It took about 15 minutes to farm the 9k karma

Last story, happened last night. Guild and I where doing a subjugation mission. Not a lot of where 45 yet, so we had our 5-6 45+'s there and a bunch of lower levels. One of the officers got murdered by a member of <GeT_OuT>. I assume we where doing the same mission as them. We put the mission on hold temporarily and decided to start a Guild War. Once initiated, their guild got a few of their members together and ours did as well. I was the only geared 50 in our guild then, so I was required in order to finalize kills. They beat us in kills cuz we had some really undergeared players, and one player was bait for 30 minutes so we could finish the Subjugation Mission on time, but when I was there fights were pretty even. In all, it was a pretty small scale war without the consequences of Karma or item punishments. Everyone who could participate had a ton of fun and it was a couple hours of almost nothing but PvP. It ended with a good-natured shout-out to the opposing guild on Channel. Lots of fun for everyone.

This happened in the past 3 days. In a row. It's all about how you play the game. What OP did was essentially screw himself over. I'm sorry, but that's all there is to say about how "BDO is not a PvP game."

It is if you make it one and don't do stupid shit. Besides, they're working on getting a new Karma system in place. If you read the CBT-2 notes, there are actually 4 tiers of Karma in their code now.

  • -1,000,000 to -500,000
  • -499,999 to 0
  • 1 to 149,999
  • 150,000 to 300,000

They're getting closer. Just don't screw yourself until then.

 

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Posted

I believe you are right, this is the worst feature in MMO history. There can't possibly be a worse PvP feature in any MMO ever!

Why?

It's like this:

The players are dumb. You don't understand that you are NOT supposed to assault anyone in the open world no matter what. If you do, you get heavily punished for it, in fact, your character gets pretty much destroyed by negative karma. It is simply not an option, the game is trying to tell you it's not an option by destroying your character, when you do it.

What this system is supposed to do is allowing open world PvP between consenting parties who flagged themselves for it.

But why does it allow you to attack a player who is not flagged? Obviously, real life allows you to attack anyone, you just go to jail for it. So maybe the devs thought it should be the same in-game. Bad choice. 

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Posted

dude. OP. learn to use paragraphs.

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Posted

First off this is just a factual account of events of how "PvP" works in BDO and it is a horrible system, here is why.

I am a level 51 Wizard and I was grinding catfish in my own little spot sharing if needed as long as other people wouldn't intentionally KS me. Well today a group decides they want to take over the spot and after maybe 15 minutes of this I get tired of it and wipe them out. I lose 250,000+ karma for doing this. They immediately respawn at the node, call for help from their guild and instead of being 5v1 it is now 9v1 and 4 have ghillie suits. I continue to fight and here's where it starts to get bad. I am not flagged for PvP but they flag to attack me so I have to turn it on to fight back, for some reason it will not allow you to fight back unless you also flag, so I die a few times and they die a few times and I realize my karma is now -300,000+ and I have lost ALL of the gems in my equipment and about 20% of my current experience gained. I decide this is futile and move to the Mediah Castle. On my way I get attacked by guards everywhere so I can't really use any shops easily. I get to the castle to grind and there is another person from the guild I was fighting and they attack me, they die. They keep zerging and keep dying. Every time I killed them I lost karma and I am now at -800,000 karma. Every time I died I lost 2% of my current experience total and ALL of the new gems I put in my gear. So where is the PvP if the penalties are so steep that you can not actually PvP unless it is a guild war? You can not defend a grind spot you're in and the only way to truly PvP is if you're attacked by someone then you can flag and fight back? This is by far the worst system I have ever seen and for this I think the game will die quickly which is unfortunate because I thought it was a fantastic game.

giphy.gif

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