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Auction House Commission Fees


45 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Current state of in-game trading:

Presently BDO has no option for trading of game assets other than through a  global auction house, each major settlement in the game has at least 1 auctioneer.

Creation of an auction house listing has price fixing implemented with an upper and lower boundary value (I believe this to be determined from a multiple of the base silver value listed on the item description).

Each sale made through the auction house will incur two fees, the first is a 30% broker fee, the second is a 5% tax rate (payable to the guild or NPC faction in control of the area).

 

Resulting gameplay:

Margin trading becomes out of the question due to price fixing, there is a lower price boundary that once reach results in item queueing. You will have to wait for previously listed items to be sold or expire for your goods to be available for trade.

Buy to resell as a means of profiteering or for moving wealth outside of currency to protect it against inflation comes at a significant loss through the 30% broker fee.

Manufacturers of complex items which require multiple build components which must be sourced from other players results in MASSIVE tax accumulation on a product. In real world scenarios sales taxes on materials used in industry are reclaimed by manufacturers through tax returns, the sales tax is only applied on sale to the end-user.

 

How this is bad for the in-game economy:

Each of the above is an issue, "market PVP" is an interesting element in many MMO's, some players love it, others hate it. I am not one for market games but still consider it a worthy addition to the overall MMO gameplay.

Being unable to move wealth outside of a currency susceptible to inflation WHOLLY DUE TO AFK FISHING (don't get me started on this element of game design) means that any sod to join the game later than everyone else is likely to pay 2-3x as much silver for market items. This issue is hard to measure given the new state of the game but has been documented on the Korean version of the game. I link article here: http://www.inven.co.kr/board/powerbbs.php?come_idx=3584&l=18185 An annual interest of 11% through investment banking and the user still incurred a 10% loss!

In an industrial scenario where a manufacturer purchases materials to fabricate products and at each point of sale a 35% AH fee is incurred pricing spirals out of control. to make it simple here is a scenario I worked on:

 

Product: Farm Wagon Cover (all prices used reflective of Alustin server as of writing this message using lowest market values)

Required materials: Maple plywood *4, Iron Ingot *8, Flax Fabric *6, Blackstone Powder *22

Material cost breakdown (respectively): 9000*4, 7000*8, 11500*6, 1350*22 = 190 700

 Average listing price: 850 000

Value lost through taxation and fees:  66 745 from materials, 297 500 from final sale price, 364 245 overall

 

Thats ~43% of the total value of the product lost in AH fees. This does not include the cost of beer for labourers through gathering. The results are terrible on an economy and massive deterrent to anyone wishing to give industry a try. I dabbled in other MMO economies, this is by far the worst example of the reputable games available on the market right now.

 

Discuss and troll away as you wish...

**Edit for mandatory meme element**

z06uf.jpg

Edited by Yuuki_Konno
13 people like this

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Posted

well you got a pretty good point there

 

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Posted

No point in crafting to sell. Just craft for yourself and grind for money. I was super excited about crafting and economy in this game as this is the first MMORPG crafting system I've enjoyed. Very disappointed that the economic restrictions in place make it totally pointless.

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Posted

Well, the reason for the stupid amount of tax is simple, Daum has to money too right?

 

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Posted (edited)

They should just copy the trade system of EvE Online, that is without a doubt the most perfect economic system for any MMO.

The Communist economic system that Daum has adopted just doesn't work

Edited by ArgleBargle
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Posted

They should just copy the trade system of EvE Online, that is without a doubt the most perfect economic system for any MMO.

The Communist economic system that Daum has adopted just doesn't work

I have been playing EVE Online since 2006, for PVP aspects, namely Alliance Tournament, NEO and EVENT e-sports. I know there are market "things" and understand the basics but have little to no interest in being space rich. From my understanding EVE Online has full time economists hired by CCP to analyse the in-game economy, it's stability for a game that has been running since 2003 is testment to their successful design.

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Posted (edited)

I have been playing EVE Online since 2006, for PVP aspects, namely Alliance Tournament, NEO and EVENT e-sports. I know there are market "things" and understand the basics but have little to no interest in being space rich. From my understanding EVE Online has full time economists hired by CCP to analyse the in-game economy, it's stability for a game that has been running since 2003 is testment to their successful design.

Yep there's even been research papers done on the economy as a testament to its efficiency and fluidity on the macro and micro scale.

One thing in game that could be an improvement, is, as you level up your trade skill at certain milestones you could get a reduction in market tax, maybe a max of 20% at 5% increments ?

Edited by ArgleBargle

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Posted (edited)

Really bad system. More player freedom always means a better game.

Edited by Happoman

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Posted

Let's not allow trading in an MMORPG, rofl.

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Posted (edited)

if they had a system which allowed the AH to:

  • self adjust min/max prices based on median prices over the last 72 hours. 
  • MAKE THE AUCTION HOUSES LOCAL. 
  • reduce broker fees with "trading skill"
  • rent-able items like a "trade exemption/trade permit" (at great CP cost) for broker reduction

many of us bought this game for the open world, economy and crafting.

so far it is 100% on rails and you will eventually lose a good size of the player base until you only have afk fishers left.

Edited by Bubba

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Posted

if they had a system which allowed the AH to:

  • self adjust min/max prices based on median prices over the last 72 hours. 
  • MAKE THE AUCTION HOUSES LOCAL. 
  • reduce broker fees with "trading skill"
  • rent-able items like a "trade exemption/trade permit" (at great CP cost) for broker reduction

many of us bought this game for the open world, economy and crafting.

so far it is 100% on rails and you will eventually lose a good size of the player base until you only have afk fishers left.

I would enjoy having local markets, shopping around for the best deal has a sense of fulfilment and will also open up player trading across regional markets moving goods from one area to another.

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Posted

No point in crafting to sell. Just craft for yourself and grind for money. I was super excited about crafting and economy in this game as this is the first MMORPG crafting system I've enjoyed. Very disappointed that the economic restrictions in place make it totally pointless.

Beer crafting is best crafting.

JK, the taxes really bite the market/crafting aspects of the game hard. Especially when it's in a town that isn't even owned by anyone :/

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Posted

They should just copy the trade system of EvE Online, that is without a doubt the most perfect economic system for any MMO.

The Communist economic system that Daum has adopted just doesn't work

So you want your gear/inventory to break when you die? 

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Posted

So you want your gear/inventory to break when you die? 

It does... an outlaw can drop their gear on death :P

Everyone else may experience loss of crystals on death, it is a decent money sink if they do it right.

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So you want your gear/inventory to break when you die? 

Well if the game wasn't gear dependent then yes, but there's no reason it cannot be applied to consumables and items that decay over time already within the game

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It does... an outlaw can drop their gear on death :P

Everyone else may experience loss of crystals on death, it is a decent money sink if they do it right.

Only idiots go outlaw. Crystals are very different than gear and way cheaper. There is no risk/reward system that would allow an EVE like economy. The world is way way too small too. The game would be very interesting with an EVE like world (10% safe area that's the current map, 90% FFA that is guild owned and highly profitable, 0 channels, 1 server, build cities/towns/keeps to control/tax) One could only wish.

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Posted

Actually, the way they have it like this is because in KR you could buy a "premium pack" that cut down the AH price cut.  Our version doesn;t have this however, though I'm not sure why they haven't changed it.  Maybe they just forgot it.

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Posted

The problem is that we have Rick from Pawn Stars running the AH... He's got overhead, it's just going to sit in inventory, got to get your item restored...

 

tmp_11209-images(8)-472448469.thumb.jpeg

 

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Posted (edited)

Honestly I am a bit disappointed in the market system right now. As it stands it's almost impossible to sell certain items so I end up just vendoring them. When you have something like 50 sold historically and 5000+ currently queued for sale... yea no thanks.

Edited by HeavensSword

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Posted

Current state of in-game trading:

Presently BDO has no option for trading of game assets other than through a  global auction house, each major settlement in the game has at least 1 auctioneer.

Creation of an auction house listing has price fixing implemented with an upper and lower boundary value (I believe this to be determined from a multiple of the base silver value listed on the item description).

Each sale made through the auction house will incur two fees, the first is a 30% broker fee, the second is a 5% tax rate (payable to the guild or NPC faction in control of the area).

 

Resulting gameplay:

Margin trading becomes out of the question due to price fixing, there is a lower price boundary that once reach results in item queueing. You will have to wait for previously listed items to be sold or expire for your goods to be available for trade.

Buy to resell as a means of profiteering or for moving wealth outside of currency to protect it against inflation comes at a significant loss through the 30% broker fee.

Manufacturers of complex items which require multiple build components which must be sourced from other players results in MASSIVE tax accumulation on a product. In real world scenarios sales taxes on materials used in industry are reclaimed by manufacturers through tax returns, the sales tax is only applied on sale to the end-user.

 

How this is bad for the in-game economy:

Each of the above is an issue, "market PVP" is an interesting element in many MMO's, some players love it, others hate it. I am not one for market games but still consider it a worthy addition to the overall MMO gameplay.

Being unable to move wealth outside of a currency susceptible to inflation WHOLLY DUE TO AFK FISHING (don't get me started on this element of game design) means that any sod to join the game later than everyone else is likely to pay 2-3x as much silver for market items. This issue is hard to measure given the new state of the game but has been documented on the Korean version of the game. I link article here: http://www.inven.co.kr/board/powerbbs.php?come_idx=3584&l=18185 An annual interest of 11% through investment banking and the user still incurred a 10% loss!

In an industrial scenario where a manufacturer purchases materials to fabricate products and at each point of sale a 35% AH fee is incurred pricing spirals out of control. to make it simple here is a scenario I worked on:

 

Product: Farm Wagon Cover (all prices used reflective of Alustin server as of writing this message using lowest market values)

Required materials: Maple plywood *4, Iron Ingot *8, Flax Fabric *6, Blackstone Powder *22

Material cost breakdown (respectively): 9000*4, 7000*8, 11500*6, 1350*22 = 190 700

 Average listing price: 850 000

Value lost through taxation and fees:  66 745 from materials, 297 500 from final sale price, 364 245 overall

 

Thats ~43% of the total value of the product lost in AH fees. This does not include the cost of beer for labourers through gathering. The results are terrible on an economy and massive deterrent to anyone wishing to give industry a try. I dabbled in other MMO economies, this is by far the worst example of the reputable games available on the market right now.

 

Discuss and troll away as you wish...

**Edit for mandatory meme element**

z06uf.jpg

I have 4 workers just getting wheat.
I have more wheat than I can process into beers with 3 characters.
the beer feeds those 4 workers so they can keep going .
I sell extra beer . 1316 gold each , in pack of 200.

I MAKE ALOT OF PROFIT .

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Posted

When people care for a game economy more then the real life world economy.

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Posted

When people care for a game economy more then the real life world economy.

they don'T have real life economy they are all on welfare !!
that's why they can't get how bdo economy works. they failed IRL.

-buy ALL mats from auction house to craft a wagon
- sell wagon in auction house , lose money.

no shit sherlock.
hire workers get your mats FREE craft it.
= PROFIT , wow surprise !

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Posted

they don'T have real life economy they are all on welfare !!that's why they can't get how bdo economy works. they failed IRL.

-buy ALL mats from auction house to craft a wagon
- sell wagon in auction house , lose money.

no shit sherlock.
hire workers get your mats FREE craft it.
= PROFIT , wow surprise !

Very few real world manufacturers in the automotive, electronic or even craft industries own their supply chains. Do you believe Honda owns the steel mines in Argentina or that a carpenter owns the forest from which his trees were cut? No, they source them from suppliers. That was a pretty half-arsed attempt at trolling.

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Posted

Very few real world manufacturers in the automotive, electronic or even craft industries own their supply chains. Do you believe Honda owns the steel mines in Argentina or that a carpenter owns the forest from which his trees were cut? No, they source them from suppliers. That was a pretty half-arsed attempt at trolling.

SO BECAUSE IT WORKS THIS WAY , BDO MUST WORKS THIS WAY, YOU ASSUMED IT THIS WAY.
WELL I TELL YOU THIS. IF YOU BUY EVERY MATS FROM AUCTION HOUSE TO CRAFT THINGS YOU WILL ALWAYS MAKE A LOSS.
thank you.

learn bdo basics.

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Posted

I am a high-end cooker in my server

It is possible to make money from cooking but the market tax of 40%+ is really disheartening.

Most of the food I make cost more to make then to sell.

So I am pretty much only getting cook experience for spending all my energy and time.

I really hope they lower the taxation by at least 10%, so it doesn't feel as punishing to cook/craft for players.

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