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BDO Not Actually True Action Combat!!!!


89 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Ok, after playing, following, and reading about Black Desert Online for a while now I came to learn that BDO has RNG (Random Number Generator) in the game. 

I guess in the game, characters, specifically the warriors and beserkers need this thing called Accuracy. This means that even though you literally attacked and directly and clearly hit the enemy, it takes NO damage because your stats is missing accuracy (In other words, you missed, and is completely generated randomly by the game in a percentage form depending on your gear stats. You can apply gear with accuracy stats or You need to gain Accuracy by enchanting your characters armors, whether it's his sword, shield, etc. Once you successfully boost up your accuracy stats, you will now have a higher percentage rate.

On top of that, they have another RNG called Evade. Meaning that, again, even though you clearly hit your enemy dead on, RNG causes your attack to randomly miss by allowing the opponent to supposedly Evade your attack, even though they are standing completely still.

 

This Needs to be REVISED from NO damage to less damage. This game has sooo much evading and agile mechanics, and systems like RNG ruins real action gameplay, where PVP or even PVE is solely based on the players skills and nothing to do with the game system randomizing when you hit the enemy or not and randomizing when the enemy dodges your attacks when they are standing completely still but supposedly dodged your move.

 

Please let me know your thoughts as I feel like this needs to be brought to Daum's attention! I will be highly disappinted with this game if these stats where not revised. 

I understand this also effects CCs and Stuns, Knockdowns, etc. but i didnt bring these up because it doesnt bother me the only thing that bother me is taking no damage.

Edited by Henry
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Posted

Completely agree.

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Posted

I mentioned that allready in another thread an ill repeat that here too.

They need to balance potions and dodging in general. As for potions, they have a way too high impact on the pvp balance.

 

The focus needs to get more into the dodge and block system. Let the people be rewarded by dodge in time and  dont give them endless dodging skills or the opportunity to pot without cooldown (Sorcerer *cough*)

Tera and Blade and Soul are good examples on the battle system in this (!) case. The potencial  is there.

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Posted

Tera has healers. Blade and soul is honestly instanced to hell and can not even be compared to this game.

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Posted

Tera has healers. Blade and soul is honestly instanced to hell and can not even be compared to this game.

Your argument is that since Blade & Soul has instances, accuracy/evasion stat being used instead of focusing entirely on dodging in BDO is a good thing? I don't think the poster above you was suggesting that Tera and Blade & Soul were just like Black Desert. However, I wouldn't say it's wrong to say those games have better PvP and PvP balance. Whether or not the game is open world has no bearing on how good the combat system is. If you want to only compare 100% pure open world games, and say hey, this game's combat is better than all those other games that don't actually hardly exist, then great. Personally, I'd want to aim a little higher, because BDO's combat should devastate the aforementioned games, no contest.

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Posted

There is plenty of gear and stat bonuses on abilities that this isn't an issue when it matters. The system in place is very good and does not need to be changed. 

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Posted

i agree, please remove the RNG factor into this, this is a reason why so many other so called PvP games failed, WoW is pleaged my this and even one of my more played games of recent years, Archeage, nothing makes you flip out more then attacking someone from the back thats SLEEPING ONLY to see Miss.

Miss.
Miss.
Miss.

The dude is sleeping, how the F did i even....AM I BLIND!?!?

 

 

This is why i liked Tera so much
This game has so much potential, i dont mind this in PvE as i dont notice it much, but please dont let this be a thing in PvP

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Posted

Thank you guys for agreeing and I hope that PM_Jouska or any of the PMs see's our concerns.

I would also like to add,

That even if completely removing this terrible system is not possible or considered, for goodness sake! at least make it so damage is caused no matter what, even if that damage is at the LEAST-1 DAMAGE (And I say that with a grain of salt). Making it causing no damage at all feels very unrealistic and makes me feel like I the player am not in control of the fight but am a slave to the game. 

I say this for Evade and Accuracy.

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Posted

If they can't remove it, they could simply change it to affect criticals.

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Posted

Immune simply means that the enemy/boss is immune against CC effects. A miss is nothing, no wording or anything, only the sound is slightly different.

If we want RNG stats to begone, CC resist would have to be removed as well. That should also lead to changes in skills as AoE's and such with a 100% chance to hit is a bit too much. I doubt they're gonna do that.

Speaking about Evasion, which obviously exist due to its equivalent stat, is there any class besides Sorceress who can actually utilize it? Ranger 100% rage absorbtion gives +30 Evasion, but I doubt this is of any use. Speaking about similiar levels of course and not lv30 vs lv60.

And by removing those stats they would only simplify the gear system even more as two stats (or more with CC resist) would need to be removed. Though not like it is all about Atk anyway already.

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Posted (edited)

Immune is just towards negative status effects you still take damage if you get hit. Evasion and accuracy is there because there is no level requirements to use any type of gear that isnt class specific.  While it isnt entirely  rng,  it makes sense that a % chance to dmg your opponent if you are weaker in a game aspect ,don't want people with lvl 30 alts wrecking you cuz thier gear is better. Those stats make levels matter. 

Edited by Varna
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Posted

Accuracy is annoying but this is a terrible title.

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Posted (edited)

RNG does turn this into a less-than-pure action-mode game; this is true.
Have you considered the effects of making all CCs 100% upon landing, or every hit never missing?

>If an attacker landed a single control skill on an opponent, they would essentially have won the fight because they could keep chaining CCs together without ending their stunlock, unless
>An escape skill would have to be implemented for every single class
>CC skills would lose the possibility of being balance-adjusted by nerfing their success rate (think Tamer grab prior to nerf)

>Damage between all players would be increased

How would you take these - and other - effects into account?

Edited by Absolute
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Posted

Like I had mentioned, I know it is very unlickely that this can and will be removed due to other factors already in the game, however, i don't agree with either you or the opposing player taking or giving no damage when i clwaely hit my opponent, due to evasion and accuracy through RNG. At least make dame decreased greatly but not completely removed. And my argument has only to do with damage output/input, i dont mind accuracy or avasion affecting criticals or stuns.

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Posted

RNG does turn this into a less-than-pure action-mode game; this is true.
Have you considered the effects of making all CCs 100% upon landing, or every hit never missing?

>If an attacker landed a single control skill on an opponent, they would essentially have won the fight because they could keep chaining CCs together without ending their stunlock, unless
>An escape skill would have to be implemented for every single class
>CC skills would lose the possibility of being balance-adjusted by nerfing their success rate (think Tamer grab prior to nerf)

>Damage between all players would be increased

How would you take these - and other - effects into account?

I totally agree with the fact that they have to rebalance (atleast) the evasion and accuracy thing.

To reply to you you are totally right in fact i would really like to see some anti cc + a cc break skill (like aion idk it's the first that come to my mind "remove shock") this would take the pvp totally on another level making it really competitive and less "luck based" because you say about "someone stunlocking you to death" ok that's bad(it's not but that's point of view) isn't it the same if you cast your cc and the enemy too but rngesus decide to bless your enemy instead of you and you die 1 comboed? isn't it even more frustrating? The system of 100% land cc is in TERA game that i played for ages and i can say that you can get used to it and with practice you can finish a duel without taking any dmg if you are good enought. Idk i would really like to see those stats totally removed  but that's my opinion tho.

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Posted

I totally agree with the fact that they have to rebalance (atleast) the evasion and accuracy thing.

To reply to you you are totally right in fact i would really like to see some anti cc + a cc break skill (like aion idk it's the first that come to my mind "remove shock") this would take the pvp totally on another level making it really competitive and less "luck based" because you say about "someone stunlocking you to death" ok that's bad(it's not but that's point of view) isn't it the same if you cast your cc and the enemy too but rngesus decide to bless your enemy instead of you and you die 1 comboed? isn't it even more frustrating? The system of 100% land cc is in TERA game that i played for ages and i can say that you can get used to it and with practice you can finish a duel without taking any dmg if you are good enought. Idk i would really like to see those stats totally removed  but that's my opinion tho.

I have played both 100% CC games and RNG CC games at an experienced level. I do not find RNG CC gameplay to be any less skillful than 100% CC games. It's like playing poker - you may not like the hand you've been dealt, but you can still be good at using whatever you were given by chance. My last two points still stand. CC skills would lose a nerf method, and damage amongst all players would be increased.

By the way, I'm very sorry, but I had a lot of trouble following your train of thought. Can you use punctuation and appropriate syntax/semantics next time?...

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Posted

My thoughts on this generally are that it's still a Sandbox MMORPG- to an extent.

You don't like to miss? Just find a gear set that increases accuracy and if you don't need pure ACC mix 2 sets for what you need for your playstyle.

Keep in mind level also effects how much you'll miss. I'm sure it goes in reverse for a 60 vs a level 58. The 60 has better accuracy based on being 2 levels higher.

Don't expect to be level 20 vs a 50 and land 100% of your hits.

I'm fine with how it is, then again I'm used to RNG game mechanics and use the stats given to me to min/max gear stats to benefit from these disadvantages to a lesser extent.

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Posted

I have played both 100% CC games and RNG CC games at an experienced level. I do not find RNG CC gameplay to be any less skillful than 100% CC games. It's like playing poker - you may not like the hand you've been dealt, but you can still be good at using whatever you were given by chance. My last two points still stand. CC skills would lose a nerf method, and damage amongst all players would be increased.
By the way, I'm very sorry, but I had a lot of trouble following your train of thought. Can you use punctuation and appropriate syntax/semantics next time?...

I am really sorry but my language is not english so it's hard for me to do that. Gotta start again with the "sorry for my bad english" at the start of every post.

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Posted

I can't say about warrior or berserker, but on ranger if you miss there is no "immune." You simply do no damage with no indication of a miss whatsoever. Immune is when a cc ability fails. Could be different for the other classes, but that's for ranger.

Level plays a big factor in the game on evasion/defense and accuracy/ap.

Gear is also a huge factor. Accuracy keeps rangers from just stack critical hit and ap and doing even more insane dmg then they can do end game. Maybe for warrior/berserker it balances there defense capabilities. So you can't have such a defensive class with high ap.

I know not everyone likes it, but I enjoy theory crafting builds. It makes the game more fun when everyone is not just min/maxing ap 

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Posted

yes

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I can't say about warrior or berserker, but on ranger if you miss there is no "immune." You simply do no damage with no indication of a miss whatsoever. Immune is when a cc ability fails. Could be different for the other classes, but that's for ranger.

Level plays a big factor in the game on evasion/defense and accuracy/ap.

Gear is also a huge factor. Accuracy keeps rangers from just stack critical hit and ap and doing even more insane dmg then they can do end game. Maybe for warrior/berserker it balances there defense capabilities. So you can't have such a defensive class with high ap.

I know not everyone likes it, but I enjoy theory crafting builds. It makes the game more fun when everyone is not just min/maxing ap 

Exactly, if they removed the ACC stat that is pretty much what the game would be.

Who has more AP/Crit and kills faster.

I've already been doing Theory crafting on my class builds through calculators and the same goes for gear sets. Depending on what changes from now til launch.

(Also sorry to bring this up but:

12.1.2. Naming policy
The User shall not use on the Website, the Forums and in the Game character names, family names, guild names, clan names and/or nicknames that are:
Vulgar, abusive, hateful, racist, defamatory, threatening, pornographic or sexually orientated;
Referring to inappropriate parts of the human body or bodily functions;
Referring to drugs or illegal activities;
Related to the Nazi regime;
Related to political regimes or personalities involved or suspected of violation of human rights;
Promoting violence, ethnical or national hatred;
Impersonating an existing person;
Violating the intellectual or industrial rights of a third party, including trademarks.

UNLESS you actually are Taylor Swift. lol. Which I'm going to doubt that.)

 

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Posted

I cant believe that some people actually like the fact that the game determines evade or miss based on luck in a true action combat system. 

I know gear and  level effects this, but it ruins pvp. I was watching a video from Kinto in Yotube, "that1game" is his channel, and he's been playing black desert since Kr Cbt2. One of the things that he mentioned was how hard it is to find an even match because of how rare it is to find someone that is the same level or similar gear. 

He mentioned that in his fights he usually gets destroyed or he destroys the other player. I asked him what he thought about these 2 qualities of the game and he said that it's not that bad until you see yourself lose because of it. 

I would feel the same, and neither would i feel proud winning l knowing that realistically my opponrnt has way more hits on me but he can't manage because the game decided to make me supposedly "dodge" or make him "miss"

Accuracy and evade could stay but should only effect reduced damage, CC effects, stuns, or reduced defense and attack stats, but not completely negate my or my opponents attack. Thats just silly.

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Posted

The "Immune" float text doesn't mean your attack didn't land. It means the CC (Knockback, Knockdown, Stagger, Stun, Grapple) failed to land.

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Posted

I cant believe that some people actually like the fact that the game determines evade or miss based on luck in a true action combat system.

Maybe some people simply dont care about an MMO providing a proper competitive environment. If I want fair fights that put me and my opponent on an even footing, then I play a game that was designed for that. There are plenty of titles out there that make it possible for you to compare your ability to other people.

MMOs will never be proper competitive titles so its pretty damn stupid to expect developers to treat them as such. The whole process of gearing takes care of that. I think people like you simply are looking for the wrong thing in the wrong genre.

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Posted

Ok, after playing, following, and reading about Black Desert Online for a while now I came to learn that BDO has RNG (Random Number Generator) in the game. 

I guess in the game, characters, specifically the warriors and beserkers need this thing called Accuracy. If you've hit your opponent, you may have noticed the words "Immuned" pop-up over the enemy's head. This means that even though you literally attacked and directly and clearly hit the enemy, it takes no damage because your stats is missing accuracy (In other words, you missed, and is completely generated randomly by the game in a percentage form depending on your gear stats. You need to gain Accuracy by enchanting your characters armors, whether it's his sword, shield, etc. Once you successfully boost up your accuracy stats, you will now have a higher percentage rate, meaning that the "Immune" will happen much less. 

On top of that, they have another RNG called Evade. Meaning that, again, even though you clearly hit your enemy dead on, RNG causes your attack to randomly miss by allowing the opponent to supposedly Evade your attack, even though they are standing completely still.

 

This Needs to go. This game has sooo much evading and agile mechanics, and systems like RNG ruins real action gameplay, where PVP or even PVE is solely based on the players skills and nothing to do with the game system randomizing when you hit the enemy or not and randomizing when the enemy dodges your attacks when they are standing completely still but supposedly dodged your move.

 

Please let me know your thoughts as I feel like this needs to be brought to Daum's attention! I will be highly disappinted with this game if these stats where not revised. 

Ok, so for a month on Korea, we went through "balances" they were tweaking things with the PVP system and this is actually one of the things that was targeted as being an issue with the game, for about maybe 5-6 days they completely turned off all RNG related things with Accuracy/Evasion/CC, everything was 100% unless your enemy target dodged it. It felt like a completely different game, and I completely agree with taking these RNG things out of the game, not sure if we will see these changes come NA/EU though... but I'd love to see it happen again.

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