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Marketplace -bots?


21 posts in this topic

Posted

I was tryin to buy 3 items in marketplace, so I used notification. I was on market looking for a Vangertz shield, notification pop up I clicked refresh and .... sold count incrase by 1 O_o so i waited more.. 11 times whenever notification poped up it was bought straight away. Same with few other items, so this looks like some bot buyin out decent items as soon as they appear on market (sometimes in less than 1s between pop up and sold count up.

This looks like bots similar to one used in D3, is there any chance that some1 will investigate this.?

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Posted

outsniped

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Posted

You are probably not the only person with notification turned on for items that are rare on the marketplace.

Also it takes about 10 min after you get a notification before the item actually shows up to sell.

But you go on with bots.

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Posted

Notification not work with hot items

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Posted (edited)

Actually it takes about 15-20 minutes for an item to appear in the market after it was registered (and you got the notification), the items you saw that were sold were previously registered ones. If you click refresh more often and not just on notification you will be able to get one if you can type a captcha fast enough.

 

Edit: f you are that set on a Vangertz Shield, you could just go to the Weapons guy in Western Guard Camp, he sells them quite cheap, I think 500 Amity for the Shop and about 50000 Silver. Or you could just get a Carpentry Workshop and do it yourself, it doesn't require that much materials.

Edited by Crux

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Posted

Well tbh I find it rather difficult and resource consuming to write a bot being able to solve that market captcha - can't say such bots does not exists but when comparing the resource required for such a picture analysis it would on average probably be faster [and easier] to just solve it yourself.....

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Posted

Well tbh I find it rather difficult and resource consuming to write a bot being able to solve that market captcha - can't say such bots does not exists but when comparing the resource required for such a picture analysis it would on average probably be faster [and easier] to just solve it yourself.....

This market captcha is trivial to solve by bot, and yes there is paid version of bot for doing this and ppl use it.

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Posted

Well tbh I find it rather difficult and resource consuming to write a bot being able to solve that market captcha - can't say such bots does not exists but when comparing the resource required for such a picture analysis it would on average probably be faster [and easier] to just solve it yourself.....

It's piece of cake to write a bot that is able to solve this captcha.

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Posted

Well tbh I find it rather difficult and resource consuming to write a bot being able to solve that market captcha - can't say such bots does not exists but when comparing the resource required for such a picture analysis it would on average probably be faster [and easier] to just solve it yourself.....

indeed, that captcha is by far one of the weakest i saw on the internet. Interestingly enough its designed to be harder for humans to read than for bots XD. That animated background makes it very very easy for bot to simply remove the background alltogether leaving only the actual numbers which you can then pass in any image -> text open source library out there. 

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Posted

This market captcha is trivial to solve by bot, and yes there is paid version of bot for doing this and ppl use it.

It's piece of cake to write a bot that is able to solve this captcha.

well maybe my knowledge on image analysis is extremely outdated but according to it the moving image in the background would be tricky thing to overcome...

indeed, that captcha is by far one of the weakest i saw on the internet. Interestingly enough its designed to be harder for humans to read than for bots XD. That animated background makes it very very easy for bot to simply remove the background alltogether leaving only the actual numbers which you can then pass in any image -> text open source library out there. 

interesting - and how exacly you "simply" remove the background?

although well that one maybe should be moved to priv to not field free intel for actuall botters.... :P

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Posted (edited)

well maybe my knowledge on image analysis is extremely outdated but according to it the moving image in the background would be tricky thing to overcome...

 

interesting - and how exacly you "simply" remove the background?

although well that one maybe should be moved to priv to not field free intel for actuall botters.... :P

You simply remove the background by grabbing 2 (or 3 if you want to be safe) image of the captcha and remove every pixels that arent constant. Thanks to the animated background you are left with only the red numbers. An even faster and simpler approach is to keep the pixels with a red value dominating the spectrum (r > g*1.15 && r > b*1.15) altho thats less reliable its only possible because the colored number in the captcha is constant.

 

As for your suggestion to move this to priv, its not exactly a complicated method and such macro / bots already exists since the kr version and also are on the ru version. The best shot we got at getting it fixed, is for a huge number of bots / marketplace macro to show up, forcing the publishers (and incidently the devs) to wake up and get it fixed. 

Edited by Jey123456

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Posted

it's easy to say "get it fixed" a little bit harder to actually fix it...

although now I stand corrected - even I could write a bot being able to beat that captcha....

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Posted

its pretty easy to fix it by adding some color pool combination to pick from a pool, right now we have grey bg with red text, but we could have red bg with black text or blue bg with red text etc, just keep it so the color actually contrast a bit to reduce the issue for color blind people (altho youll always have such problem if you rely on captcha).

Remove the bg animation so that it cannot be used as a method to filter the background out and at the very least you got rid of the most simplistic bots/macro approach. 

 

Unfortunately unless you make the captcha require more advanced logics (puzzle are becoming a more popular approach for secure captcha) nothing will stop bots from reading text short of making said text unreadable by a huge portion of the human population as well xD. I mean were at a stage where you can use your phone to translate text in realtime from billboard / paper etc using the camera, granted not with open source image to text libraries but its far from impossible to improve such open library as a starting point and optimize it for whatever form of text captcha you want it to face. 

 

The best solution as far as im concerned would not be to fight the bots, but instead make them useless. Right now the main uses for those bots/macro would be to abuse the stupid marketplace pricing mechanism, to grab rare items that are underpriced at max price and offcourse to massbuy hundreds of small stacks to get any real quantity of materials. The first two could be made invalid just by having a proper pricing mechanism in place so that rarer item have an higher max price tag resulting in crafters actually selling said item and a minimal supply appearing. On the abuse side, if the price actually adjusted using a smoother approach relying on supply / demand instead of the rather brutal price change that can currently happen based on transaction count (some item will see a 150-300% price change over a single price update due to the amount of transaction drastically changing). The last part would be fixed by adding a massbuying option allowing us to just enter how many we want to buy and have it buy all the small stacks up to that number for us. 

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Posted (edited)

it's easy to say "get it fixed" a little bit harder to actually fix it...

There is already item registration queue, so they can add item buy queue. When item appear on AH (only rare items etc.),you have like 5 min to make you registration and after that server will RNG winner, sending item to winner and return coins for not winners. Simple as that, solves all bot problems and can be tweaked in many ways to make this work.

 

well maybe my knowledge on image analysis is extremely outdated but according to it the moving image in the background would be tricky thing to overcome...

Captcha in BDO is trivial. If they will use recaptcha then this will be more complicated but for recaptcha there are some services to solve this too and recaptcha will piss off most of the players in game.

Edited by Ximmo
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Posted

There is already item registration queue, so they can add item buy queue. When item appear on AH (only rare items etc.),you have like 5 min to make you registration and after that server will RNG winner, sending item to winner and return coins for not winners. Simple as that, solves all bot problems and can be tweaked in many ways to make this work.

that only solve 1 bot problem and thats the case where they are used to snipe. They are still used to abuse market pricing and massbuy as well. 

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Posted

There is already item registration queue, so they can add item buy queue. When item appear on AH (only rare items etc.),you have like 5 min to make you registration and after that server will RNG winner, sending item to winner and return coins for not winners. Simple as that, solves all bot problems and can be tweaked in many ways to make this work.

+1

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Posted

There is already item registration queue, so they can add item buy queue. When item appear on AH (only rare items etc.),you have like 5 min to make you registration and after that server will RNG winner, sending item to winner and return coins for not winners. Simple as that, solves all bot problems and can be tweaked in many ways to make this work.

I'd not say it would "fix" the bot issue - it would just make the random bot get the item instead of fastest bot...

the tweaks to captcha suggested by Jey makes sense though

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Posted

You need to realize that the auction house is spread accross all channels on that server. So with recent numbers saying 100k concurrent at peak divided by 6 total servers you are fighting with around 20,000 people to buy items. When a single liverto goes up assuming only like 10% of the population camps the auction house that is still 2k people trying to buy one item. Every channel has different ping and other factors based on your region so really what do you think your chances of getting an item actually is? Realistically your best chance is to be in a location  that is physically closest to the server in real life and have the lowest possible ping at any given instant the item goes up.

Even if you make it so everybody has exact same variables in ping when buying items still only a single person can actually buy it. At best you have a 1/2000 chance to get it. That is less than .0001% chance.

Do captcha bots exist? Yea they probably do. Are they the real reason you aren't getting the item? Probably not. With the tax there is no reason to actually buy multiple versions of single items. You can't resell them for any profit. Just keep trying and you might get lucky.

 

That being said liverto is extremely expensive to own and with the new expansion coming soon its probably not worth the investment right now.

 

 

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Posted (edited)

If you seriously think you can get a hot item off the marketplace without a "bot", then you're a fool.

 

http://imgur.com/zwpLAUP

Edited by Farkon

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Posted

Not a bot, you're either slow or your ping to the servers is high. The way the marketplace works is the one with the lowest ping wins.

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Posted

i doubt it's a bot however, captcha hack, i've seen on those forums of asshat, a script that remove the captcha which mean, instant buying items w/o any time lost on the captcha

 

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