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Energy/Vigor

61 posts in this topic

Posted

If they dare cross the "convenience" line to that extent I'll be looking for the door. Simple as that. Too many games tried that nonsense and I have zero tolerance for it at this point. 

Unfortunately it's the easiest way for them to make a quick buck if BDO doesn't have a lot of success (which is possible due to PvPvE being a niche) or if the numbers start dropping.

All they have to do is write a few lines of code, copy the icon for the HP pot and change its hue, and voila, new energy pot.

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Posted

But back to the topic at hand, I'd like more people's opinions on energy/Vigor system/usage. It would be nice to get a few experienced players opinions on the matter at hand. As I feel new people just playing the beta for the first time barely have enough time to get their feet wet with all the intricacies of the game, let alone solely focusing on something like processing and other activities which now have an added energy cost.

 This.

I have been playing in Korea for about ten months. I do not have any problems with their system, and do not understand why it would have to be changed. This is why its hard to know what is going on.

What is the reasoning behind the change? Answer this FIRST and experienced players will tell you their opinion.

Answer nothing, and you have a bunch of inexperienced people who have not had enough time to play around with the new system. The alpha was short. The beta 1 was only one week long.This is a joke considering how much testing has to be done before release.

Why doesn't fishing require energy?

If no one answers then everyone will continue to assume that its going to be a money grab energy regen cash shop item.

If I were Daum, I would crush this theory immediately.

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Posted

But back to the topic at hand, I'd like more people's opinions on energy/Vigor system/usage. It would be nice to get a few experienced players opinions on the matter at hand. As I feel new people just playing the beta for the first time barely have enough time to get their feet wet with all the intricacies of the game, let alone solely focusing on something like processing and other activities which now have an added energy cost.

 This.

I have been playing in Korea for about ten months. I do not have any problems with their system, and do not understand why it would have to be changed. This is why its hard to know what is going on.

What is the reasoning behind the change? Answer this FIRST and experienced players will tell you their opinion.

Answer nothing, and you have a bunch of inexperienced people who have not had enough time to play around with the new system. The alpha was short. The beta 1 was only one week long.This is a joke considering how much testing has to be done before release.

Why doesn't fishing require energy?

If no one answers then everyone will continue to assume that its going to be a money grab energy regen cash shop item.

If I were Daum, I would crush this theory immediately.

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Posted

This game has been Westernized, that's about it.

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Posted

I'm calling it, "energy refill potions" in the Daum Cash Shop!

Should remove the energy system altogether to be honest.

Wait, seriously ? there is a crap "vigor" thing when our version is BUY 2 PLAY and not just Free 2 Play ? what's the hell.

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Posted

 

Wait, seriously ? there is a crap "vigor" thing when our version is BUY 2 PLAY and not just Free 2 Play ? what's the hell.

It's just a theory that guy is making, there's no sign of anything like that yet. If someone starts something with "im calling it, (idea)" then it means they're predicting something is gonna happen.

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Posted (edited)

It's just a theory that guy is making, there's no sign of anything like that yet. If someone starts something with "im calling it, (idea)" then it means they're predicting something is gonna happen.

Oh alright, since i didnt get access to the CBT1 i dont know ( but i experienced that in the RU version )

I really hope they arent going to set that shitty vigor thing, its just totaly pointless except for selling potion to get vigor faster.

I'am only down IF they dont sell "vigor potion" AND set a "fast" resplendish to still have a fluid experience if you dont do a "hardcore farm", and not having to stupidly wait.

Edited by woots

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Posted

Oh alright, since i didnt get access to the CBT1 i dont know ( but i experienced that in the RU version )

I really hope they arent going to set that shitty vigor thing, its just totaly pointless except for selling potion to get vigor faster.

I'am only down IF they dont sell "vigor potion" AND set a "fast" resplendish to still have a fluid experience if you dont do a "hardcore farm", and not having to stupidly wait.

It's highly unlikely they'll sell vigor potions on release as they're aware of the, to phrase it in a humorously overdramatic way, trauma the western MMO community has faced regarding Pay2Win games. There's been a lot of times ArcheAge has been mentioned in these forums I've noticed, that ain't a coincidence.

Whether they'll be able to hold out on using Pay2Win measures through the years, though, is a different matter.

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Posted

Oh alright, since i didnt get access to the CBT1 i dont know ( but i experienced that in the RU version )

I really hope they arent going to set that shitty vigor thing, its just totaly pointless except for selling potion to get vigor faster.

I'am only down IF they dont sell "vigor potion" AND set a "fast" resplendish to still have a fluid experience if you dont do a "hardcore farm", and not having to stupidly wait.

The vigor / energy IS in the game, I played the CBT1 and while it didn't give me much trouble, I didn't craft at all either and was still restricted by the system at times (I did mostly trading and grinding).

However the potions are not in the game, it's a beta ofc and we still don't have a clue of what will be on the cash shop at release.

One thing I'm 99% of is that at some point in time, not necessarily release, they will add these potions because it's literally free money and they'd be stupid not to do it.

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Posted (edited)

The vigor / energy IS in the game, I played the CBT1 and while it didn't give me much trouble, I didn't craft at all either and was still restricted by the system at times (I did mostly trading and grinding).

However the potions are not in the game, it's a beta ofc and we still don't have a clue of what will be on the cash shop at release.

One thing I'm 99% of is that at some point in time, not necessarily release, they will add these potions because it's literally free money and they'd be stupid not to do it.

f*ck then, that's bad that vigor thing -_-"

Seriously, when i tried the RU version for like a week, i was more or less chilling around, and if you have to gather material + craft + node + whatever other else, your vigor is empty in a heartbeat then you were just stuck XXX minutes till you can continue what you wanted to do.

Except to  "force" ppl to constantly use real money to play "normaly" that vigor system have absolutely NO valid reason to even exist.

Edited by woots

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Posted

There's quite a few threads like this, but I'll bite. Energy pots are what most players are afraid of, them monetizing a way for us to need more energy so we keep buying labor cough I mean energy pots from their cash shop. Doing this to get past the horridly slow regen in game. A large portion of players seem to be from ArcheAge myself included, we don't want to see a repeat of the damn labor system from that game.

I played Korea, I still play Korean Black Desert I did alot of processing and cooking and alchemy in that game. People Just don't realize how much processing or cooking you need in order to be able to even craft certain items. Not to mention they've recently changed it in korea so damn near everything takes more mats and higher tier mats to craft something.

Energy for gathering fine sure why not, Energy to learn new knowledge Ok, Energy for an NPC intimacy mini game to access new knowledge, quests, and secret Shop sure. Energy for everything else NOPE keep it like korea.

I completely agree that this is a serious problem. I personally like energy as a concept, another resource I can apply some strategy to. The manner in which this is implemented, however, has some adverse consequences. The cost in energy to cook along with the market barriers to price, make cooking completely unpalatable. It's frustrating enough to learn how to cook. Energy turns into a PvE penalty. If you want to do anything other than grind trash in PvE, you will have to pay a premium to do it, in energy. I won't buy energy potions in this game. I would quit first.

I say keep energy in crafting, but add it to fishing. I think energy should regen at the same rate, but continue while offline and concurrently on alts. This way our crafting toons can come in with a full bar. The floors and ceilings in the market desperately need to be relaxed. Crafters don't get enough respect as it is. They don't need to be taxed on the front end with energy, and on the back end with undervalued ceilings and high taxes. Tax revenues to guilds for capital node captures are a huge selling point for this game though. Don't take those out. 

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Posted

I completely agree that this is a serious problem. I personally like energy as a concept, another resource I can apply some strategy to. The manner in which this is implemented, however, has some adverse consequences. The cost in energy to cook along with the market barriers to price, make cooking completely unpalatable. It's frustrating enough to learn how to cook. Energy turns into a PvE penalty. If you want to do anything other than grind trash in PvE, you will have to pay a premium to do it, in energy. I won't buy energy potions in this game. I would quit first.

 

agree with that, the concept as "strategy" is fine and a nice idea, but the way its managed in that game ( from what i experienced in the RU client ) is only designed to frustrate ppl and make them buy energy potion at the cash shop.

So yeah, they better do something about that

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Posted (edited)

All they have to do is write a few lines of code, copy the icon for the HP pot and change its hue, and voila, new energy pot.

568ad21c64608_2016-01-04_40383927-2545_-

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Energy pots already exist in KR and I imagine other regions as well. Other than the fact players sell the cashshop tree on KR to P2W i haven't heard any complaints. Unless you enjoy gathering more than anything else the energy/vigor system on KR lets players do whatever they want. I really enjoy the vigor/energy system in KR.

I spend more time on my life skills than combat skills in KR. If NA keeps the same restrictions as RU, i'l choose to grind mobs for silver instead. Gathering materials, processing them, and cooking to feed your workers will become a major hassle and more expensive on NA. So either way Pearl Abyss won't get me to buy their potions. Nor will it stimulate the economy because i won't buy materials other players create. In the end i see PA having great difficulty balancing the way Black Desert works to accommodate two entirely different crafting systems. Why a company would want to create more trouble and work for itself I don't understand. 

Edited by Ginrei

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Posted

I'm calling it, "energy refill potions" in the Daum Cash Shop!

Should remove the energy system altogether to be honest.

Look at the RU p2p server, they went more vanity than before, if we will get somewhat the same we wont have those energy pots for sure..

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Posted

I'm calling it, "energy refill potions" in the Daum Cash Shop!

Should remove the energy system altogether to be honest.

The energy system is not crippling like Archeage's labor system is.  Doing guild quests also relies on energy to ensure a team effort in completing the quest (example: collect 200 stones in 1 hour would require 5 or 6 people because lower number of participants would not have enough energy to collect that amount in 1 hour).  Also, each of your alts maintain their own separate energy pools.  Energy is also used on re-rolls for workers, node improvements and bartering - having an endless supply of energy or remove it all together would drastically alter the game.

 

As is, energy is just a mild throttle on the game.  It is not punitive and crippling.  It will even recover twice as fast by sleeping on a bed in your house.  I don't want the game to be boring, I do expect some challenges and I think the energy system is just about right.

 

That said... if Daum moves energy like Archeage did to labor points and their cash stop equivalent... that is a totally different story.  So far, I don't see Daum moving in that direction and lets hope it stays that way.

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Posted

I never have enough energy in KR with 3 times the energy regen of NA. And i also don't have to use any energy Processing or Cooking. Players will have much fewer options regarding how they play the game if NA remains like CBT1.

The ONLY positive i can see with NAs energy system is players might be grinding instead of crafting so PvP will occur more often.

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Posted

I'm still waiting for some answers on this topic.

Why would anyone use any of the 60/90 minute life exp potions if you can burns through your energy in 5 10 minutes.

The energy requirements in NA make no sense.

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Posted

Generally, I hate this type of system in an MMO.  Not because it messes with players, not even because it makes things more inconvenient, but mostly because it makes no sense to be in an MMO.  Let's say someone wants to do a boat load of crafting and doesn't want to buy any hypothetical refill potions.  That person is screwed.  I know the whole point is to keep players playing over a longer stretch; if you limit how much someone can do in a day, they will be forced to do it over multiple days.  All this system really does, though, at least in my experience, is cause people to just get annoyed and stop playing.  It's happened with Archeage, it's happened with Elsword (although that game was way worse off), and it looks like it's going to be seriously implemented here.  Come to think of it, the only time I've seen this system as such a big part of a game is in Korean MMO's.  Huh.

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Posted

/Agree

Except its not in the Korean version. and only in the NA version.

Crafting is still limited by the time it takes your workers to gather stuff, and your ability to make beer/recovery for them. Its actually timed fairly, and should be enough of a blockade. Sure, you can go and manually gather stuff, but it requires energy...

No need for Energy processing/crafting.

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Posted (edited)

As someone who currently plays the RU version that has the Energy system as described above I don't mind it too much.

Converting corn or potatoes into flour is little bit of drag.

I guess if you solely played one charterer I can kinda see how the argument applies, But once you roll that second character I kinda feel the point is mute. Your maximum energy is family wide and each character maintains there own pool.

I just plan ahead and have one character do the processing and another actually cook.

I often times just plan to go fishing or mob grinding while I wait for the energy recharge.

As many people have already pointed out, the system is not nearly as bad as AAs was.

Oh on a sidenote:

Do you think that maybe Pearl Abyss is testing out this alternative system in RU and here in EU/NA for player response and analysis before deploying in KR? 

Edited by Genjimaru

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Posted

As someone who currently plays the RU version that has the Energy system as described above I don't mind it too much.

Converting corn or potatoes into flour is little bit of drag.

I guess if you solely played one charterer I can kinda see how the argument applies, But once you roll that second character I kinda feel the point is mute. Your maximum energy is family wide and each character maintains there own pool.

I just plan ahead and have one character do the processing and another actually cook.

I often times just plan to go fishing or mob grinding while I wait for the energy recharge.

As many people have already pointed out, the system is not nearly as bad as AAs was.

Oh on a sidenote:

Do you think that maybe Pearl Abyss is testing out this alternative system in RU and here in EU/NA for player response and analysis before deploying in KR? 

How many alts would you say is sufficient for a person who plans on crafting a decent amount?

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Posted

There's quite a few threads like this, but I'll bite. Energy pots are what most players are afraid of, them monetizing a way for us to need more energy so we keep buying labor cough I mean energy pots from their cash shop. Doing this to get past the horridly slow regen in game. A large portion of players seem to be from ArcheAge myself included, we don't want to see a repeat of the damn labor system from that game.

I played Korea, I still play Korean Black Desert I did alot of processing and cooking and alchemy in that game. People Just don't realize how much processing or cooking you need in order to be able to even craft certain items. Not to mention they've recently changed it in korea so damn near everything takes more mats and higher tier mats to craft something.

Energy for gathering fine sure why not, Energy to learn new knowledge Ok, Energy for an NPC intimacy mini game to access new knowledge, quests, and secret Shop sure. Energy for everything else NOPE keep it like korea.

yes totally agree with you.    im going to cross the fingers and hope that only cosmetic things will be  for cash shop.  

I find the entire energy system an cookie cutter from archeage.

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Posted

CM_Jouska has openly stated they put this new system in to cripple, sorry I mean restrict crafting, to prevent someone from using High-Quality Carrot Juice to afk craft for 72 hours to max out cooking, while doing not a single other thing in your life.

I have personally processed 500 High Quality Carrots into Carrot Juice on the Korean version and went from Skilled 3 to Skilled 6. I had to process 1500 flour. That made me wish to pull my teeth out as I had to grind over 1100 potatoes. And I only got 3 levels for my time and effort without having to expend the 1500+ Energy the NA/EU version would of required.

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Posted (edited)

CM_Jouska has openly stated they put this new system in to cripple, sorry I mean restrict crafting, to prevent someone from using High-Quality Carrot Juice to afk craft for 72 hours to max out cooking, while doing not a single other thing in your life.

I have personally processed 500 High Quality Carrots into Carrot Juice on the Korean version and went from Skilled 3 to Skilled 6. I had to process 1500 flour. That made me wish to pull my teeth out as I had to grind over 1100 potatoes. And I only got 3 levels for my time and effort without having to expend the 1500+ Energy the NA/EU version would of required.

they should consider raising exp gain from crafting.   I think it would be beneficial having different viable ways of leveling, even if it takes you longer.   this could also solve the bottle neck problems when it comes to grinding spots, that some people seem to eager to be fighting about.

Edited by Aylindel

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Posted

Have you ever been fishing?  It's takes 0 energy. Have you ever chopped wood and processed it?  Holy crap that takes a lot of energy! The realism of the game is perfect.  Plus it will keep people who have nothing better to do than farm to flood the market over and over again with tons of mats.  I play KR. No problems at all with the system.  Sheesh!  All I see on these forums are all the things everyone wants to change yet everyone "loves" the game. 

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