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Rework the "escape" feature as it is still being exploited

17 posts in this topic

Posted

Just had a wizard attack me in pvp, when the fight went sour and turned in my favor, he hit the "escape" button and got 100% block from behind while his character was safely ported away at less than 10% health. He blocked two Razor winds, and Pen shot combos, and vanished with out a trace.

 

It's because of crap like this, and being able to flag right on top of people, and the lower karma losses, and the lower pvp gankability level that pvp in this game is an absolute joke. Let's not even begin to talk about the power gap from a level 50 player to a level 51.

 

Just to clarify, it was the bring up the menu and hit the "escape" button. This is the same as the exploit that was "fixed" where you would /rescue to escape a bad fight. This makes you invulnerable to attack during the timer and teleports you to safety. When this jerk face, who shall remain nameless, but KOS as soon as I see him again, was losing his attempted gank on me, he got down to a sliver of life, and used this button. I tested it out for myself after I saw it, and was indeed invulnerable to my friends attacks while I was being brought to safety. If you remember where the button appears on your screen it's simply a matter of putting your mouse in the right spot, hitting your escape key and left clicking quickly.

 

So as not to just complain on the forum about more broken crap about PVP this is my suggestions to fix the present system.

 

#1. Leave escape in the game, but make it so that you sit there, doing nothing for 2 minutes before it teleports you away. The intent of this button is in case your character is stuck in geometry you can save yourself from it. Either this, or make it a cooldown of say 1 minute, and if you are hit during this time it cancels the teleport.

#2. Flagging - flagging should only be able to be done in towns. What's the point of having a dog pet to warn you of hostile players when they can simply flag right next to you?

#3. Disable the ability to unflag while in combat. If you took damage in the last minute, you should not be able to unflag, period. 

#4. Bring back the level 49 quest to enable pvp / ability to level up to 50.

#5. Increase the karma penalties to Korean server levels.

#6. Change the bounty system before it comes out. Most of the people that would want to use this system are likely going to be at max karma anyway, why would rewarding them more karma be an incentive for them to go out and hunt another player? Give them a bounty token or something 5 tokens turns in for 5 gold bars or something. 

#7. The disparity in power between the levels is far far too noticeable. A level 50 vs a level 51 of equal player skill, will most likely lose the fight unless the 51 makes a mistake. And since the 51 can flag right behind said 50, they can easily just one shot them anyway, so there's no fight to begin with. This is highly due to level, but it also plays a factor with the fact that said 51 has had more time to get better gear, enhancements on said gear and so forth. A proposed solution is to increase the karma hit for a player that kills someone "unfairly" as it is already in the game. "So and so was killed unfairly by so and so."

So there ya go, now the thread is more than just my complaint about some failed ganker want to be that had to cheat to live. Have a nice day =)

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Posted

Just had a wizard attack me in pvp, when the fight went sour and turned in my favor, he hit the "escape" button and got 100% block from behind while his character was safely ported away at less than 10% health. He blocked two Razor winds, and Pen shot combos, and vanished with out a trace.

 

It's because of crap like this, and being able to flag right on top of people, and the lower karma losses, and the lower pvp gankability level that pvp in this game is an absolute joke. Let's not even begin to talk about the power gap from a level 50 player to a level 51.

 

Just to clarify, it was the bring up the menu and hit the "escape" button. This is the same as the exploit that was "fixed" where you would /rescue to escape a bad fight. This makes you invulnerable to attack during the timer and teleports you to safety. When this jerk face, who shall remain nameless, but KOS as soon as I see him again, was losing his attempted gank on me, he got down to a sliver of life, and used this button. I tested it out for myself after I saw it, and was indeed invulnerable to my friends attacks while I was being brought to safety. If you remember where the button appears on your screen it's simply a matter of putting your mouse in the right spot, hitting your escape key and left clicking quickly.

 

So as not to just complain on the forum about more broken crap about PVP this is my suggestions to fix the present system.

 

#1. Leave escape in the game, but make it so that you sit there, doing nothing for 2 minutes before it teleports you away. The intent of this button is in case your character is stuck in geometry you can save yourself from it. Either this, or make it a cooldown of say 1 minute, and if you are hit during this time it cancels the teleport.

#2. Flagging - flagging should only be able to be done in towns. What's the point of having a dog pet to warn you of hostile players when they can simply flag right next to you?

#3. Disable the ability to unflag while in combat. If you took damage in the last minute, you should not be able to unflag, period. 

#4. Bring back the level 49 quest to enable pvp / ability to level up to 50.

#5. Increase the karma penalties to Korean server levels.

#6. Change the bounty system before it comes out. Most of the people that would want to use this system are likely going to be at max karma anyway, why would rewarding them more karma be an incentive for them to go out and hunt another player? Give them a bounty token or something 5 tokens turns in for 5 gold bars or something. 

#7. The disparity in power between the levels is far far too noticeable. A level 50 vs a level 51 of equal player skill, will most likely lose the fight unless the 51 makes a mistake. And since the 51 can flag right behind said 50, they can easily just one shot them anyway, so there's no fight to begin with. This is highly due to level, but it also plays a factor with the fact that said 51 has had more time to get better gear, enhancements on said gear and so forth. A proposed solution is to increase the karma hit for a player that kills someone "unfairly" as it is already in the game. "So and so was killed unfairly by so and so."

So there ya go, now the thread is more than just my complaint about some failed ganker want to be that had to cheat to live. Have a nice day =)

Or you could just make it so anyone who is flagged for pvp cannot escape.   Keep the flag on if any damage is done to you from another player and 2 minutes after last damage to prevent flag bugging and then your done.  Increasing the karma penalty is quite honestly the worst thing you can do.  Open world pvp is in there for a reason.  Unless the bounty hunter patch comes out this week the risk of a loss of enchant levels and armor and weps is far more than enough punishment. 

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Posted

It just needs to be fixed, there is presently no PVP in the game, only ganking and pvp exploits.

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Posted

Maybe your last point there is worth discussing. The rest is care bear garbage not worth the read.

scrub

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Posted

I agree with Diss that a player in combat (PvP or PvE) should not be able to escape.

As for your points OP, I agree with #3 in that you should not be able to unflag while in combat. There should also be a short cooldown outside of PvP combat before you can unflag as well.

I understand the appeal of #6, but PA won't do it because they don't want a situation where you can essentially "kill trade" with the bounty system for in-game money. That is why they settled on the Karma reward. The other point is that it allows you to PK more often since you have a new source of positive Karma.

And finally #7, I'm more concerned with gear gaps, but am happy that Daum EU is sticking with +15 at least for now.

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Posted (edited)

I was wondering why this didn't get any likes yet, then I read #4, #5 and #6.
Personally I like to go even a little further and have them remove V skill from the game aswell, originally the skill gets introduced as a way to escape mobs when near death.
Not only is this a fool proof safety-net for an already easy PvE experience, it's also mostly only being used to flee in PvP.

Although I do hope #7 gets some attention since having level and gear be more affecting for the outcome of a fight than skill in a game thats suppose to have skill based combat.
I don't think they will change the power of level difference any time soon though.

BTW since Daum removed /Rescue I take that using Rescue from the escape menu in a fight can be seen as an exploit.
@CM_Jouska
Can you confirm this?
I've had the same thing happen to me, where a person escapes by using Rescue from the escape menu in the middle of a fight.
I'd like to know if I can report such people.

Edited by Yablo

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Posted

So much stupidity in the OP, but even so I still can't over how much I'm laughing that you use Razor Wind in PvP. Escape is far from your biggest problem. :')

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Posted

I fully support the OP's ideas. All of them.

OWPvP is fine. I can deal with PKers, and the ability to fight anyone else who is being a jerk in passive aggressive ways (such as kill stealing), or even just to be a lowlife jerk for lulz, is fine and adds spice to the game even for "carebears".

But what's NOT good for the game in any way, shape, or form are the exploits that allow PK gankers to flag up instantly next to you, or to escape if they are losing. Also, Karma penalties have to be stiff enough to discourage excessive PK.

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Posted

The only thign i agree on is:

1) Maybe there should be a 1 - 2 minutes before it actually escapes you.

2) Flagging Should be instant but unflagging should have a  5 minute cooldown before it activates.

 

Other then that your just another player crying that he got he almost got PKed.

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Posted

So much stupidity in the OP, but even so I still can't over how much I'm laughing that you use Razor Wind in PvP. Escape is far from your biggest problem. :')

Oh so ... dodging a wizards casted spell... then using razor wind while he's stuck in a casting animation is stupid huh? While he's just standing there prone it's dumb of me to use an ability that does a ton of damage with a 100% crit chance follow up at 600% damage? You are right how foolish of me to use a super powerful ability while he's channeling.

 

Other then that your just another player crying that he got he almost got PKed.

You clearly missed the point of the thread. It's to clean up an exploit. I am sure you wouldn't be happy if your would be ganker exploited the game to leave the fight when you turned it into your favor either.

 

I understand the appeal of #6, but PA won't do it because they don't want a situation where you can essentially "kill trade" with the bounty system for in-game money. That is why they settled on the Karma reward. The other point is that it allows you to PK more often since you have a new source of positive Karma.

I hadn't thought about that, and you are right. That's pretty much what happens with the bounty system in EVE, and it would most likely happen that way here too. So I think you are right and sadly we'll probably be stuck with it as a karma booster. That being said, what they should do is then drastically reduce the amount of karma gained through other means, making the bounty system more karma lucrative then.

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Posted

There has to be a way to give some notice to non-guild players that someone is flagged nearby.  Only an absolute douchebag thinks it is cool to sneak up on someone when they are playing a PvE game (killing mobs in open world is PvE) and attacks them in middle of fighting mobs  The penalty for ambushing unflagged, unguilded players should be high enough to make it a real decision and escape should work if you are attacked/ambushed, but not if you are the attacker, that is retarded.  And i do not think should be able to attack someone who is not flagged and below 50 and if they do flag should not be able to disable unless no other flagged players near or return to town

If you are playing this open world softcore pvp so you can gank lowbies after you grinded to max level and max gear then there should not be a reward or easy forgiveness for being a douchebag.  If you want to PK you should have some honor, games that had these scenarios the good players always act honorably, In darksouls (the real one) sign of a good fight was square off and bow.  

I prefer to keep my PvP and PvE separate; outside of a guild and since BDO has flag (waterwings/training wheels) it is not real PvP it just caters to squeakers and douchebags.  I presume the GvG pvp is cool and probably more real pvp, but since i cannot find a single guide about it dont know.

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Posted

Oh so ... dodging a wizards casted spell... then using razor wind while he's stuck in a casting animation is stupid huh? While he's just standing there prone it's dumb of me to use an ability that does a ton of damage with a 100% crit chance follow up at 600% damage? You are right how foolish of me to use a super powerful ability while he's channeling.

Yes it is. If he let you get off a full RW then he's terrible, but you're even worse for using it in the first place. If you dodged his spell then KD with Blasting Gust or Pen Wind into WotW shotgun will kill a Wizard way faster. 

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Posted (edited)

Yes it is. If he let you get off a full RW then he's terrible, but you're even worse for using it in the first place. If you dodged his spell then KD with Blasting Gust or Pen Wind into WotW shotgun will kill a Wizard way faster. 

You do know that the animation can be canceled to instantly cast penetrating wind right, and that you can also then spam that for 600% damage 100% crit chance, like over and over till you run out of mana right? Also ... they nerfed explosive shot to the ground. And with a 5 attack speed like I have, a full razor shot takes maybe 1.5 seconds.

 

And because of doing this his health went from 100% during the cast to maybe 5% which is when he used the exploit that this thread is actually about. So please stop trying to derail the thread.

Edited by Drakedge

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Posted

You do know that the animation can be canceled to instantly cast penetrating wind right, and that you can also then spam that for 600% damage 100% crit chance, like over and over till you run out of mana right? Also ... they nerfed explosive shot to the ground. And with a 5 attack speed like I have, a full razor shot takes maybe 1.5 seconds.

 

And because of doing this his health went from 100% during the cast to maybe 5% which is when he used the exploit that this thread is actually about. So please stop trying to derail the thread.

Haha, so did you cancel it or use it? Very different thing. Love how people change their story when they get called out. Even if you're only stood in place for 1.5s, any semi-competent player should punish you for that in a 1v1.

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Posted

Haha, so did you cancel it or use it? Very different thing. Love how people change their story when they get called out. Even if you're only stood in place for 1.5s, any semi-competent player should punish you for that in a 1v1.

Do you have anything constructive to add to the discussion about the escape exploit? The wizard cast timer is longer than it takes to get a full razor wind and pen shot off with an attack speed of 5, so roll on troll. Get back onto the topic at hand.

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Posted

You realize of course, that the button on the menu "Escape" is intended for when your character gets stuck in geometry of the game. While NOT being intended as a means to escape a pvp fight you are losing correct? This is why they disabled the /rescue command in the first place, to try to clean up the exploit. If that's not exploiting, then please sir, tell me what is?

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Posted

I'ts obviously meant to be used when you are drowning.

Thus escape icon is man drowning.

This is also quite true!

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