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CM_Jouska vs. Warrior


236 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Balance is an ongoing task, and this will involve both nerfs and buffs as the process is gone through.  You could look at this like a series of trials and errors, all of which lead us towards the final goal of finding balance.  This concept applies to all classes, including warrior, and while it is of course unfortunate that you are not happy with the current state of your class, I urge you to take the time to draft your suggestion on what you think would be the right way to balance it, especially taking into account the other classes and different types of game-play.

I look forward to reading your suggestions soon.

So...  @CM_Jouska wants some feedback about warrior ingame balance... He probably aint reading class specific (or bug report) forums much... So what about giving him some feedback in a pile? :D

Edited by RoakOriginal

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Posted

So...  @CM_Jouska wants some feedback about warrior ingame balance... He probably aint reading class specific (or bug report) forums much... So what about giving him some feedback, in his favourite section? :Dhttp://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/forum/16-suggestions/

I gave up on thinking anything will change until awakening but good luck tho .

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Posted (edited)

Semi-related: 

On topic: I think we have to wait for every class to get their awakenings before we get any true balancing unfortunately =(. If I remember correctly, they said they would do another balance pass-through after all the awakenings are out so maybe then we can see our normal weapon become more viable then it is now.

Edited by Kinto
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Posted

Semi-related: 

On topic: I think we have to wait for every class to get their awakenings before we get any true balancing unfortunately =(. If I remember correctly, they said they would do another balance pass-through after all the awakenings are out so maybe then we can see our normal weapon become more viable then it is now.

awesome!! you gonna wait 1 or 2 years for a true balance ?

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Posted (edited)

Warrior does not need a major overhaul. His awakening will fix most of his issues. But I believe sword and shield should still be viable for damage too. Atleast somewhat.

Skills
.
Scars of dusk is so weak right now that I would cut the CD from 8 seconds to 4 seconds or just buff it back. The pvp damage of scars of dusk is feeble. It's quite okay for PvE but nowhere as strong as other classes PvE abilities. It also has no down-attack damage amplifier.

Ground smash is mainly for CC and does ok damage for being a CC. I see absolutely no problems.

Piercing spear is heavily gimped by the desyncs. I feel like 7/10 times I use one, it fails even if the hit connects.

Grabs are also gimped by the desync issues. There are two problems with the grabs. One is where caster-classes can teleport out of the grab animation, other is the no knockdown effect. The no knockdown effect hurts us bad because we can't continue or start a combo. Warrior can't damage moving targets with spinning slash, no knockdown means no damage.

I will not mention the other skills because some serve their purpose and some others are utterly weak to the point where no warrior uses them. 

CC-nerf

When I played in BDO RU or watched warrior pvp videos from KR, these players could constantly lock a target and damage. This was our saving grace and no further damage increase was even needed. The more good you were at juggling with skills the more damage you could lash out. It's not like you could lock someone forever with the same skill either because of the CD.

A scenario of the effect of cc nerf is, I shield charge  a target but he desyncs and gets stunned elsewhere. He starts running and I throw a piercing spear. Nothing happens, because he is immune to the next stun CC.


What I would ask for?


Pre nerf Scars of dusk and a slight spinning slash buff. Fix the desyncs and if CC nerf was removed that would be more than enough for us warriors. 


Thats my 2 cents, feel free to debate/critique it if you must.
 

Edited by LoneWolf
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Posted (edited)

Well... We already have awakening patches ingame (hence CC)... But according to another link i posted somewhere (really dont know where) we will get awakening in june or later... And thats quite a long time for many people, to feel bad about playing their class...

Also... Awakening shouldnt be the only way to play warrior... S&B should be viable as well in some way... And waiting few months for awakening bein shipped here, and then who knows how many months till KR starts with balance... Doesnt seem optimistic at all... :D

Edited by RoakOriginal
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Posted (edited)

Warrior does not need a major overhaul. His awakening will fix most of his issues. But I believe sword and shield should still be viable for damage too. Atleast somewhat.

Skills
.
Scars of dusk is so weak right now that I would cut the CD from 8 seconds to 4 seconds or just buff it back. The pvp damage of scars of dusk is feeble. It's quite okay for PvE but nowhere as strong as other classes PvE abilities. It also has no down-attack damage amplifier.

Ground smash is mainly for CC and does ok damage for being a CC. I see absolutely no problems.

Piercing spear is heavily gimped by the desyncs. I feel like 7/10 times I use one, it fails even if the hit connects.

Grabs are also gimped by the desync issues. There are two problems with the grabs. One is where caster-classes can teleport out of the grab animation, other is the no knockdown effect. The no knockdown effect hurts us bad because we can't continue or start a combo. Warrior can't damage moving targets with spinning slash, no knockdown means no damage.

I will not mention the other skills because some serve their purpose and some others are utterly weak to the point where no warrior uses them. 

CC-nerf

When I played in BDO RU or watched warrior pvp videos from KR, these players could constantly lock a target and damage. This was our saving grace and no further damage increase was even needed. The more good you were at juggling with skills the more damage you could lash out. It's not like you could lock someone forever with the same skill either because of the CD.

A scenario of the effect of cc nerf is, I shield charge  a target but he desyncs and gets stunned elsewhere. He starts running and I throw a piercing spear. Nothing happens, because he is immune to the next stun CC.


What I would ask for?


Pre nerf Scars of dusk and a slight spinning slash buff. Fix the desyncs and if CC nerf was removed that would be more than enough for us warriors. 


Thats my 2 cents, feel free to debate/critique it if you must.
 

I would like all of this and a buff for forward slash as well. The damage in pvp is a joke.

 

Edit: pve as well, especially since Warriors only use 3 attacking skills right now maybe 4 if you use deep thrust (which does shit damage as well)

Edited by Zyke

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Posted

I agree with everything my bae LoneWolf said even though I'm allegedly a totally better warrior than everyone on jordine and think warrior is most op shit in game AGAIN even though sorcs can just jump out of every single grab you even land and tamers can just spin around u on a horse with no animation till you die
(oneuproad may seem extremely good but i'm actually his teacher)

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Posted

PVP damage = joke. 

 

I can live forever though so thats cool.

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Posted

I agree with everything my bae LoneWolf said even though I'm allegedly a totally better warrior than everyone on jordine and think warrior is most op shit in game AGAIN even though sorcs can just jump out of every single grab you even land and tamers can just spin around u on a horse with no animation till you die
(oneuproad may seem extremely good but i'm actually his teacher)

Rofl

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Posted

I agree with everything my bae LoneWolf said even though I'm allegedly a totally better warrior than everyone on jordine and think warrior is most op shit in game AGAIN even though sorcs can just jump out of every single grab you even land and tamers can just spin around u on a horse with no animation till you die
(oneuproad may seem extremely good but i'm actually his teacher)

You teach me how to shred tears when i read warrior section on forum. Who are you actually?

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Posted

cropped

Ágreed with what he wrote in this post.

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Posted

Awakenings will fix most issues, its just that our burst damage compared to other classes is much lower.

Like many people said Forward slash is tickling people and spinning slash alone wont cut it against 200+ DP targets.

I hope we do get some attention before the Awakening weapons come but if not then nothing will make me stop playing this class.

 

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Posted

@CM_Jouska suggestions to help fix the warrior class are all over the forums but to simplify it:

1) Spinning slash damage boost bc it is our main damage dealer and after going through bugs/desync to get someone on the ground to actually combo, it isnt doing as much damage as other classes main damage dealers are. The burst just isnt there and it is clearly shown if looked at other classes main damage dealer such as sorc/wiz/witch/ranger. And i wont even bother with the whole range vs melee topic on who should be more rewarded.

2) Scars of dusk also boosted as it is another good damage dealing ability we have when we arent able to get a combo on a enemy on the ground.

3) Most fustrating thing is the grab bug and huge desync issue that everyone will agree with me is gamebreaking.

Hope it didnt sound QQ and hope you read this as it would make the community really happy with warriors again. Thanks

P.S: to other warriors if i left anything out which i could have since i am in the middle of class feel free to add on.

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Posted

This.

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Posted

@CM_Jouska suggestions to help fix the warrior class are all over the forums but to simplify it:

1) Spinning slash damage boost bc it is our main damage dealer and after going through bugs/desync to get someone on the ground to actually combo, it isnt doing as much damage as other classes main damage dealers are. The burst just isnt there and it is clearly shown if looked at other classes main damage dealer such as sorc/wiz/witch/ranger. And i wont even bother with the whole range vs melee topic on who should be more rewarded.

2) Scars of dusk also boosted as it is another good damage dealing ability we have when we arent able to get a combo on a enemy on the ground.

3) Most fustrating thing is the grab bug and huge desync issue that everyone will agree with me is gamebreaking.

Hope it didnt sound QQ and hope you read this as it would make the community really happy with warriors again. Thanks

P.S: to other warriors if i left anything out which i could have since i am in the middle of class feel free to add on.

Right on

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Posted

Also, make ALL other skills more viable so we can actually use combo's effectively.  It's sad to use 1 skill over and over and over again because ALL the other skills are pure useless in terms of damage.

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Posted

1. Scars of Dusk needs to double in damage and have a functioning down attack modifier.

2. Spinning Slash damage needs to double.

3. Grab Desync needs to be fixed.

4. Ground Slam needs a bit more damage and the description of the skill needs to be fixed (it implies the second smash should float downed targets) or implement a float on second smash.

5. Spear needs a longer debuff duration and desync fix.

6. Would be so awesome, if unrelated, if we could unlearn LMB, RMB, and F. Just make these not learned by default and not a requirement for Chopping Kick.

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Posted (edited)

Could we get a snare / block while mounted?   I don't like getting chased by people who are using all their skills on horseback while I'm trying to catch up to them / tickle them with my melee abilities that require me to hold S while chasing.

Am I missing something about warrior mounted combat?  Can we talk about this at all?

Edited by Eclips

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Posted

Some of you guys asking for doubles to your damage are insane lol. 

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Posted

Some of you guys asking for doubles to your damage are insane lol. 

You'll be suprised how low it will be even if doubled.. compared to tamers jolt/bolt or sorc skills... >.<

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Posted

@CM_Jouska suggestions to help fix the warrior class are all over the forums but to simplify it:

1) Spinning slash damage boost bc it is our main damage dealer and after going through bugs/desync to get someone on the ground to actually combo, it isnt doing as much damage as other classes main damage dealers are. The burst just isnt there and it is clearly shown if looked at other classes main damage dealer such as sorc/wiz/witch/ranger. And i wont even bother with the whole range vs melee topic on who should be more rewarded.

2) Scars of dusk also boosted as it is another good damage dealing ability we have when we arent able to get a combo on a enemy on the ground.

3) Most fustrating thing is the grab bug and huge desync issue that everyone will agree with me is gamebreaking.

Hope it didnt sound QQ and hope you read this as it would make the community really happy with warriors again. Thanks

P.S: to other warriors if i left anything out which i could have since i am in the middle of class feel free to add on.

This, and what Lonewolf said is the general consensus that I've seen and agree with.

 

Some of my own input for PVP 

Skills that should be tweaked for PVP:

-Ground ROAR should do more/something in PVP, maybe a spin around effect like the Valk has. Maybe apply the draw in effect it has in PVE (subject to CC immunity), or its own unique, very short stun that interrupts the enemy's current animation and cancels that skill, or even just a very small root/snare. Don't treat it as a standard stun so our shield stuns won't work afterwards. ANY of these effects don't have to work more than once every few seconds and it would give us some interesting ways to create engagements in large scale PVP and to help catch stragglers.

-Jump Thrust: maybe add the knockback for PVP, but otherwise it works decently for another gap closer.

 

Skills that I never use.

-Heavy Strike: no reason to use this. very poor damage (even with the bleed) and no status effect to compensate. Honestly this skill just gets in the way of the "hold W+LMB and tap RMB" for mobility.

-Shield Strike: should spin the target in PVP?

-Sideways cut: very poor damage and no i-frames, so there is no reason to use this when you can just dodge.

-War Cry: haven't used this myself, but from what I've read it hardley works as a taunt in PVE, and doesn't do anything in PVP

-Ground Slash: doesn't seem to have much/any use as a raw damage ability considering it doesn't have anything going for it. No100% crit, no mobility attached to it like spinning slash/chopping kick, and doesn't have a block like Scars of Dusk

 

Other thoughts: 

Our 2 main damage abilities have an innate 100% crit chance, which is... interesting. Which means most/all of the other skills should have enough utility to justify using them. I'm not a KR/RU veteran and it sounds like our awakening will fix some/most of our DPS issues, but the sword/shield should still hold its own in DPS (which it currently doesn't) and offer more CC opportunities than the greatsword. To put it in some perspective, in PVE my warrior with a +15 blue yuria kills as quickly as my sorc with a +11 green yuria (and yes I am animation canceling and all that jazz.)

If the CC immunity is staying then our burst needs to be increased (doesn't have to be to the point of 1-shotting anyone like sorcs or rangers.) If our burst is not going to be increased then we need more CC options to make up for it, but honestly our damage is low enough to make a lot of us want to reroll.

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Posted (edited)

nevermind

 

Edited by Swiper
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Posted

Could we get a snare / block while mounted?   I don't like getting chased by people who are using all their skills on horseback while I'm trying to catch up to them / tickle them with my melee abilities that require me to hold S while chasing.

Am I missing something about warrior mounted combat?  Can we talk about this at all?

E is Block.

The problem with warrior mounted combat is that all out abilties are combo'ed with S, so no matter what we are going to be going away from our target unless I completely missed something about mounted combat.

Piercing Spear/Scars of Dusk should be hotbar'able

Spinning Slash should be shift RMB

Deep Thrust should be shift LMB

Block should be Q

You should be able to grab with E

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Posted

Semi-related: 

On topic: I think we have to wait for every class to get their awakenings before we get any true balancing unfortunately =(. If I remember correctly, they said they would do another balance pass-through after all the awakenings are out so maybe then we can see our normal weapon become more viable then it is now.

Yeah for the rest of us that aren't being carried by our guild, I think we could use a lil something something.

Its a fact that our S/shield is still massively inferior, even after GS is out, and I don't think a buff to its abilities is asking too much, nor would it throw off the overall balance.

Stop being so milquetoast btw.

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