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pm diary PM Diary 2.2 - Cash Shop and more


1,944 posts in this topic

Posted

Sounds more like a gear scaling problem and RNG problem than a cash shop problem.

Way to go, you're blaming an entirely unrelated feature for the problems caused by other unrelated features. Aren't you just the paragon of intellectualism.

WHAT?

So you're saying that being able to buy in game currency that allows you to buy end game gear is not p2w? So buying end game gear through cashshop is not p2w? Ok... i'm sorry. The rest of the world is wrong and you are right

I'm out of here.

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Posted

WHAT?

So you're saying that being able to buy in game currency that allows you to buy end game gear is not p2w? So buying end game gear through cashshop is not p2w? Ok... i'm sorry. The rest of the world is wrong and you are right

I'm out of here.

You wouldn't be buying in game currency. You'd be buying a bloody dress. And someone else, who earned that currency, will buy that dress from you. Then, you take that money and find someone who grinded up through the RNG to get that item to +20 and you'd give THEM that money and they'd give you the item. You aren't buying currency, you aren't buying power, you're trading for it. You're giving another player something they want/need and they're giving you the item you seek. Your ability to obtain power is ENTIRELY reliant on other people.

Buying gear through the cash shop is P2W. And that's why there isn't even one single person advocating for it. You saw for yourself, only cosmetic and quality of life things are in the cash shop. If you think buying a nice dress is P2W, that just shows how far off the deep end you've gone. You're so fanatical about P2W that buying bloody cosmetics is now P2W in your mind rofl.

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Posted

Wow... have you missed the RNG rules the game threads? I think you did.

And when a player with JUST ONE +18 gear and the other items +17 is able to oneshot a player with everything +17... yea...

 

But sure, let's protect p2w. Everyone loves p2w. Look at all those p2w mmorpgs that succeded. Look at how good p2w bdo is ranked in korea... was it #87? Yep... let's fanboy every problem the game has... this will help the game a lot.

Another thing that only needs time investment and patience. If you don't have it, avoid this game. This is a HC MMO that you haven't seen for a while.

I have played an MMO which had even harder enchanting system. NO ONE ever complained about it in my playtime like you guys do here.

Your example is also really bad. A player with only 1 piece having +18 rest is +17, will not one shot a player with full +17 items. Thats ridiculous.

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Posted

This is just sad....

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Posted (edited)

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/show/custom/id/1007/Free-MMORPG-Games.html here we go retard 

here a full list of game ruined by the cash shop...

but you didn't even answer me, tell me a name of a game with a cash shop that didn't fail, or if you like the best tell me a mmorpg that only sold cosmetic item that didn't fail... 

funny make question!

every single one has already target you as a stupid and you are still discussing, its fun cause is internet no one will ever know who you really are

now i will really let you speak alone or with someone that want to insult you or make you seems even more stupid

So wait, are you against the cash shop entirely? Because that's something I can gt behind. Because you do realize BDO has a cash shop too, right? So since you're saying literally any MMO with a cash shop is automatically ruined (including the 10 million sub World of Warcraft... somehow..) well that means BDO is ALREADY ruined because it's 100% guaranteed to have a cash shop. Seems to me you should take it up with the devs and demand they remove the cash shop, I have no control over that after all. Also if you make another post with direct insults I will report you. That's against the rules after all.

 

Also, to answer your question. You want an MMO that had a cash shop and didn't fail? World of Warcraft. The single largest, most profitable MMO in gaming history.

Edited by Colt556

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Posted

So wait, are you against the cash shop entirely? Because that's something I can gt behind. Because you do realize BDO has a cash shop too, right? So since you're saying literally any MMO with a cash shop is automatically ruined (including the 10 million sub World of Warcraft... somehow..) well that means BDO is ALREADY ruined because it's 100% guaranteed to have a cash shop. Seems to me you should take it up with the devs and demand they remove the cash shop, I have no control over that after all. Also if you make another post with direct insults I will report you. That's against the rules after all.

 

Also, to answer your question. You want an MMO that had a cash shop and didn't fail? World of Warcraft. The single largest, most profitable MMO in gaming history.

i spoke about cash shop that allow to sell item in game for a ingame advantage for like 6 post, but if you want to change what i meant, yeah sure... retarded like you always do that

 

have fun, im sorry dat you mummy and your daddy don't give you money for your cosmetic item, really sorry... bye

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Posted

It's all about that the cash shop will not effect the gamedynamic... but there are some people, who will never ever understand that easy thing.

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Posted

i spoke about cash shop that allow to sell item in game for a ingame advantage for like 6 post, but if you want to change what i meant, yeah sure... retarded like you always do that

 

have fun, im sorry dat you mummy and your daddy don't give you money for your cosmetic item, really sorry... bye

"tell me a name of a game with a cash shop that didn't fail," You said it, not me.

But regardless I asked the question first. I'm not obligated to answer your question until you answer mine, but then you provided evidence for me so shit. The very top of the list you provided. A very successful MMO that's still going strong to this day. Guild Wars 2. I answered your question, so how about answering mine.

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Posted

It's all about that the cash shop will not effect the gamedynamic... but there are some people, who will never ever understand that easy thing.

Whether a cash shop negatively effects the game is entirely reliant on what they put in the cash shop, not whether or not cash shop items can be sold. As has been proven by countless MMOs.

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Posted (edited)

Whether a cash shop negatively effects the game is entirely reliant on what they put in the cash shop, not whether or not cash shop items can be sold. As has been proven by countless MMOs.

Just what I said...

Repeat: 

It's all about that the cash shop will not effect the gamedynamic... but there are some people, who will never ever understand that easy thing.

 
 

Edited by Bolf

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Posted

I agree I hope they add a daily login reward system

We get 'mileage' for daily logins.

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Posted

Just what I said...

Repeat: 

It's all about that the cash shop will not effect the gamedynamic... but there are some people, who will never ever understand that easy thing.

 
 

 

As you may have noticed these forums have a lot of very stubborn and willfully ignorant people. I like reiterating points that are especially true because of this.

Ultimately the entire problem stems from way too many people blaming problems on tradeable cash shop items. As I said several pages back it's false equivalence. It's not because cash shop items get sold that some MMOs fail, it's because those MMOs were flawed (archeage being the most recent example for me). Yet so many people wrongfully blame this cash shop system and actively try to remove it which in turn screws over thousands upon thousands of people. It's really quite sad. All the problems that kill an MMO still exist with or without this system, all they're doing is ADDING a problem by removing it.

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Posted

We get 'mileage' for daily logins.

o.o oh what Is that ?

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Posted

O.o oh what Is that ?

The cash shop where the actual P2W items are kept so it's not P2W. You get mileage points every day you log in which you can save up to buy these items. Everyone gets the same amount of points per day. The cash shop that takes real money is reserved for cosmetics and quality of life stuff because of this.

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Posted

It's a type or currency we use to buy items in the Mileage shop.

I agree I hope they add a daily login reward system

We get 'mileage' for daily logins.

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Posted (edited)

As you may have noticed these forums have a lot of very stubborn and willfully ignorant people. I like reiterating points that are especially true because of this.

Ultimately the entire problem stems from way too many people blaming problems on tradeable cash shop items. As I said several pages back it's false equivalence. It's not because cash shop items get sold that some MMOs fail, it's because those MMOs were flawed (archeage being the most recent example for me). Yet so many people wrongfully blame this cash shop system and actively try to remove it which in turn screws over thousands upon thousands of people. It's really quite sad. All the problems that kill an MMO still exist with or without this system, all they're doing is ADDING a problem by removing it.

Ok il bite..

First of all if u can't afford to buy a costume for like £10 or are too cheap to do so, you should probably re-think your lifes stratergy and maybe playing video games isn't what you should be doing with your time.

Secondly, the reason behind 99% of this community wanting cash shop  items not to be sellable is because it leads to pay2win. This game is extremely gear based with big rng elements. So lets look at KR version. I can buy multiple costumes and sell them on the auction house for 80 mil a pop. So after I receive the silver from selling my outfits, I can then go ahead and use that silver to buy a weapon far more powerful than yours in a extremely short amount of time, whilst you will have to spend weeks, even months to get the equivalent amount of silver.

"Wahhh but its rng and gear enchanting thats the problem" No. Mainly because everyone who actively plays the western version from the start without p2w will always be at a similar gear level. A few will get lucky and slightly get ahead but thats fine as its just luck. 

Also, for you to wear a costume doesn't affect your gameplay at all, it just makes you look pretty ( on the outside :P ). If we go by what you want, to allow cash shop items to be sell-able on the AH, it will greatly affect the gameplay as there will be fields of corpses left by those who heavily p2w. And yes you will be one of those corpses unless you keep up by buying and selling costumes.

Lastly, I see your extremely narrow minded but please think more before you spew your rubbish. Instead of asking for something so game breaking, ask for something that wont affect the entire game. Maybe something like, and npc who sells cash shop items for silver.. Its not hard.

I'll leave you this video to show the power of pay2win, cheerio. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELX4FkJL8Yc 

Edited by Vengeant
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Posted (edited)

Ok il bite..

First of all if u can't afford to buy a costume for like £10 or are too cheap to do so, you should probably re-think your lifes stratergy and maybe playing video games isn't what you should be doing with your time.

Secondly, the reason behind 99% of this community wanting cash shop  items not to be sellable is because it leads to pay2win. This game is extremely gear based with big rng elements. So lets look at KR version. I can buy multiple costumes and sell them on the auction house for 80 mil a pop. So after I receive the silver from selling my outfits, I can then go ahead and use that silver to buy a weapon far more powerful than yours in a extremely short amount of time, whilst you will have to spend weeks, even months to get the equivalent amount of silver.

"Wahhh but its rng and gear enchanting thats the problem" No. Mainly because everyone who actively plays without p2w will always be at a similar gear level. A few will get lucky and slightly get ahead but thats fine as its just luck. 

Also, for you to wear a costume doesn't affect your gameplay at all, it just makes you look pretty ( on the outside :P ). If we go by what you want, to allow cash shop items to be sell-able on the AH, it will greatly affect the gameplay as there will be fields of corpses left by those who heavily p2w. And yes you will be one of those corpses unless you keep up by buying and selling costumes.

Lastly, I see your extremely narrow minded but please think more before you spew your rubbish. Instead of asking for something so game breaking, ask for something that wont affect the entire game. Maybe something like, and npc who sells cash shop items for silver.. Its not hard.

I'll leave you this video to show the power of pay2win, cheerio. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELX4FkJL8Yc 

I'm sorry I don't have hundreds of dollars to throw at a video game. And no amount of "hurr ur living your life wrong" posts from you or anyone else will magically give me a better job. Christ the amount of disrespect you people have for others is just mind boggling.

As for your example, so? So you go and buy a weapon, so what? So you're better than me, specifically. You know who else has a weapon far more powerful than mine? THE PERSON WHO SOLD YOU THE WEAPON. You act like this gear just appears out of thin air. You're buying it from someone, meaning other people ALREADY have this gear. Other players ALREADY surpass me. One more player surpassing me doesn't effect my ability to play the game. Whether you surpassed me from months of grind or a day selling items on the AH, it doesn't matter because the end result is the exact same, you're still stronger than me. If there's already countless players with weapons far superior to my own, why the flying hell would I care that one more joins their ranks?

As for "everyone who actively plays without P2W will be at a similar level", is that so? So if I joined the korean servers right now I'd automatically be at their level? What if I play actively for a week, would I be at their level then? There will ALWAYS be people above you no matter how much you play. At least until you reach the ceiling, then you'll be equal with them. Just because you bought a bunch of players cash shop items and skipped the grind doesn't somehow change this undeniable fact. Nor does it change my ability to play and enjoy the game.

Answer me this, you say this will greatly affect the game. What's to stop the people who got their gear through grinding from doing the same thing? What's to stop them from ruining the game? Because it sounds to me like it's people having high tier gear that ruins the game in your mind. Your whole "corpses" thing, do you think players who grind their way to the top wont kill weaker players or something? Your logic is has more holes than swiss cheese.

As for your last point, take your own advice. How about YOU think. Your entire argument makes NO SENSE. "Hurr it's bad because it lets people get power quickly and they'll use that power to kill you" but this can happen even if you can't sell cash shop items. People will play more than I do, they'll grind more than I do. They'll get those +20 weapons and they'll kill me. This has NOTHING to do with selling cash shop items.

Even your video is further proof that your argument doesn't make sense. That player could have acquired all that gear without dropping a penny on the game and the people they're killing could have simply joined after they did and simply haven't caught up. Stronger players killing weaker players has literally NO relation to selling cash shop items.

It absolutely baffles me that you dare tell me to think things through when you're presenting an argument so disgustingly flawed.

 

P.S. That player nearly dies countless times in that video. If literally just two people focused them they'd have died. Truly a prime example of how overwhelming "P2W" is. In literally any MMO, even MMOs where you can't sell cash shop items, a fully geared maxed player can kill a group of weaker players fighting a mob and not fighting back. You're just further proving my point that this has literally nothing to do with selling cash shop items.

Edited by Colt556
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Posted

I'm sorry I don't have hundreds of dollars to throw at a video game. And no amount of "hurr ur living your life wrong" posts from you or anyone else will magically give me a better job. Christ the amount of disrespect you people have for others is just mind boggling.

As for your example, so? So you go and buy a weapon, so what? So you're better than me, specifically. You know who else has a weapon far more powerful than mine? THE PERSON WHO SOLD YOU THE WEAPON. You act like this gear just appears out of thin air. You're buying it from someone, meaning other people ALREADY have this gear. Other players ALREADY surpass me. One more player surpassing me doesn't effect my ability to play the game. Whether you surpassed me from months of grind or a day selling items on the AH, it doesn't matter because the end result is the exact same, you're still stronger than me. If there's already countless players with weapons far superior to my own, why the flying hell would I care that one more joins their ranks?

As for "everyone who actively plays without P2W will be at a similar level", is that so? So if I joined the korean servers right now I'd automatically be at their level? What if I play actively for a week, would I be at their level then? There will ALWAYS be people above you no matter how much you play. At least until you reach the ceiling, then you'll be equal with them. Just because you bought a bunch of players cash shop items and skipped the grind doesn't somehow change this undeniable fact. Nor does it change my ability to play and enjoy the game.

Answer me this, you say this will greatly affect the game. What's to stop the people who got their gear through grinding from doing the same thing? What's to stop them from ruining the game? Because it sounds to me like it's people having high tier gear that ruins the game in your mind. Your whole "corpses" thing, do you think players who grind their way to the top wont kill weaker players or something? Your logic is has more holes than swiss cheese.

As for your last point, take your own advice. How about YOU think. Your entire argument makes NO SENSE. "Hurr it's bad because it lets people get power quickly and they'll use that power to kill you" but this can happen even if you can't sell cash shop items. People will play more than I do, they'll grind more than I do. They'll get those +20 weapons and they'll kill me. This has NOTHING to do with selling cash shop items.

Even your video is further proof that your argument doesn't make sense. That player could have acquired all that gear without dropping a penny on the game and the people they're killing could have simply joined after they did and simply haven't caught up. Stronger players killing weaker players has literally NO relation to selling cash shop items.

It absolutely baffles me that you dare tell me to think things through when you're presenting an argument so disgustingly flawed.

 

P.S. That player nearly dies countless times in that video. If literally just two people focused them they'd have died. Truly a prime example of how overwhelming "P2W" is. In literally any MMO, even MMOs where you can't sell cash shop items, a fully geared maxed player can kill a group of weaker players fighting a mob and not fighting back. You're just further proving my point that this has literally nothing to do with selling cash shop items.

ur ignorance is unbelievable xD even tho ppl have told u how p2w badly effects this game u still dnt give a shit and want it, u truly r the cancer of this community..

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Posted

I would lie to see Indian accent and to have for dwarves Irish accent, it would be logical. Dwarves (like in Lienage 2) are famous with their drinks and are quite similar to irish in fact :) 

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Posted

ur ignorance is unbelievable xD even tho ppl have told u how p2w badly effects this game u still dnt give a shit and want it, u truly r the cancer of this community..

You did indeed tell me how P2W badly effects the game.

What you have NOT told me is what that has to do with selling cosmetic cash shop items.

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Posted

God.. i had a feel before clicking that link it will be that ranger. When will people stop posting that nonsense?

First of, he/she is geared, the others are not, or not all of them.

Secondly, there are barely a real fight going. The ranger just being a machinegun killing paper geared ppl. But when someone appears with better gear, the ranger runs. Sometimes even nearly dies.

Thirdly, this is in KR, they have different cash shop items, there are real P2W items in the cash shop. How can you even compare their cash shop item to ours, when it won't be the same?

 

What exactly that ranger won there? That guild killed the dragon at the end, the ranger ran away at the end and he/she did not achieve anything by killing some players over and over again.

I have no doubt that ranger is strong, he/she is. And yes, the ranger probably earned his/her power by selling cash shop items. Unfair in some way i admit that.

But the person did not win the game, he/she can be beaten.

 

As i said before, selling cash shop items can only save you time here. But can not win you the game.

And don't expect to see +18 or better items anytime soon, it won't happen. It also requires a lots of time and or silver to make one item +20. A person who can make a +20 item, probably has lots of silvers already. Regardless if they are whales or not.

 

I understand both side, and i don't mind either they enable or disable this thing. This is not a game breaking stuff for me, and i will enjoy my time either way.

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Posted

Im against something what is against me and rest players. Btw are you really idiot or you try to be? Look again my and rest arguments then think again.
For you special short version:1. Buy items via PA (real money)
2. sell to poor players by silver
3. buy best gear in game in less than 2 days beeing afk/offline

4. be happy poor player now need 3 months grinding to get similar but still worse gear than you because AH prices went up

THIS IS ------ING P2W...

I'm going to try and say this nicely once. No, you are mistaken.

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Posted

nice info, but im missing this infos in german infos..... i can english, but not each others, so i hope for the future, it will be an information in all sections of this forum, thx

 

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