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[Updated v2.0] Bounty Hunters, Karma, and Flagging Discussion

4,538 posts in this topic

Posted

i understand the need for something to stop players from trolling the way you described, but exp loss in most cases is going to be a one sided punishment, since players on a pk rampange will be at 0% anyway. 

so lets say i am grinding somewhere, and someone tries to kill me over and over and fails, he will lose no exp, while i will be at a constant threat of reversing my progress. is that even a bit fair ? 

there has to be another way to do this not involving exp.

Most players will continue to grind for xp as there's no cap and you will always need more skill points. 

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Posted (edited)

@CM_Jouska

I'm sorry, I know this thread is going to be blowing up with lots of replies here in a minute but I wanted to ask one more question that was brought up in a discussion with some friends. In the flow chart at this section

768d04113b.jpg

Is it possible that this means that if for some reason two players have pressed CTRL + C to flag up and decided to attack each other, would neither suffer karma loss on defeat? I know it's also said similarly here

  • If both players are flagged for PvP they can fight each other with no penalties.

But I just wanted some clarification to make sure that this applies to manual flagging with CTRL + C. If not, is it possible that this feature could be added to enable two players to technically have a duel out in the open world with no karma penalties? I think this as an addition would be another awesome thing to have in our version of the game =).

Edited by Kinto
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Posted

so much rules & punishments for a PvP game for pvping... imo a system is good to have but I only see the carebears replying to this forum so far

 

I agree with this quote and the rest I think is just plain wrong!

"Also, "No Penalty" for White and Yellow players? They have absolutely no risk when out and about; what are you trying to do here? If you make it this way, why in hell would anyone go red and kill white players? All the risk goes to the Red guy with ZERO REWARD for them being so bold. Come out of the closet Jouska, you and your team are a bunch of carebears aren't you!"

Well said my friend... well said... you have my +1

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Posted

Nobody would want to waste their karma taking away some poor guys progress, and if someone does that I'm sure there'll be plenty of people you can whisper in-game who will happily sort them out. I'll be one of them.

calling a big brother doesnt really solve my problem tbh :P

i couldnt care less if those ppl die or not.

the thing is, i dont have as much free time as i used to, so i kinda value it and really dont like to loose my stuff because some random guy had a bad day.

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Posted

i understand the need for something to stop players from trolling the way you described, but exp loss in most cases is going to be a one sided punishment, since players on a pk rampange will be at 0% anyway. 

so lets say i am grinding somewhere, and someone tries to kill me over and over and fails, he will lose no exp, while i will be at a constant threat of reversing my progress. is that even a bit fair ? 

there has to be another way to do this not involving exp.

You're talking as if pkers are mad dogs. You do realize that they have to progress in game too, right? To keep up with the rest of the players. And that means that they have to level up too. And that means that they will have exp to loose.

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Posted (edited)

I just hope this means I can stop reading people non stop complaining about how the game is dying.

Edited by Priya9
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Posted

Eyeroll.

This is exactly why people's concerns are well founded -- because this attitude emerges over stupid things like grinding spots.

It's a part of the game, and the devs continue to confirm it. They want to encourage player conflict, not prevent it, isn't that clear? Let's be honest here as well, pvper's (not people who pk simply to grief) are only asking for one thing. PvP'ers said sure leave karma but make it to where we can still play the game and they did. What is so wrong with that? Weren't pve'ers screaming lets compromise just a few days ago? Now that it's here, some can't take it.

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Posted

@CM_Jouska

I'm sorry, I know this thread is going to be blowing up with lots of replies here in a minute but I wanted to ask one more question that was brought up in a discussion with some friends. In the flow chart at this section

768d04113b.jpg

Is it possible that this means that if for some reason two players have pressed CTRL + C to flag up and decided to attack each other, would neither suffer karma loss on defeat? If not, is it possible that this feature could be added to enable two players to technically have a duel out in the open world with no karma penalties? I think this as an addition would be another awesome thing to have in our version of the game =).

Yes. If both are flagged and one get's killed, the attacker won't have any penalties.

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Posted (edited)

@CM_Jouska

I'm sorry, I know this thread is going to be blowing up with lots of replies here in a minute but I wanted to ask one more question that was brought up in a discussion with some friends. In the flow chart at this section

(pic)

Is it possible that this means that if for some reason two players have pressed CTRL + C to flag up and decided to attack each other, would neither suffer karma loss on defeat? If not, is it possible that this feature could be added to enable two players to technically have a duel out in the open world with no karma penalties? I think this as an addition would be another awesome thing to have in our version of the game =).

Yup, that's exactly how it works! Additionally, purples and reds can attack each other without punishment!

Edited by Edgelorde

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Posted

Dude, read again.

Clarification

  • Rogue and Outlaw players can PvP each other all they like with no penalties.
  • If both players are flagged for PvP they can fight each other with no penalties.
  • The [Feud-Buff] is granted to the Target if they are killed in PvP.
  • Enchant & Item loss has been removed.

Enchant is blackstone levels which would be an outrageous penalty. Items were things in your inventory as I understood it. Gems are different entirely. I don't think you have played this game if you are still confused here.

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Posted

calling a big brother doesnt really solve my problem tbh :P

i couldnt care less if those ppl die or not.

the thing is, i dont have as much free time as i used to, so i kinda value it and really dont like to loose my stuff because some random guy had a bad day.

With this system, you can defend yourself and if you win there is no punishment for it. Just fight back!

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Posted

I do feel like the red player punishment needs to be a TAD heavier, cause if you're at 0% exp and you got no gems there's like, no downside to dying unless the durability loss is permament.

Pretty much this. At this point, they may as well rid themselves of the PK system altogether because with this change, they practically made killing other players the norm. No clue why they would think this is a good idea. The devs in Wildstar tried to appease the "hardcore PvE players" and then nobody ended up playing the hardcore PvE content catered to this vocal minority. The same thing is pretty much happening here, except it's the self-proclaimed hardcore PvP players who are not grasping the bigger picture. Not that it's up to them to see the bigger picture - that's up to the devs. Hence I'm rather disappointed they don't seem to understand how significant these changes are. 

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Posted

You're talking as if pkers are mad dogs. You do realize that they have to progress in game too, right? To keep up with the rest of the players. And that means that they have to level up too. And that means that they will have exp to loose.

To be fair, have you read the commentary of some of the PKers on forums? That's a fair assessment of some of them lol.

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Posted

I just hope this means I can stop reading people non stop complainiing about how the game is dying.


Before it even releases...

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Posted

Well said my friend... well said... you have my +1

ahhh, hey he was quoting my statement in that post :P 

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Posted

i understand the need for something to stop players from trolling the way you described, but exp loss in most cases is going to be a one sided punishment, since players on a pk rampange will be at 0% anyway. 

so lets say i am grinding somewhere, and someone tries to kill me over and over and fails, he will lose no exp, while i will be at a constant threat of reversing my progress. is that even a bit fair ? 

there has to be another way to do this not involving exp.

Not if we want to exterminate griefing. Whites/yellows won't be able to intentionally feed negative karma. Purple/Red/White/Yellows will receive negative karma for going against yellows/whites who don't flag back for PvP.

For those who think the penalties are not harsh enough for reds, you have no idea what the h**l you're talking about. When you're unable to even enter a city to repair/use any vendor in the case you don't have any gems to break or items to lose, that alone will make RED still not worth having until you have cleansed your negative karma.

Your gear will break 10 times faster while fighting anything. Take a hint before going against a system that has a great potential right now. Better yet, stop trying so hard to fight against an open world pvp game.

 

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Posted

@CM_Jouska

I'm sorry, I know this thread is going to be blowing up with lots of replies here in a minute but I wanted to ask one more question that was brought up in a discussion with some friends. In the flow chart at this section

768d04113b.jpg

Is it possible that this means that if for some reason two players have pressed CTRL + C to flag up and decided to attack each other, would neither suffer karma loss on defeat? If not, is it possible that this feature could be added to enable two players to technically have a duel out in the open world with no karma penalties? I think this as an addition would be another awesome thing to have in our version of the game =).

I think this is what it means. And this is awesome.

But a clarification would help. Though it might take a while to get it...

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Posted (edited)

v2 is a great improvement. I like it! 

Now if the "assault karma" get's removed i suppose the PvP side at least will be satisfied.

Better not. It prevents pointless hit and run situations wich are only annoying in my opinion.

Edited by HoshPak

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Posted

How about if you're red then everytime you die you get a straight-up debuff (not a fancy one like bloody or feud, just weakened stats) for a while (like 20 mins maybe) as a punishment? Getting rid of the 2 huge punishments was nice but now it's too lenient on them!

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Posted

Eyeroll.

This is exactly why people's concerns are well founded -- because this attitude emerges over stupid things like grinding spots.

There is no cap, people will keep grinding. And if you're in the grinding spot I want, why shouldn't I attack you or your horse?

You can just defend yourself, can't you? If you can't deal with that you might aswell look for another spot.

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Posted

To be fair, have you read the commentary of some of the PKers on forums? That's a fair assessment of some of them lol.

Man... i can bark too. But i'm no lion... if you know what i mean xD

Small dogs bark the loudest.

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Posted

calling a big brother doesnt really solve my problem tbh :P

i couldnt care less if those ppl die or not.

the thing is, i dont have as much free time as i used to, so i kinda value it and really dont like to loose my stuff because some random guy had a bad day.

Totally understood, I work too.

But the thing is, with the new way party XP scales the most efficient way to grind is in a full party. Like a game I played called Rohan (back in the day it was fantastic before a lot of things ruined it that I won't go into), you logged in and asked in guild chat if there was room in a party. If not, you shouted out in chat or just turned up at areas to see if there's people there with room. You're not going to be grinding on your own too often. And you won't have to worry about all that crappy "no ty need a healer, actually no need this class you can't come" because that's not how the classes work in this game.

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Posted

[Feud] is in place to prevent the infinite negative karma game that can occur when a player who has been PK'd one time continuously returns to fight the attacker.

I understand the point people are making about no exp loss for a player at 0% of their level and I have noted it.  I want to also point out that while it may not be the solution, this means that the players progression is at a standstill, they do not have a means to level further and their progression restricted.  Regardless, I have noted the point and look forward to reading more feedback.

@Kinto Your assumption is correct, red+red=no karma loss

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Posted (edited)

Man... i can bark too. But i'm no lion... if you know what i mean xD

Small dogs bark the loudest.

Fair enough.
After we can always do what we do IRL with dogs that can't be controlled.
They get put down.

Edited by Priya9
Elaboration.

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Posted

no gem loss for white+yellow seems nice. also the lower pve loss looks nice.

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