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SHOULD COSTUMES BE SOLD ON AH FOR SILVER


578 posts in this topic

Posted

So your issue is you want to get costumes in game without paying real cash, that is why your pushing so hard to screw over our game.

Dude..I'll just buy you a gift card and we can be over this topic.

dude, don't fall for it.. He doesn't want just one dress, he wants all the dresses!

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Posted (edited)

Whales wont skyrocket past nolifers, so they will compete all the same. And you just said there's fewer whales than nolifers, so even if they did somehow skyrocket past they wouldn't be able to affect the game as a whole. All in all, your average player wont notice any difference whether cash shop items can be sold or not. Nothing changes for them. Whether it's whales or nolifers, there will be people above them trying to be dicks.

Have you ever played LLSIF? That game has one of the strongest whale communities, ever. There are people, that literally waste hundreds, if not thousands of dollars every month, just to get preety cards with their favourite waifus. Now, the difference is, a free player (no matter how lucky with free/loveca draws) won't stand a chance with their premade teams, since the difference between any average peasant's idol team and P2W teams oscillates around 100-150k, minimum. Thus, they always occupy the top of the event lists and nab all the rewards, drastically increasing the competition and toxicity for the rest of playerbase below.

P2W and whales are becoming a real issue in all MP-oriented games nowadays. Especially those, which include a competitive sort of playstyle.

Edited by Narcosis

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Posted

So your issue is you want to get costumes in game without paying real cash, that is why your pushing so hard to screw over our game.

Dude..I'll just buy you a gift card and we can be over this topic.

 

Or better yet i'll introduce you to this thing called a job and work. You'll be able to pay for all the little trinkets yourself without paying in game. Then you can use your silver in game to be the best casual ever.

If you buy me one costume per class I will freely drop this. I'm not a fashionista, I don't need to constantly change my looks. As long as I look decent I'm content. So hey, if you're offering I aint gonna say no.

P.S. I have a job, but if you're offering one of those I'll take that too.

Have you ever played LLSIF? That game has one of the strongest whale communities, ever. There are people, that literally waste hundreds, if not thousands of dollars every month, just to get preety cards with their favourite waifus. Now, the difference is, a free player (no matter how lucky with free/loveca draws) won't stand a chance with their premade teams, since the difference between any average peasant's idol team and P2W teams oscillates around 100-150k, minimum. Thus, they always occupy the top of the event lists and nab all the rewards, drastically increasing the competition and toxicity for the rest of playerbase below.

P2W and whales are becoming a real issue in all MP-oriented games nowadays. Especially those, which include a competitive sort of playstyle.

And I'd be willing to wager you can just straight up buy power in that game. The ability to sell costumes may help you slightly but you are still limited by the same limitations as everyone else. If your enchant fails you still get knocked down, shit like that. You can't just buy your way to the top. There's also the monthly spending limit. You wont be able to drop thousands of dollars a month, it wont be possible. And according to the ever reliable kouzan a single +20 item costs around 3-4 billion to get. The whales would have a max of 500m every month. At that rate it would take them 8 months and 4500 dollars to get one single +20 piece of gear.

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Posted

Didn't read any of this thread, but the answer is no.

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Posted

If you buy me one costume per class I will freely drop this. I'm not a fashionista, I don't need to constantly change my looks. As long as I look decent I'm content. So hey, if you're offering I aint gonna say no.

P.S. I have a job, but if you're offering one of those I'll take that too.

No I understand that you want to earn costumes through in game means, that isn't what you want though is someone to profit from in game means. We want this game to last long term, and most of us who have put hours and hours into games like archeage do not want another pay to win, It is the sole reason I wouldnt stay on KR servers with my current already leveled characters.

Instead why not focus your attempts on a better measure to fix the issue, making sure some costumes exist through in game obtainable means. At least one decent looking one per class wouldn't hurt their market, as they can continually develop cool new costumes, and it doesn't need to be the ones that hide your name or whatnot which will be another game add on to pay for.

Can just be a decent one, for the said class each.

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Posted

No I understand that you want to earn costumes through in game means, that isn't what you want though is someone to profit from in game means. We want this game to last long term, and most of us who have put hours and hours into games like archeage do not want another pay to win, It is the sole reason I wouldnt stay on KR servers with my current already leveled characters.

Instead why not focus your attempts on a better measure to fix the issue, making sure some costumes exist through in game obtainable means. At least one decent looking one per class wouldn't hurt their market, as they can continually develop cool new costumes, and it doesn't need to be the ones that hide your name or whatnot which will be another game add on to pay for.

Can just be a decent one, for the said class each.

As I've explained before I'm fine with any method that allows me an alternate route to access cosmetic stuff. The problem is those alternative ideas don't actually generate any money for the devs. It's literally giving things away for free. I mean, if the devs are willing then yeah, sure, that's fine by me.

In literally every MMO I've played the gear you grind for generally looks different and late-game gear generally looks wildly different. So in those games you can cobble something together that looks presentable just by playing the game. BDO doesn't do that. I may not be a fashionista but I still want my warrior in full plate with a swanky helmet, or my wizard in sexy robes. Most MMOs allow me to do that just by playing normally. BDO doesn't.

I, personally, like sellable cash shop items because it allows me to indirectly fund the game. I can't afford to spend real money on this, other dude can, so we work out a trade. But I'm not above getting free shit either. As long as my character doesn't look like a starter peasant I'm content. Whether that's by buying cash shop items off the AH, or some quest gear that actually looks decent, or some npc that gives out a free costume as a sample, as long as there's SOMETHING I can do, I'm happy.

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Posted

Very VERY few people can be a nolife whale. Very few people can have the money needed to buy their way to the top and still have the time to spend all day everyday grinding. So the few that do this would still be unable to affect the overall game and you certainly wouldn't get an entire guild of them. Their rarity isn't a benefit for them, it's a negative. They'd get taken down. All the meaningful ways they could impact others would be blocked by guilds. Say nolifers/whales reach +18. Say a nolife whale got +20. Great, but he's still one guy and he will never have the influence or control those guilds will. At best he can go around kill people, become a red player, eventually die because he gets swarmed and lose his gear or something. It's just not a big deal and doesn't affect the overall game.

It doesn't take an entire guild. It takes one or two in a guild to be able to do it. I used to play with a few guys who regularly bought gold for their entire guild in Aion and not just a little gold either. Every person in the guild was as decked as we could be with gear that was purchasable, and we could have easily bought the top gear if it was possible. We could have owned the server. The only thing that saved it was the fact that no lifing was the only way to get the top gear, thus despite our masses of gold, other guilds were still competitive. I didn't stick in that guild or game for that long after that. It actually made me sick how easy it was.

Oh add in with the current karma change being pushed, going red doesn't mean you lose anything substantial.

And again, it does effect the game. Even if it doesn't happen. The game already has a reputation of p2w. Stories of how far whales can get just by throwing money at the game doesn't do anything to change that perception. It actually just reinforces it. It scaring off customers that would potentially buy. It is basically just shooting itself in the foot. Reputation and perception play a huge role on how the game is received and grows.

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Posted

It doesn't take an entire guild. It takes one or two in a guild to be able to do it. I used to play with a few guys who regularly bought gold for their entire guild in Aion and not just a little gold either. Every person in the guild was as decked as we could be with gear that was purchasable, and we could have easily bought the top gear if it was possible. We could have owned the server. The only thing that saved it was the fact that no lifing was the only way to get the top gear, thus despite our masses of gold, other guilds were still competitive. I didn't stick in that guild or game for that long after that. It actually made me sick how easy it was.

Oh add in with the current karma change being pushed, going red doesn't mean you lose anything substantial.

And again, it does effect the game. Even if it doesn't happen. The game already has a reputation of p2w. Stories of how far whales can get just by throwing money at the game doesn't do anything to change that perception. It actually just reinforces it. It scaring off customers that would potentially buy. It is basically just shooting itself in the foot. Reputation and perception play a huge role on how the game is received and grows.

Reputation is tarnished either way. I mean, a reputation of "nolifer can get +20 gear that takes a year to get and can solo entire guilds!" isn't exactly going to draw in the players either. So it always comes back to the gear and the grind needed to get it. Fix that and nobody will complain about P2W, same way all the other MMOs with this system can do just fine.

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Posted (edited)

As I've explained before I'm fine with any method that allows me an alternate route to access cosmetic stuff. The problem is those alternative ideas don't actually generate any money for the devs. It's literally giving things away for free. I mean, if the devs are willing then yeah, sure, that's fine by me.

In literally every MMO I've played the gear you grind for generally looks different and late-game gear generally looks wildly different. So in those games you can cobble something together that looks presentable just by playing the game. BDO doesn't do that. I may not be a fashionista but I still want my warrior in full plate with a swanky helmet, or my wizard in sexy robes. Most MMOs allow me to do that just by playing normally. BDO doesn't.

I, personally, like sellable cash shop items because it allows me to indirectly fund the game. I can't afford to spend real money on this, other dude can, so we work out a trade. But I'm not above getting free shit either. As long as my character doesn't look like a starter peasant I'm content. Whether that's by buying cash shop items off the AH, or some quest gear that actually looks decent, or some npc that gives out a free costume as a sample, as long as there's SOMETHING I can do, I'm happy.

Although it will not HURT the devs to provide one costume each, even archeage promoted costumes through means not in the cash shop (Ooooh ONE Costume set through mileage? Just log in daily to collect and get a costume for maybe 3000 mileage?) the development team will earn plenty of cash shop money but I for one will put it this way.

 

If they allow selling on the marketplace, I will continue with my 99 dollar package and play till its not worth playing (like archeage) if they prove to me the game isn't p2w, i will likely buy several costumes and cosmetic items over top to continue to support the game monthly. (Like a subscription but not)

Games I spent the MOST on in cash shop, were not to gain through p2w.

Gw2 I have spent 300 on (Including the purchase price)

Aftermath I spent close to 500 on (RNG costumes got me hooked)

Archeage I spent 49 got permanent owl, and 20 dollars once or twice for subscriptions to keep up when I didnt buy in game apex for it. Either way I had friends who spent hundreds and hundreds of dollars and couldnt get anything competitive to others in the game.

BDO currently spent 121 (99 pack and 3 KR accounts at 7 a piece)

Edited by Maelvogar

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Posted (edited)

Although it will not HURT the devs to provide one costume each, even archeage promoted costumes through means not in the cash shop (Ooooh ONE Costume set through mileage? Just log in daily to collect and get a costume for maybe 3000 mileage?) the development team will earn plenty of cash shop money but I for one will put it this way.

 

If they allow selling on the marketplace, I will continue with my 99 dollar package and play till its not worth playing (like archeage) if they prove to me the game isn't p2w, i will likely buy several costumes and cosmetic items over top to continue to support the game monthly. (Like a subscription but not)

Games I spent the MOST on in cash shop, were not to gain through p2w.

Gw2 I have spent 300 on (Including the purchase price)

Aftermath I spent close to 500 on (RNG costumes got me hooked)

Archeage I spent 0 on

BDO currently spent 121 (99 pack and 3 KR accounts at 7 a piece)

The problem with limited things like that is tastes are subjective. Me, personally, I like big full plate armor with completely enclosed helmets. So like, when you see the guy you can't see even the slightest trace of skin, he's like a big knightly golem or something. So that's what I tend to go for (and I'm glad BDO has designs to accommodate that). But not everyone shares that view. Some people want their warrior to look different. So if there's only one costume, some people can get it, everyone else gets shafted. I'm fine with the 'one costume' thing as long as I get to pick the costume. If I'm only allowed one costume and it's ugly, then I'm back to square one where I look like a starter peasant and have no way of changing that.

I do wish gear wasn't so broken, though. Literally the only reason this is even an issue is because BDO has a stupid gear scaling system. If gear was balanced there wouldn't be a problem.

Edited by Colt556

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Posted (edited)

Reputation is tarnished either way. I mean, a reputation of "nolifer can get +20 gear that takes a year to get and can solo entire guilds!" isn't exactly going to draw in the players either. So it always comes back to the gear and the grind needed to get it. Fix that and nobody will complain about P2W, same way all the other MMOs with this system can do just fine.

Again, a no lifer doing such is a much more respected outcome of playing a game. People in general do not view that as a problem. They aren't fixing the gear gap, so it is pretty pointless to keep going back to that. What they did fix, was the ability to whale and get it.

Edited by Noth

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Posted

Again, a no lifer doing such is a much more respected outcome of playing a game. People in general do not view that as a problem.

Nolifers are never respected. Humans are inherently petty. The only time nolifers are shown any respect is when there's a bigger enemy, I.E. whales. You remove whales and people will look on the nolifers with all the disdain they would have held for the whales. At the end of the day people don't like others lording over them. I have never played an MMO where nolifers weren't looked down on.

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Nolifers are never respected. Humans are inherently petty. The only time nolifers are shown any respect is when there's a bigger enemy, I.E. whales. You remove whales and people will look on the nolifers with all the disdain they would have held for the whales. At the end of the day people don't like others lording over them. I have never played an MMO where nolifers weren't looked down on.

Sigh... please show me where people moan and complain to the point of leaving games over no lifers. I haven't seen it anywhere, even in this game. I have seen people leave over even the possibility of p2w.

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Posted

Yeah, no P2W ever please. It'll do nothing but hurt this game. You want to avoid it at all costs in NA. Only people who plan to P2W really want it.

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Nolifers are never respected. Humans are inherently petty. The only time nolifers are shown any respect is when there's a bigger enemy, I.E. whales. You remove whales and people will look on the nolifers with all the disdain they would have held for the whales. At the end of the day people don't like others lording over them. I have never played an MMO where nolifers weren't looked down on.

I think the answer is git gud.  You can't get mad at somebody because the time they put into something has given them better results.  That's like getting mad at somebody that's really good at guitar because they have spent 20 years playing and you can't play the song's they do when you have only been playing for a month.

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NO!

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Sigh... please show me where people moan and complain to the point of leaving games over no lifers. I haven't seen it anywhere, even in this game. I have seen people leave over even the possibility of p2w.

Show me where people moan and complain over whales. Whales are only bad if the game is set up bad. Set it up properly and whales are as uninfluential as nolifers.

I think the answer is git gud.  You can't get mad at somebody because the time they put into something has given them better results.  That's like getting mad at somebody that's really good at guitar because they have spent 20 years playing and you can't play the song's they do when you have only been playing for a month.

I don't care about nolifers, I practice what I preach and couldn't care less how someone else spends their time. I'm just saying nolifers are looked down on.As far as I'm concerned they paid for the game, they have every right to enjoy it. That's why I'm also perfectly fine with whales, same exact logic applies to them.

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NO!

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No! It will be same like in ArcheAge, people with $, are the best.

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The problem with limited things like that is tastes are subjective. Me, personally, I like big full plate armor with completely enclosed helmets. So like, when you see the guy you can't see even the slightest trace of skin, he's like a big knightly golem or something. So that's what I tend to go for (and I'm glad BDO has designs to accommodate that). But not everyone shares that view. Some people want their warrior to look different. So if there's only one costume, some people can get it, everyone else gets shafted. I'm fine with the 'one costume' thing as long as I get to pick the costume. If I'm only allowed one costume and it's ugly, then I'm back to square one where I look like a starter peasant and have no way of changing that.

I do wish gear wasn't so broken, though. Literally the only reason this is even an issue is because BDO has a stupid gear scaling system. If gear was balanced there wouldn't be a problem.

this is finally where you start discussing something that may actually help the game and the player community. Generally when a player has an issue with bow a game plays out and that issue can be solved by throwing money at the developers, it indicates a much deeper and more serious problem.

and this issue is one many people agree with. A general lack of content in the game. Whether it is unfinished game systems, lack of motivational or inventive related rewards to playing, or more superficial such as the piss poor selection of armor and weapon skins, this is a serious problem and needs to be addressed.

 

P2W isn't a solution, it is just adding another game breaking problem to a system which can't really stand any more core issues. Does BDO actually deliver to the customer value equivalent to the entry price?

For 30 bucks, the answer is definitely yes. For 50 or 100, that becomes highly questionable. But if you'd like the guys upstairs to listen to you, it helps to be part of the group they NEED to satisfy in order to succeed.

That isn't PVE or PVP players, it's the group that has played games for a while and is willing to spend money for justifiable quality content. You've immediately discounted yourself from that group when you say you aren't willing to pay in any extra money. Sometimes being a contributor to established publications and gaming websites also helps.

 

The game definitely needs more rewards and better integrated play systems. Tossing money at the devs won't help, but taking a principled stance of "let's wait and see" and paying in extra when they actually show you some results will fix your and many other player's problems much faster than saying, "I don't want to pay any more, but I want to get more."

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Posted

this is finally where you start discussing something that may actually help the game and the player community. Generally when a player has an issue with bow a game plays out and that issue can be solved by throwing money at the developers, it indicates a much deeper and more serious problem.

and this issue is one many people agree with. A general lack of content in the game. Whether it is unfinished game systems, lack of motivational or inventive related rewards to playing, or more superficial such as the piss poor selection of armor and weapon skins, this is a serious problem and needs to be addressed.

 

P2W isn't a solution, it is just adding another game breaking problem to a system which can't really stand any more core issues. Does BDO actually deliver to the customer value equivalent to the entry price?

For 30 bucks, the answer is definitely yes. For 50 or 100, that becomes highly questionable. But if you'd like the guys upstairs to listen to you, it helps to be part of the group they NEED to satisfy in order to succeed.

That isn't PVE or PVP players, it's the group that has played games for a while and is willing to spend money for justifiable quality content. You've immediately discounted yourself from that group when you say you aren't willing to pay in any extra money. Sometimes being a contributor to established publications and gaming websites also helps.

 

The game definitely needs more rewards and better integrated play systems. Tossing money at the devs won't help, but taking a principled stance of "let's wait and see" and paying in extra when they actually show you some results will fix your and many other player's problems much faster than saying, "I don't want to pay any more, but I want to get more."

Well then by all means, pay them more and provide us with a system that doesn't mandate you pay extra money just to not look like a starter peasant. I'm incapable of joining you on this endeavor but I wish you the best of luck.

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Show me where people moan and complain over whales. Whales are only bad if the game is set up bad. Set it up properly and whales are as uninfluential as nolifers.

 

You are posting in a thread that has had a lot of it.

Secondly the fact that the devs removed what was causing people to moan over whales (selling Cash shop items on the AH), shows that people were in fact moaing over it in great amounts.

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You are posting in a thread that has had a lot of it.

Secondly the fact that the devs removed what was causing people to moan over whales (selling Cash shop items on the AH), shows that people were in fact moaing over it in great amounts.

Meanwhile other games have hundreds of thousands of players with systems like this. Including open world pvp games. Seems to me BDO's just got a very negative community.

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Meanwhile other games have hundreds of thousands of players with systems like this. Including open world pvp games. Seems to me BDO's just got a very negative community.

And again those games have fundamental design differences, differences in things that simply aren't changing in this game.

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And again those games have fundamental design differences, differences in things that simply aren't changing in this game.

And there's that negativity. You guys celebrated them removing the "P2W" as proof they listen. Why not trust them to tweak some numbers so that "P2W" isn't an issue to begin with?

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