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RNG too brutal for game to ever be popular

261 posts in this topic

Posted

Gramps test to see if you're on a lucky day:

Log in.

Get 2 Ogre Rings

Try to PRI them on 0 failstacks.

If you succeed, then your hidden lucky bit is set, if you fail, well, repeat and rinse :) (but reset the failstack enchanting a grunil gearpiece)

PS: maybe don't use Ogre Rings but something cheaper :):):) 

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Posted

hi guys,

 i actually agree with you but there are two major things about it.

1) What happen if Daum change the accesorry progression system? And people who had painfully enchanted to tri MoS or WE will be pissed off.... How to solve this?

2) We need clarification of enchanting system and how failstacks work! We need answer on this. This is the most important think. Because you will see the true behind this. I dont mind to blow my accessory if i know that i had 66% change and failed. Iam use to it by playing Lineage 2 (game wich is really similar to BDO, and after 12 years ppl are still palying it) So just dont ruin RNG but please clarify it.

Thanks 

@CM_Praballo @CM_Jouska @CM_Tytyes

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Posted

In this case it's probably not worse, actually. Tell the playerbase that their account might be doomed to never see those Bheg's gloves, or that Kzarka drop (just got mine today =O), and they'll start quitting hand over fist. You basically create a situation where people have valid reason to assume the worst, because they've been told that it's possible, and they can't verify the truth of their standing in the luck ranks.

Telling people the truth here would probably be the right thing to do, but it's actually far safer to let there be rumors than to confirm that entire accounts are just bad eggs. 

I know. It is depressing either way ¬¬

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Posted

In this case it's probably not worse, actually. Tell the playerbase that their account might be doomed to never see those Bheg's gloves, or that Kzarka drop (just got mine today =O), and they'll start quitting hand over fist. You basically create a situation where people have valid reason to assume the worst, because they've been told that it's possible, and they can't verify the truth of their standing in the luck ranks.

Telling people the truth here would probably be the right thing to do, but it's actually far safer to let there be rumors than to confirm that entire accounts are just bad eggs. 

mm if it's proven this secret account based RNG luck stat, it may be considered as fraud, you're selling a discriminatory service/rigged gamble, they should get infos on this, and eventually make devs revert it (even leaving the thing, but simply equalizing for every account). Then say to the playerbase: it was just an hoax.

 

 

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Posted

GAUSSIAN DISTRIBUTION!

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Posted

Gramps test to see if you're on a lucky day:

Log in.

Get 2 Ogre Rings

Try to PRI them on 0 failstacks.

If you succeed, then your hidden lucky bit is set, if you fail, well, repeat and rinse :) (but reset the failstack enchanting a grunil gearpiece)

PS: maybe don't use Ogre Rings but something cheaper :):):) 

Pls hand me some ogre rings to do some testing. For the science. 

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Posted

I am with crowed that thinks it is bad.   There should be no reverse progression in an mmo.

An idea that could make both sides happy.  First your main enchanted item never gets destroyed.

How it would work.  First item at single.  To get prI you put one in.  50% chance to pri.  Fail you lose the one you put in.  Second try is 100%.   To go to duo.  First attempt 25%.  Second 50%.  Third 75% and forth 100%.   It keeps doubling.  Tri 8 and then 16, the 32.

You still have your ring chance, but the unlucky will eventually get there.

I believe most of kr rng is for cash shop grabs that we don't like here.  Buying failstacks, etc.

My opinion.

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Posted

I am with crowed that thinks it is bad.   There should be no reverse progression in an mmo.

An idea that could make both sides happy.  First your main enchanted item never gets destroyed.

How it would work.  First item at single.  To get prI you put one in.  50% chance to pri.  Fail you lose the one you put in.  Second try is 100%.   To go to duo.  First attempt 25%.  Second 50%.  Third 75% and forth 100%.   It keeps doubling.  Tri 8 and then 16, the 32.

You still have your ring chance, but the unlucky will eventually get there.

I believe most of kr rng is for cash shop grabs that we don't like here.  Buying failstacks, etc.

My opinion.

Agree on losing just one of the 2 accessories used during the enchantment, would at least paliate the rage.

Not so sure about such high %,  thou they'd be paliated by the difficulty to gather the original thing, but this will mean lowering chances on elite accessories to even more small levels than current ones. (e.g. Oger rings will stop dropping).

Won't necessarily be a bad thing, we would probably end up with just 2 or 3 really high stats/level accessories x server, but we would probably lose the vast numbers of ppl sitting on un-enchanted elite things (I'm thinking about people roaming with MoS or Oger Rings without the minimal intention of enchanting them). So basically the gap caused by RNG would widen.

Again if the difference in power given was a bit more balanced, things would be differents.

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Posted (edited)

What I find a little funny about this amount of RNG is back when SWTOR launched it distributed it's upper tier PvP gear through RNG.

You would compete in the warzones (their version of battlegrounds) and through participation would receive commendations. You had to farm these then turn them in to get a bag, which would have a chance of containing broken gear piece you could get fixed into usable gear. It was not at all uncommon to have to open many bags to get usable gear, nor was it uncommon to wind up receiving gear you already had which was then utterly useless.

Not only that, but the PvP gear earned this way scaled quite sharply. They would suddenly become stronger and more effective not because they were better players, but simply because they got lucky.

Players absolutely hated this, to the point of people quitting. BioWare hurried to lessen the defeating RNG within months of release, but many players had already burned themselves out with that RNG grind.

The hate of RNG existed before SWTOR launched at the end of 2011, but that was a pretty high profile game where the RNG was a huge complaint before it was addressed. It's like Pearl Abyss ignores lessons past MMO's have had to learn. Not just on the RNG front, but in general... for example, launching in NA/EU with client-side data when past MMO's have run into so much trouble with that.

Edited by scau

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Posted

System is too harsh, should only lose the one item not both

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Posted

The problem is that there's nothing to do but upgrade rings right now and not enough people farming them.

 

Instead of burning yourself out on that aspect you should be focusing on things like life skills and preparing for +20 not wasting millions on minor ring upgrades. 

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Posted

I agree RNG is bruta, not only for accessories but pretty much everything in this game is RNG lol.

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Posted

Isn't an item coming in Valencia that lets you attempt to upgrade your accessory without the chance of losing the accessory? Instead if you fail you just lose the item. Can't remember the name of it but remember somebody talking about it on reddit, if so this could solve your RNG problems.

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Posted

This game is pure RNG ;) If u dont like RNG u have to leave this game

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Posted

Isn't an item coming in Valencia that lets you attempt to upgrade your accessory without the chance of losing the accessory? Instead if you fail you just lose the item. Can't remember the name of it but remember somebody talking about it on reddit, if so this could solve your RNG problems.

It's called a cron stone but I think the costs are so astronomical that it's better to just risk it, even with bad luck.  

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Posted (edited)

hi guys,

 i actually agree with you but there are two major things about it.

1) What happen if Daum change the accesorry progression system? And people who had painfully enchanted to tri MoS or WE will be pissed off.... How to solve this?

They played the game, accepted its rules by the time, that's it.

 

This game is pure RNG ;) If u dont like RNG u have to leave this game

And if a lot of player leave the game because RNG is not for them then the game will close and both me both you, regardless of what we think we'll have to leave the game too.
Or maybe it will survive, but will get minimum development funds, just to barely keep it alive, cash shop will become even harsher and we'll have to suck it up, 
regardless of what we think about RNG.

Edited by Nessuno

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Posted

It's called a cron stone but I think the costs are so astronomical that it's better to just risk it, even with bad luck.  

Oh right, I heard they were only going to be 1m each.

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Posted (edited)

How is it unfair? You and your friend work with the same rng you had the same chances it just didn't work out. This is what rng is about it is also not biased(if it is random) and because of this can not be unfair. Stop whining. 

He has a legitimate complaint. Stop being a troll.

BDO in comparaison with L2 is softcore at best, that's for sure.

Thing is most people playing BDO now are born in the WoW era, where everything needs to be handed to them in a silver plate with no effort whatsover. Can't blame them since they never experienced the golden age where mmo had a much larger lifespan and was more about the travel itself than the end. People now just devour games and move on to the next in a month.

The market has evolved and expanded, and many gamers are now sophisticated and discerning enough to indentify terrible mechanics and speak out against them. The golden age you refer to is simply a time in which there was not enough competition to pull people away from the punishing games that were more like a tedious job than an actual game.

From what I can tell, most people value their time and prefer to actually enjoy the games they are playing. A small minority (likely including you) of masochists might indeed enjoy getting reamed by punishing progression systems, but game publishers who want their games to appeal to a wider market should not be catering to the masochistic demographic lost in rose-tinted trips down memory lane..

Edited by Nefelia
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Posted

Oh right, I heard they were only going to be 1m each.

yea 1m each but need a bunch to guarantee the gear does not break. I have no clue how much it would cost to save a blue accessory though. Cant find a chart and only examples I've heard is need a couple thousand to save like a TET ogre. So like needed 2.5 bil silver worth of cron stones to not break a a TET ogre. Obviously lower lvl items at lower lvl should cost significantly less. But I guess we won't know until we get it 

This game is pure RNG ;) If u dont like RNG u have to leave this game

And that's what plenty of people have been doing. A game with an already low population should probably not want more people quiting.

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Posted

I am with crowed that thinks it is bad.   There should be no reverse progression in an mmo.

An idea that could make both sides happy.  First your main enchanted item never gets destroyed.

How it would work.  First item at single.  To get prI you put one in.  50% chance to pri.  Fail you lose the one you put in.  Second try is 100%.   To go to duo.  First attempt 25%.  Second 50%.  Third 75% and forth 100%.   It keeps doubling.  Tri 8 and then 16, the 32.

You still have your ring chance, but the unlucky will eventually get there.

I believe most of kr rng is for cash shop grabs that we don't like here.  Buying failstacks, etc.

My opinion.

Everyone would have PENT in a few weeks. The whole point of the way BDO is designed is never ending progression. There will never be more than 1-5 people who have Pent: anything, much less a huge item like a penta Ogre ring. I would expect no more than 15 people across all servers with a +20 weapon even after a few months. That's how hard it is to get. 

Getting a full set of Duo jewelry is an accomplishment. Getting a full set of TRIO is the absolute end-game for 99% of the playerbase. There won't be a full set of TET for a very very very long time, and never a full set of Pent.

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Posted

Everyone would have PENT in a few weeks. The whole point of the way BDO is designed is never ending progression. There will never be more than 1-5 people who have Pent: anything, much less a huge item like a penta Ogre ring. I would expect no more than 15 people across all servers with a +20 weapon even after a few months. That's how hard it is to get. 

Getting a full set of Duo jewelry is an accomplishment. Getting a full set of TRIO is the absolute end-game for 99% of the playerbase. There won't be a full set of TET for a very very very long time, and never a full set of Pent.

huh, I just have to reach full TRI and +18 across the board and I can basically say I'm a demigod? Well at least I have goals now.

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Posted (edited)

It's brutal because nobody is supposed to have a PEN set.

Just use your brain for a second, how much AP is a full PEN set of accessories? 15*4+10+35= 105

A full set of easily obtainable DUO? 9*4+7+20= 63

 

KR players have 250 AP+ average. 40 AP is like 15% damage but the PEN set would cost literally trillions on average to make compared to a DUO set which would be a couple of billions. A single PEN MoS you're looking at between 100-200 billion to make, I know because I did all the maths on every single item optimal enchantment strategy.

 

I don't know why people are complaining about PRI enchant... Like if you don't even have 25million to throw away, why the fk are you gambling for 2 AP?

Edited by Featherine

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Posted (edited)

huh, I just have to reach full TRI and +18 across the board and I can basically say I'm a demigod? Well at least I have goals now.

Not quite a demigod, but with that you won't ever fall behind or be at such a big disadvantage a smidgeon of skill can't overcome it, even against the lucky few who do get to +19 on some of their pieces, or the one special snowflake who YOLO +20'd his weapon

Edited by Walk

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Posted

RNG is a clever word developers use to hide shitty mechanics.

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Posted

Everyone would have PENT in a few weeks. The whole point of the way BDO is designed is never ending progression. There will never be more than 1-5 people who have Pent: anything, much less a huge item like a penta Ogre ring. I would expect no more than 15 people across all servers with a +20 weapon even after a few months. That's how hard it is to get. 

Getting a full set of Duo jewelry is an accomplishment. Getting a full set of TRIO is the absolute end-game for 99% of the playerbase. There won't be a full set of TET for a very very very long time, and never a full set of Pent.

Well the way they have it now is progression is ending rather quickly for a lot of players. They are either refusing to try and progress due to RNG or have quit. So their idea of never ending progression kind of backfired.

And your second part of you comment is also a very bad issue. So only a very few players will ever reach the best gear and it is entirely due to luck. Do you not see a problem with that in a PVP game? Some player out there will be astronomically more powerful than I am because he simply got lucky. And yes they are way way more powerful due to scaling of AP and +16-+20 armor, which are much more steeply curved then 1-15. They literally one shot everyone in be game at that point. Man sounds like a blast to me 😒

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