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WTF are you actually winning when you buy dyes?

167 posts in this topic

Posted

The thread is basically about as close to this: That its ok that its P2W. GG community, Good game.

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Posted

Holy shit, i didn't they would introduce buyable silver with real money that fast.

Didn't they say that would not be in this version? This game will end up like archage, where with enough money, you can buy/upgrade your gear to endgame within a day without actually doing anything ingame :(

What a shame.

I also don't understand how so many people are ok with this...This will just be the first step.

Sorry that you don't understand how the English language works, perhaps you should focus more on that rather than getting so emotional over someone proving you wrong. :) P2W is giving and advantage to paying customers that is NOT available to free customers, which is true here as you can buy dyes with loyalty points. There's also the fact that the dyes are RNG, so a paying customers could get nothing whilst a loyalty customers can get a rare dye (and vice versa). 

It highly depends on how frequent it is avialable for not paying customers, as it is basically unlimited for the paying folks (if we assume it's a whale). The difference is so huge that it makes it p2w imo.

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Posted

Inb4 BDO switches to the F2P model. Kek.

I swear it almost feels like people here have never played any other MMO besides BDO. People have and will spend thousands on gamble boxes and these RANDOM(gamble) dye boxes are no different. Just wait and see... dyes will skyrocket once this event dies down. I can guarantee people are already stockpiling sellable dyes. If they put price caps on the dyes so they cannot go past 3mil then I'd have no problem with them. My main beef with this is if they can do this what will they make sellable next? Costumes? Pets? Etc? This is only the beginning of a downhill slope. I'm still giving the game a chance though, since this is rather mild. I'll just wait and see what they do next.

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Posted

Actually I spent 3k loyalties on dyes so I can sell on the market, made only 15m. But on the other hand I spent $1k on pearls for dyes, made 400m already. So disposable income FTW!

You spent $1000 just to earn quick in-game cash?  It's your money, yeah, but this is what this company is going for.. shameless to be using this kind of tactic to suck out money from gullible players.

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Posted

So...question I have to ask.  Who pays several million for one single dye item...?  The only ones I can see that happening with is pure white and black (especially black).  Otherwise, who would pay that much for a one-time use item?

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Posted

I hope the devs investigate all accounts speaking against this system for rmt. Cause I can only see this chance to sell dyes thats maybe like 1 in 50 as a threat to gold supplyer rmt people.

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Posted

You spent $1000 just to earn quick in-game cash?  It's your money, yeah, but this is what this company is going for.. shameless to be using this kind of tactic to suck out money from gullible players.

Good for that individual. Someone having $1000 as merely a fraction of their disposable income is no where near "gullible"

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Posted

Good for that individual. Someone having $1000 as merely a fraction of their disposable income is no where near "gullible"

sure, if you say so

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Posted (edited)

I like the system to be honest. I waste too much money on those RNG dyes and get a lot of dyes i will never use... At least i can sell it now so it isn't being wasted.

And only a complete idiot will purposely spam RNG dye boxes for sellable dyes. I opened about 90 dye boxes now since friday, trying to get a full set of pink and purples for my outfits, and only 1 of the useless spare dyes could be sold. Anyone who is willing to throw away cash like that for a petty 5m silver is silly imo

Edited by Casper

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Posted

sure, if you say so

Its not because I say so. Its obvious you don't understand that.

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Posted

Its not because I say so. Its obvious you don't understand that.

if you say so

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Posted

OP 

Is it really that hard to understand that you can buy a shitload of dyes, get the ones that are able to be sold on the marketplace and sell them there for in game silver which then be used to buy end game gear?

Do you think about things before you post stuff?

How do people not see the problem with this? Did it ever occur to them that in korea, at this very moment you can buy an entire outfit and sell it for 20+ milion silver.

Do you understand what inflation that causes to market if all you need to do is buy ONE outfit and sell it for 20+ million silver?

Reason I ask this is because they CLEARLY want to do this and are testing player reactions by doing this bullshit. They are testing the player feedback and response to guage whether or not it is ok to begin allowing all dyes to be sold on the marketplace then they will move costumes and outfits. They want it to be like the Korean model so bad because they will make SHITLOADS of cash from whales by doing it EVEN though they said they've had a strong stance against Play 2 win model like Korea has.

This game is already slowly dying, but if you allow this, it kill the game off entirely for NA/EU audience.

 

1 outfit $30 for 20 mil sounds fair to me. Considering you can grind 20mil in Valencia an hour, do you make $30 an hour?

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Posted

I agree with you on this statement. Since loyalty points are the same for everyone and everyone can buy the same exact amount of dyes since pricing is standard, we can discount them and concentrate on dyes obtained via real cash. Since I can get infinite dyes this way and a free customer cannot, this fits in your definition of p2w.

Except you don't get infinite dyes, you're limited by how much money you are willing to spend. You also can't discount loyalty points as people can CHOOSE to spend them on other things. You can't move the goalposts around until they suit your argument. RNG is also a factor, someone could buy one loyalty dye and get a black one whilst a paying customers could buy $100's worth and not get one.

 

money isn't for lots of people

This is an extremely naive point of view, as money IS limited for lots of people. In fact, a study showed that for most MMO's the average amount spent by a user is around $3. This is due to the fact that whilst there are SOME people who spend over $1k on a game, there are FAR more people who either don't use real money or don't spend large amounts. 

 

as it is basically unlimited for the paying folks 

Except it's not, as the dyes are RNG and people are limited by the fact that they spend a set amount on the game. Are you really under the impression that every whale in this game spends $100,000 or so (since it's unlimited, right?) on the game? Typical QQers making stuff up to give their argument basis.

Here are the facts: 

1) Getting a dye that can be sold in completely RNG

2) Whilst White and Black Dyes are going for 4.5 mil currently, there are MANY dyes that are prices between 300k-1.5mil putting the average price at around 1.4mil per dye

3) Dyes can be acquired by loyalty points

If we take Bheg's gloves as an example of a player buying the best gear (90 mil), and the average silver made by selling dyes as 0.91mil (1.4 x 0.65); then a person would need to sell 100 dyes to get ONE piece of boss gear. 

So no, being able to sell dyes isn't P2W. P2W would be cash shop users not having to deal with RNG or dyes not being accessible to free users through loyalty points. 

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Posted

The definition of p2w sure got broader than when I first started playing mmorpgs. My understanding of pay2win was that if someone could get a significant advantage by paying money that was in no way obtainable without paying money, that was pay2win. Nowadays it seems any advantage is p2w, regardless if the only advantage is saving some time. I've even heard people say having pets is p2w, because looting becomes more efficient, so they get money quicker, so they get good equipment faster. Like holy -----ing hell calm down people, its not a race, its a marathon, you'll get your boss weapons eventually, quit being jealous of the other kids. 

After this thread should be closed :)

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Posted

My future ninja likes this system. Not pay to win if you can still earn decent money in the game to compete with those who purchase dyes to sell other players.

I would like to hear what secret you have that nets you over ten mil in a few minutes. 

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Posted

right now it's IRL MONEY -> INGAME CURRENCY  (does not matter  how high the chance is, how much you get)

 

and that is 100% p2w, doesn't matter how you are talking around it or making it look non p2w

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Posted

Yesterday when I opened my dyes they were worth 1.1M. Was just ingame and they're over 4.9M now, nearing 5.

That's worth around 1.5M more than the coral rings now, so I'd say it's already becoming fairly significant.

Having dyes being able to be sold on the market isn't a terrible thing, but with control over the market prices being in the developer/publisher hands they should exercise that control to cap dyes at a low amount. As in below a million.

Don't make it profitable to do, just make it available to do.

exactly, the dilemma currently is that with the prices going the way they buying and selling dyes from the cash shop could become a viable way to make tons of in game currency, much faster than any other player. if there was a proper cap to how high the value of these wares went it would be a lesser issue, as it doesn't screw over anyone who isn't partaking in it, but as far as we've seen there doesn't seem to be much in the way of limitations for the pricing of these items, heck it seems the reverse by which the pricing is quite lose actually, for I have yet to see any item in the game rise in prices even half as fast as dyes. 

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Posted

before - i would have been well agreed, but - hours can make so much it is not funny 3 pets party on marketplace non stop mail lol 

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Posted

 

This is an extremely naive point of view, as money IS limited for lots of people. In fact, a study showed that for most MMO's the average amount spent by a user is around $3. This is due to the fact that whilst there are SOME people who spend over $1k on a game, there are FAR more people who either don't use real money or don't spend large amounts. 

 

for lots maybe but nor for all and 1k $ is literally nothing even someone who is not rich could pay that, some players spend this per day or week.

also this makes it even more p2w since you're saying not everyone can afford to p2w :)

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Posted

You spent $1000 just to earn quick in-game cash?  It's your money, yeah, but this is what this company is going for.. shameless to be using this kind of tactic to suck out money from gullible players.

Yep! consider me a whale! Why spend 12-18 hours of playing BDO everyday and earn 10-20m silvers when I can get near billions of silvers within 8 hours of work and spend my disposable income money? So it's shameless to have more money than others...or is it more shameless that people don't believe this game is pay to win? If I had another $10k I would get approximately 5 billion silvers.

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Posted

OMFG YOU CAN BUY DYES IN THE GAME NOW THAT IS SO PAY TO WIN.

 

Win what exactly? What is dying your character purple going to win you? The fashion show? A new boyfriend?

 

Oh wait.....its because you get a 1/100 chance to sell that dye for 2 mil silver. Can we just stop with this retarded outrage at something that doesn't have any actual impact on anything at all?

...nothing ppl are -----ing idiots and need something to ----- about or they die

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Posted (edited)

CMs don't care. They know what's up. Jouska is too afraid to bloody post andsneaks around locking threads. Lol just check their profiles. This community (the fanboys) is too dumb to actually see what's going on.

Edited by DarthAznable

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Posted

Yep! consider me a whale! Why spend 12-18 hours of playing BDO everyday and earn 10-20m silvers when I can get near billions of silvers within 8 hours of work and spend my disposable income money? So it's shameless to have more money than others...or is it more shameless that people don't believe this game is pay to win? If I had another $10k I would get approximately 5 billion silvers.

shameless that they'd rather go this route, than actually sell basic dyes for in-game silver. but, i guess, americans lol

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Posted

OMFG YOU CAN BUY DYES IN THE GAME NOW THAT IS SO PAY TO WIN.

 

Win what exactly? What is dying your character purple going to win you? The fashion show? A new boyfriend?

 

Oh wait.....its because you get a 1/100 chance to sell that dye for 2 mil silver. Can we just stop with this retarded outrage at something that doesn't have any actual impact on anything at all?

Another person who's never played KR or RU. I'll be the nice guy and tell you exactly what'll happen.

 

Dyes will become 30mil+ each (50mil+ each for the black/white) within 4 weeks. This means that getting those you'll have an instant 50mil whenever you buy them from the shop.

Let's say there's 10% chance for you to get a proper dye. That'll mean you'll spend 1k pearls and get 30mil for free.

10k pearls would give you 300mil. Considering these numbers you could even take 1% chance and still have P2W as 1k euro's will give you enough money to buy a full set of whateverthe-----youwant.

 

Now tell me exactly, how does that not apply to the pay2win aspect? 

 

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Posted

Most of these P2W moaners are just jealous that people other than them may have something they don't as the P2W moaners do not have any disposable income to spend in the Cash Shop, which irks them so much that others do.

No. Most of us see it as a foreshadowing of the majority of the games population leaving. Much like Trino did to archeage.

I can make generalized statements to though:

Most p2w supporters are lazy no skill players.

Sadly I think they are more upset over the gear they can't get or buy off the market.

All the people I talk to in game with +15 ultimate or boss gear don't really care to much about the dyes being sold on the market place.

It's one thing to be mad about IRL issues but the amount of salt from this one in game issue is just stupid now.

Uhm, Even my alt has a +15 liverto, gear isnt that hard. Especially with guaranteed ultimate now. 

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